To want dss out

[Phalenopsisgirl]

Bit of a long one sorry, will try to be brief.
Xmas eve dss 23 and his gf decided to 'bake' in the kitchen, this was after a late night blitz style cleaning fest from me the day before so I was less than amused but let it go on the understanding it would get cleaned up. Every excuse was given throughout the afternoon and evening, with various reasons why it would be done 'later'. Ultimately it wasn't cleaned up and I ended up doing on xmas morning. Dh raised the point with him and dss launched into us both complete with 'fuck offs' and a big argument erupted regards to the lack of respect being shown (this has been an ongoing problem, dh and I both at the end of our teather). Dss took himself off for a few days and in the interim sent a torrent of abuse via text which was more awful than the original outburst. Dh didn't want dss back in the house but I maintained that there must be something we have done terribly wrong if this is how dss behaves/feels/thinks is ok. Ultimately dss was allowed back home on the agreement he would keep to the rule of 'our house our rules' but has failed to apologise and has demanded we keep out of his face so as to avoid confrontation. Now he is back he is saying he shouldn't have to take being told to do things like clean his room because he is an adult, the atmosphere in the home is awful. I'm also worried younger dc will be watching and learning from his example. I guess this is more a wwyd as I'm really completely worn down by the whole thing I can't even think straight.

Part of the argument was him telling dh to grow some balls ( and put me in my place) so he obviously has very little respect for me

6 months? Far too generous.

Does he work? Does his GF? What contributions does he give you?

I'd give him a month, but tell him that he is always welcome back (as a family visitor, not a lodger) whenever he wants.

But at 23 he needs to go.

Well clearly he does have somewhere to go, his GF's house.

Get him out, all he is doing is taking the piss. It's his fault for not saving better and having "fun" as you put it.

I went to uni at 18, came home at 21, got a full time job, and started paying back my student debt. Met Dh at 22 and moved in with him at 23. There is no way I would have treated my parent's house like your DSS treats yours. Who the hell does he think he is?

Give him a month to get out. Remove him and GF from holiday.

He's sounding more awful now. It's very hard isn't it to know how to deal with this when your living with it?

Easy to tell you what to do over the Internet.

Has he always been like this?

I know it's about time he grew up, how do you teach that stuff?

By putting him in a situation where he has no choice but to do it. If he cant afford a place of his own he can get a flatshare. I lived with a group of strangers in our early 20s. We were all on minimum wage but between us we could manage rent, bills and a social life. Other 23-year-olds will be far less tolerant of his attitude than you are and he'll have to learn to pull his finger out.

I'm not one to see an abuser hiding under every rock but the behaviour you describe is domestic abuse. It doesn't only apply to partners.

And he wouldn't behave like that at his GF's house. So at least there is somewhere for him to go if he doesn't get a houseshare.

I'm revising my ideas. Give him two weeks.

I suggested he should go out and find a room to rent but Dh is scared this will create lasting anger towards me and in his words we will end up never speaking again, I'm to blame for everything in dss eyes despite dh being the one who didn't want him back

God, he sounds vile, OP. Could you afford to pay the deposit and first month's rent on a room in a shared house for him? Contract in his name, so if he doesn't pay the rent you are not liable, but you can get him set up for a month or two, then it's up to him.

He pays £50 a week for a double room with ensuite! We put this away as way of savings for him

boot firmly on backside in 1 month, but it will be sooner any more shit from you dss, i'd think it but lay it down in a better way than that and stick to it, change locks if need be once he has left.
he sounds angry possibly because of the situation with his mum when younger but that does not excuse his vile behaviour.

Can you not use what you've saved up for him as a deposit on a bedsit/flatshare?

Has he always been like this?

Yes, we just thought he would mature out of it and so took a soft approach, hence why I feel I'm to blame that he hasn't learnt respect. I was the one to encourage we were soft

Let DH deal with it. Get him out within a month- dont pander to finding flats and checking listings and bollocks for him. He is 2-fucking-3. He is acting like a turd.

If he asks yiu why you're doing what you're doing, or whatever, just shrug and say'ask your father' and shut down the conversation.

You do not have to put up with his shit.

No, I wouldn't allow my house to become a "hovel" because an adult chose not to clean up after himself. Yes, the parents have failed him in that at 23, he appears to believe in the Magic Coffee Table. But it's never too late to correct your mistakes. And this one is dead simple - you tell him he has 2 months to move out. If he can't stick to your rules, he can pack his bags and get out tomorrow. Remind him as he is now an adult, you no longer have to wipe his ass or put up with his shite and can chuck him out any time you bloody please.

He does a great divide and conquer between you two - so maybe stop going against your DH and you both stick to whatever plan you agree on?

dh is scared you will never speak again to him ?? i think you have 2 so called man problems here, i think i'd be moving out with the dc and leaving the man children to it, your dp sounds a bit pathetic tbh if he is more worried about his ds than you and your dc.

Anyone who ever said a cross word to their kids runs the risk of said child going no contact, but it's surely a risk worth taking?

Your DH needs to be the one to throw him out, I reckon. He will probably still blame you but meh, never mind. He might grow up and get over it eventually.

I have never charged the older 3 graduate children rent in their 20s living here but every family is different. The girls were doing post graduate law so I was more than happy to support them although I am sure I have done years of additional cleaning as a result but it has paid off. My other son was also basically an au pair to the younger ones so worth having around. He will be moving out in October. We have discussed that. Like all the older ones I've helped them buy a place and he has done that and is letting it out but might go abroad then (he is not a lawyer) so in our case I've given him a perfectly happy deadline (when his brothers go to university this year) and no one is unhappy but he's not nasty though and has no girl friend staying over or otherwise so very different from your issue.

If the step son is in work is it worth if you're not in the SE where it is expensive, your husband helping him with a deposit to buy a small studio flat. Giving him money for that now may avoid inheritance tax later if he were given money when his father dies too so a double benefit and you get him out! Just make sure his girl friend gets no rights to the place and signs a cohabitation agreement first.

He's 23 not 13! He needs to learn what being a grown up is all about instead of being a tantruming baby!

I think it's pretty simple on how to deal with this. Give a deadline to move out, and mean it. But always let dss know he is welcome to visit therefore you aren't completely shutting the door on him but he does need to learn that he can't treat people like he is doing. He won't have any motivation to sort himself while he can do as he pleases and treat you both like shit without any consequences!

Also, pil gave dh and his siblings a deadline to move out of the family home, youngest being 22. They have all managed to live independently because they had to. Dss will sort himself out!

Has he ever lived outside the home? I moved back in with my parents after university and we had a bit of an adjustment period whilst we sorted out expectations etc. which were a bit different to when I lived at home as a child and when I was back from university for holidays. That said, I never behaved like that and can't imagine a scenario where that would ever be okay. If you really want to keep him at home (which I think is very generous after this) I would give everyone space to calm down (a week or two, perhaps) and then have an adult chat about expectations - maybe just him and dh so it doesn't feel like everyone is ganging up on him. At that age he should not need 'rules', he should be grown up enough to realise that he needs to behave in a certain way, otherwise the current living arrangements will not work.

You need to stop dealing with it. He is your DH's son, so it needs to come from him. Especially since he believes that you run the show.

Your DH needs to make it clear that he has until the end of Feb to find somewhere else to live, because his attitude means he is no longer welcome under your roof.

And the only way he will learn to stand on his own two feet is if he has to. Smothering him in love is probably what has made the situation this bad; he's learned that no matter how badly he treats you, he'll get away with it in the end.

He is actually very charming sometimes, especially when he want us to pay for a take away/meal out/ holiday etc. He is actually very charming anytime he doesn't get challenged and we tip toe around you but the moment anyone says anything like 'you need a full time job, or please clean up after yourself' he flips

Him finding his own place is not only the best solution for you, but also for him.

He needs this. His behaviour is absolutely vile and at 23 he's far too old to be acting like such a child.

Be calm and non antagonistic about it, set a realistic deadline (6weeks?), don't give any undue help.

He's an adult, time he started acting like one.