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AIBU?

To ask if this is rape?

163 replies

user1483448360 · 03/01/2017 13:13

Asking because I thought it was but now I'm doubting myself so please be gentle with me.

A man and a woman have known each other for a while and get on well. They have always had a very flirtatious relationship but nothing more has ever come of it than that.

One night they are both flirting with each other and joking around. He leans in to kiss her but she doesn't want to and moves away from him. He then gets pissed off and tells her to stop teasing him. He then holds her down and has sex with her despite her telling him no and to stop it but she can't struggle or fight him off.

I thought this was rape because she said no but she didn't struggle/fight him and she had been flirting with him so now am confused.

Please don't be too harsh with me.

OP posts:

Report

UnbornMortificado · 04/01/2017 00:05

User if you decide to get the thread deleted I wish you all the luck with the court case

You are blameless you did nothing wrong. Please do consider the counselling it might surprise you how much it helps. X

BorrowedHearts · 04/01/2017 00:28

I believe it was rape however I have been known to say no in a flirtatious way and possibly given the flirting beforehand he could have taken it that way, however you didn't want to have sex and did say so which makes it rape. Have you spoken to him since I don't know but maybe ask him about that night and let him know you did not consent and see how he reacts? I'd do this by text or a call rather than face to face.

AVirginLitTheCandle · 04/01/2017 00:31

He's been charged Borrowed. I really don't think contacting him is a good idea.

kel12345 · 04/01/2017 00:40

It is rape unfortunately. I hope it wasn't you op? If so I'm sorry. If not I'm sorry for the person it was.
(I've was sexually assaulted when I was 16 by 3 boys from my school, and I count my lucky stars every day for the woman looking out the window when she did, which probably stopped things going further).

RebelRogue · 04/01/2017 00:42

Borrowed half your post is victim blaming,the other half very unwise.
Besides the legalities and technicalities of texting someone you accused of rape, what should she say? What do you think he would say? Ask the rapist how he thinks/feels about raping you!! FFS I've hear it all!

BorrowedHearts · 04/01/2017 00:42

I didn't see that he had been charged until after I posted, apologies.

BorrowedHearts · 04/01/2017 00:43

I wasn't victim blaming but giving another point of view.

RebelRogue · 04/01/2017 00:46

Your point of view. Which has nothing to do with what happened, op's flirting or her point of view. She has enough doubt and guilt without "well this one time i was playing coy"

BorrowedHearts · 04/01/2017 00:49

It's still another point of view and I'm sure I'm not the first person to say no while flirting 🙄 If you read I have also said that it was definitely rape.

AVirginLitTheCandle · 04/01/2017 01:04

Do you really believe that there is a chance he wasn't aware she wasn't consenting or was somehow confused about it?

The OP told him no but he held her down and did it anyway. She also told him to stop it during the act but he continued on regardless.

How could he possibly believe she was consenting?

RhodaBorrocks · 04/01/2017 01:22

Op it was definitely rape and I'm so sorry this has happened to you.

My rapist was charged, but escaped conviction. What got me through this was knowing that so few rapists get convicted and it's because our legal system has not fully caught up yet and consent is hard to prove. The other thing that got me through was whenever I started worrying, what if I was wrong, what if I led him on etc. was to take a deep breath and say 3 words to myself:

I. Said. No.

Try it. Believe it. You said no. That is the only thing that matters here. You said no. He didn't listen. He is in the wrong. He is a rapist. You said no.

LoupGarou · 04/01/2017 01:57

So, so sorry this happened to you OP and all the others on this thread .

It was rape OP, if you were unsure or said no at any point before or during he should stop, immediately. There is no excuse. It doesn't matter what you said before, whether you flirted, what you agreed on, if any at point you wanted him to stop he should immediately and without complaint.

MiscellaneousAssortment · 04/01/2017 06:43

I'm so sorry OP. Yes it was rape. Yes I also believe you. And I support you in this horrible time too

gamerwidow · 04/01/2017 06:58

OP there is no grey area here, you said no he had sex with you anyway.
Doesn't matter what had happened previously. You could have even initiated sex and then changed your mind and said no and if would still be rape. Be strong we believe you

pklme · 04/01/2017 07:00

Borrowed
Please stop saying no while flirting, if you don't mean it. To those of us who said no and were ignored and over ridden, well, honestly, can you imagine?

sashh · 04/01/2017 07:01

I still don't understand why he did this. I thought he was my friend and he's always been very protective of all the females in his life. That's why I keep thinking it must have been a mistake.

There doesn't need to be a reason why. If there is a why it has nothing to o with you, you are not the 'why'.

A mistake is putting sugar in a drink when someone doesn't want it, a mistake doesn't harm any one.

He is a rapist.

TinyTickler · 04/01/2017 07:03

She doesn't even need say no. This is rape and you should report it.

Truckingalong · 04/01/2017 07:19

She HAS reported it.

Bananabread123 · 04/01/2017 07:38

Borrowed

I really don't know what you think you're adding by your post, other than confusing the OP. You admit she's been raped, yet also appear to be asking the Op to consider if there were mitigating circumstances such as her flirting. How can this possibly be helpful.... ffs, she moved away when he tried to kiss her and held her down after she said 'no'! There's no ambiguity, no confusion, no excuse. She was raped, full stop.

The fact she may have flirted beforehand is as relevant as whether she had cornflakes for breakfast that morning, and to suggest otherwise can only possibly undermine the OPs confidence in her case and is a really, really shitty thing to have done, especially given that the OP has struggled with recognising it as rape because of the prior flirting. Saying your post is just another point of view does not magically make it ok. You should be ashamed of yourself.

OP - So sorry you've been through this. . I admire you for your bravery in reporting this. Stay strong, and please don't try to be swayed by his family or friends if they try to minimise or deny. I'd have as little contact as humanly possible with his family, or those that remain friendly with them, at this time. You need to surround yourself with people who have your back.

Millionsmom · 04/01/2017 08:09

Good grief, it's 2017 and some folk don't 'get' no means NO.

Even if the woman was stark bollock naked with a neon sign pointing to her fanjo saying 'Party Central here' once she said No, he should've gone off for a wank and left her the HELL alone. Any 'life ruining' is all down to him.

OP, you are my hero.
I hope he gets locked up for a long time. But if it goes no further forward, he knows he raped you. You know it, we know it.

and best of luck for the future.

Millionsmom · 04/01/2017 08:13

Borrowed
As the mum of 4 grown up boys, if any of them raped/killed/drunk drived I'd still love him, but I'd report him.
I caught my son stealing from an ice cream van when he was 13, you bet I marched him to the police station.

Why should my child's actions destroy anyone but themselves.

BorrowedHearts · 04/01/2017 22:22

I can imagine as it has happened to me, both in childhood and as an adult. I just know that I have said no without meaning it and was thinking others may have too, but clearly that isn't the case. I apologise to OP and anyone else I may have offended with my comments I meant no harm but clearly what I was saying was misguided, I am sorry I didn't mean to upset anyone especially the OP.

MrsTerryPratchett · 04/01/2017 22:26

If a man thinks a woman could mean yes when she says no from a purely logical POV, think about the consequences. The worst consequence of being wrong and not having sex is; not having sex. The worst consequence of being wrong and still continuing is that he is now a rapist and has traumatised and abused someone.

We really need to stop pretending that men not having sex is as bad a thing as women being raped.

BorrowedHearts · 04/01/2017 23:05

No one is pretending that..

MrsTerryPratchett · 04/01/2017 23:35

Of course they are. All you ever bloody hear is, "what, men have to get a signed consent now?" "What men are expected to..." insert stupid thing. It all boils down to men can't be expected to either wait five minutes for sex or check that they actually have consent.

Ched got off even though he never spoke a word to the girl. Nor she to him. We have to set a higher bar than, 'I wanted a shag and presumed that was OK".

If someone 'flirtatiously said no' to me, I would sodding check. Because it's repulsive and criminal not to.

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