To purposely create a child who'll be a minority?

[sweetgo]

Hiya,

Currently looking at sperm donors. I think I've found the right one, he's Korean. I only have a little information on him, but obviously know he is Korean. This isn't a debate on people's views on sperm donors.

Child would be brought up in the UK, if successful obviously, and would be mixed race (1/2 Korean). Therefore, they would be a minority, is it wrong to worry about racism, etc.?? WIBU to purposely go for the Korean donor knowing they could potentially experience racism, etc.?

What kind of monumental arrogance

what kind of monumental arrogance makes you think you are entitled to belittle other peoples thoughts, feelings and experiences on the basis of their colour.

what sort of monumental arrogance makes you so blind to everybody else that you assume every one else is equally blind.

The reason you can't consider that a non white mother or a mother of non white children might find you offensive is because you assume that everyone else is like you, so stuffed full of your own importance, value and sense of victimhood that we can't see when someone else is being belittled, or devalued

What changednamesorry said.

It's not as though learning Korean/visiting Korea/learning about Korean literature and food and history is a penance. You could look at it as a chance to do something different.

Ask the hypothetical question of the child when he or she is a young man or woman and what do you think their answer will be?

How do you think about them being a minority?

Why would you think any differently?

Oh for gods sake. user

Can white people experience racism? Yes. I think the abduction and torture of the white special needs guy in America last week shows that. Screaming fuck the white boy, black power! whilst torturing somebody does kind of show that...
or the (black) couple kicking a white woman lying on the ground whilst screaming something along the lines of not in our hood, white bitch.

So, if you have been the victim of racially motivated things like that? Yes. You have experienced racism. But most white people in a primarily white society have not made these experiences (luckily! I don't want anybody to be assaulted or discriminated against).

But being a minority isn't the same as being a majority. Whether that's because of a disability, sexuality, race, religion...

this does not mean that the opinions of people from the majority don't matter, or that somebody that's in one majority group can't be in an other minority group.
Or that people that have never been in the minority can't empathise.
But can the majority dictate what the minority is allowed to feel offended by? No!

I personally do believe that my experiences with homophobia and sexism do grant me a higher degree of empathy with people from other minority groups or anybody that has experienced an ism.
And who knows, maybe the OP has a lot of experiences with being otherised, stigmatised or people being prejudiced against her. And maybe that's why she made this post. Knowing that whilst she has made many experiences she has not made experiences like that because of her race.

I think that's a credit to her. I'd worry more if she didn't think about these things!

A white person growing up in Korea may make similar experiences of being 'otherised' and feeling different than a Korean person in a primarily white country.

But we are talking about the UK. A country where white people are not a minority.

So, yes. Most white person will not have personally experienced racism the way a black person or an Asian person or a Latino in the U.K. would.

Thought long and hard about this.

I'm not sure I would choose someone from a different race and culture to myself as a sperm donor, no.

If you are the sole parent, plus they might not ever meet their other father (unlike separated parents who generally see both), it would make sense to me that they felt and looked vaguely like that parent. Otherwise they might feel displaced and alienated.

So for me it would be that, rather than them experiencing racism that would worry me.

Disclaimer I am white, have a white partner and white biological children so I have no experience of sperm donorship or mixed race family (though most of my friends do have mixed race families and they have experienced very little if any racism in London where we live).

user
It is clear that you don't know what racism is and the more you ramble on the more ridiculous you look.

Your main argument seems to be parroting my posts back at me in a 'I know you are but what am I' fashion.

Is that really all you got? The same tired old cry of 'racism is just as bad if you are white' You will be complaining that you are not allowed to use the N word even though black people can next. I bet someone called you a honkey last week too.

Oh and FYI it is not racist to assume that someone is white in this context.

But I await your next screeching onslaught with interest.

o here we go again, the trendy, right on myth of "privilege"

Jesus fucking Christ. Post truth people, post truth.

To add slightly to this....my new partner is Japanese and I am pregnant with my second son. So....soon.....I will have 2 sons who look nothing like each other and nothing like me. This is not an issue for anyone in the family.

It does mean that my first son and I have learned a lot about Japan, learnt some japanese, eat japanese food sometimes etc......and that my partner (and subsequently my second son) learn about British and African culture in the same way (not specifying which part of Africa purely to avoid giving get extra personal details!)

We experience a slew of racism.....seriously.......we really do. We all think such people are idiots.....but believe me.......it's rough.

I'm the one who experiences none personal to just me though. Never. About my sons and my partner.....all the time. ("Oh.....he's good looking....I mean for a japanese man"....yes really. "Doesn't he have a tiny penis tho?" .....yes....really.....has been said to me several times. )

Never about me. Never. I'm white you see.

It really isn't a thing white people have to deal with very much if at all.

Those bleating on that they experience racism and are white ......I don't believe you. Sorry.

I'm sorry I haven't read the whole thread but snapcrap sums up my views too.

I am white as is my husband and we have a child through egg donation. I know it's a different situation but the donor was chosen as a physical match to me - height, eye colour, skin tone. This is not because we're going to pretend to our child or anyone else to whom it's relevant that he's my genetic child, but because we want our family to look consistent and not invite questions all the time.

It's interesting that people above have mentioned exploring the donor's culture. Our donor was Polish - should we explore Polish culture on behalf of our son or do people think that only applies when the donor is a different ethnicity? And if not then why not?

You're own racism is probably racism enough for any room you find yourself in bronde.

Your^

Mrs Brown's Boys loving hedge fund manager is taking intersectionality to a whole new level .

Yes, Hopper you probably should explore your son's Polish heritage somewhat. It is a part of him. Don't understand why you wouldn't do so really if you are not planning on hiding it from him that was made via donor sperm.

Sorry ....I wrote "probably should" when I meant "absolutely should"

And also....."we want our family to look consistent "......eek.

That's a bit .......grating.

should we explore Polish culture on behalf of our son or do people think that only applies when the donor is a different ethnicity? And if not then why not?

Why not? It obviously also depends on whether your son has any kind of interest in it. But generally speaking? Of course!

Interesting point hopper. My donor was American with German ancestry. Chosen to match my colouring but we don't have the same heritage. DCs are vaguely attracted to the idea that he's American but only as a way of accessing more Disney and more burgers. They don't want to know about the German bit at all. It's complicated and there's no one size fits all solution. It's also not like having a dual heritage family of known parents nor is it like being adopted.

I am going to the Donor Conception Network annual meeting this year. That's a good forum for this type of discussion. OP have you thought about attending?

Changed - is it sorry. I hope I didn't mean it in whatever way you're thinking. I didn't choose my husband so our family would look consistent (both white). If he was black for example and we needed a sperm donor then I would have looked for a black donor rather than white.

Yes I think maybe we should explore Polish culture. It would be interesting to do so anyway. I have Polish colleagues and mum friends. No one I'm especially close to but some of those relationships can probably be developed.

I don't think my son 'is' Polish though in any way. He is the child of two British patents.

It's interesting to think about. Most of all I want what's best for him.

That's a bit .......grating

Only if you haven't thought at all about being a DC child. It's the standard advice for very good reason. You can make a different decision but as a single parent of a fatherless child you have a very different set of resources at your disposal.

Sorry Hopper is not single so DC is not fatherless. Apologies Hopper. The point remains though. It's not the same as a mixed race child from known parents.

At the moment, it's my DC's choice if they tell people that they're donor conceived. If they looked very different to me, I suspect they'd get asked a lot more frequently. The father is Irish and yes, we do discuss it. Its half their genetic heritage after all.

I think you are overthinking it, but in a way, its a good thing to be overthinking as you are looking to the future of your child.

I dont think that being a minority ethnicity is altogether a bad thing or good thing. Its just who you are. There is a chance that your child may experience racism, but someone up thread worded it perfectly when they said that they can teach their child that racists are ultimately fucking idiots and their options are to be ignored. Its definitely not a reason imo not to have a mixed race child (thats a bit too close to eugenics for me.)

Personally, i dont even understand the cultural aspect. If you are going to be having your child in the UK, then surely the child will be British and brought up accordingly. Im half Scottish and half chinese, but have absolutely no imput from Chinese side of family, have been brought up 100% Scottish. I dont feel like im missing half my heritage or whatever. I was raised Scottish so therefore I am Scottish if that makes sense.

I think the fact that Asian people are obviously nonwhite is why it's important to explore his culture if you do decide to do it. I'm East Asian and I grew up in a 98% white town. I didn't experience overt racism (i.e. slurs to my face) and had great friends I'm still in touch with, but it's also not great being the 'other' either. People just learn to hide their 'funny' racist jokes from you when you're around (for some reason it's incredibly acceptable to joke about East Asians and their nerd stereotypes, weird accents, "Ching chong" language, love for dog meat, "oh your food is so gross, ew what are you eating?"...). Yeah not everyone does it, but I'm sure you can see how growing up in a very white area insulates people from understanding how these 'harmless' jokes can be hurtful. And I know they didn't know any better and were just little, but in first grade for example, some of my classmates pulled their eyes up to imitate my eyes...and yes it's one incident but those incidents and 'funny completely nonracist jokes' repeat themselves, and that kind of shit gets old really fast.

You didn't say this, but I also want to add that it won't matter if he's Korean and not Chinese/Japanese. He will still get to experience the racism against Chinese and Japanese people (in my experience). We're all in it together I guess you could say

Disclaimer: Haven't rtft so not even sure if what I am saying is relevant

I see the point Backingvocals but a question -

does that also apply to adopted children? should people only be adopting kids who are the same colour as them too? and if people are choosing sperm on a genetic basis in terms of making the best decisions for the child - what if the "strongest" sperm on paper was non white (as I am guessing is the case in the OP)

I am not for a moment suggesting you are a racist, by the way Hopper . I'm just saying that my family looks very very inconsistent but its important that that isn't important to us if you see what I mean - as our situation has just sort of happened in that way.