Trying hard not to cry

[BeingMePls]

DD (20) has been really nasty to me for months. Everything that's wrong is totally my fault.

Her dad's birthday was a few days ago and she said she'd take only him, (not the rest of the family) to dinner. She came down from Uni on Friday so decided to take him on Christmas Eve. TBH, I was a bit annoyed as our family never go out separately like that and I thought her little brother would be a bit upset about being excluded too.

DH picked up on me feeling that way and told her that they should rearrange it another evening. She sent me the most vociferous text messages saying I "always ruin stuff for her" and she had only just unblocked me from her phone. She said she knew it would only be a matter of time until she had to block me again (which she has).

To save drip feeding, her dad and I got together really young and he was really awful (abusive) to us both. It's resolved now we're older but I think either she either blames me for sticking it out or thinks she can treat me really badly like he did. She also makes overt effort to call him loads, be super nice to him, ignore me and talk to him only. I've always been there for her, spoilt her, worked hard to give her everything (despite her dad refusing to contribute to bills, tutoring or things for her). I bought her a 2014 car when she passed her test and also paid nearly £1000 in parking fines for her.

It's all I can do to hold back tears, she's so awful and rude to me. I honestly don't know how to fix it. She didn't even buy me a card or present for Christmas despite being happy to take all the things I had for her.

I don't want to freeze her out but I don't want her to think she can treat me like that either.

Wwyd?

Mindtrope, do you think you are possibly projecting your circs growing up onto OP? Angry at the mother that 'allowed' her child to be in an abusive home, just as your mother did to you? Have you forgiven your mother?

Yellow and real people do their best. Sometimes they get right and sometimes they get wrong.
And sometimes they just cannot protect their own children from harm.

Life is never as easy as 'good mothers parents protect their dcs'

I'm sorry to see that you are getting a bit of a kicking on here, op. For what it's worth I don't think you deserve it.

Your attitude towards your dh seems odd, though. You seem to have taken all the blame on yourself for some reason... you haven't explained what he has done to help and support you through all of this, even though the original problems seem to have been caused by him. Do you think - as another poster has stated - that she blames you for not leaving him?

Hi.
I'm not one for posting on these topics but it struck a chord with me. I have read the thread and there are a couple of questions not asked/answered.

Has your husband ever apologised to you and you daughter about his previous behaviour? Does he seem apologetic/horrified by it?
How is he now? Does he even know it was abuse? Or is he oblivious?
Has he ever talked to her about it? What does he have to say about her actions/behaviour and does he understand it could also be relevant to his past actions?
What about the Christmas present or paying off her fines etc? Does he just accept this as well?

What is Dh doing to fix things? Did he at least pull her up about buying gifts for everyone but you? I've read the whole thread and its been asked a few times but not answered which makes me wonder if he's not backing you up and if not why no Time?

I'm actually wondering if hasn't changed his spots and if the reason he's changed his because he can use dd to hurt you now, while looking all sweet and innocent and taking credit for growing up.

i know you've acknowledged the past and understand its playing a part in DDs behaviour, and I think you've had great advice on how to change some things, but my worry is it will all be futile if dh isn't also acknowledging that her attitude towards you is rooted in his abusing you and his daughter and him trying to fix your relationship too. If he has changed and is truly sorry he would be feeling as shitty as you are right now, and working with you and dd in some way to fix and resolve the damage he caused by being an abuser. Instead it sounds like he's on the sidelines enjoying a close and happy relationship with her, while watching her struggle with you, watching you both be hurt and knowing it's likely because of his behaviour in the past.

Does he blame you for things to dd? Like "I'd love to come for dinner with you in Xmas eve but your mum doesn't want me to"

Have you ever spoke as a family about the abuse? Has he ever spoken to her about it? If not, why not?

I hope I'm way off but I'm thinking he didn't make an actual choice to change, his history of abusing you is the big elephant in the room that nobody talks about now because on the surface he's changed, or he has rewritten history and told her a version of events that paints you in a bad way, called you controlling as he couldn't go out which caused fights, he didn't help with baby as you'd tell him he did everything wrong etc, and you and dd being on non speaking terms benefits him because it actually stops you talking to each other about the shitty things he did and any different versions he has given her, then he doesn't have answer awkward questions from dd, then she won't turn her anger and resentment to him, and he gets to manipulate her too.

A loving husband and a loving Dad would be equally upset seeing his dd so angry with her mum/his wife and the impact it's having that he'd be working through solutions with wife and daughter and helping them build bridges. That's without the Dad being an abuser to them in the past.

I. Sorry it's prob not what you want to hear OP, and I hope I'm way off and totally wrong, but it sounds like he hasn't changed much, he's just being manipulative in a different way.

IT took me so long to write that that I've cross posted

What makes you think that you have cross-posted just ? Where has the op answered any of your - very valid - questions?

Just and Sparkle. I don't think apologised outright in the way that you mean. I'm not sure he remembers it in the same way but I've been quite vocal recently about "not being the same weak, desperate kid he first got together with". I have money and am much more secure now so know I could walk if I wanted to.

Even though he hasn't behaved badly in years, I have recently felt quite protective of the young woman that I was. It's easy to say I should have left, and I should have but being a young mum I didn't want to look like a failure and people saying I told you so. In hindsight, I am very much aware it's was a misjudged and poor decision.

I don't know if he's apologised to DD ever.

Btw. I have made a massive assumption that this all has been the root of her bad behaviour. She's never said she was angry about it (also accept she might not for whatever the reason).

Mindtrope- given your position that is so the OP's fault, could you offer some suggestions as to how she can help her daughter now? Otherwise it gives then impression, to me at least, that her daughter's ongoing emotional distress is a punishment that she should just accept rather than try to address?

I'd not be suprised if he remembered it in the say, but that he doesn't think it was abuse. I do think he needs to acknowledge out loud to you what he did. I know you say to him that you're not the same weak kid, but that's not the same has him acknowleding it himself and saying sorry. I guess he's never asked you back then what you needed him to do to show he's changed?

I bet you've spent many nights crying over the years, worrying about your dd loving you, has he? If you both haven't had an honest conversation with naming it as abuse, then you can't have discussed the possibility that his actions in the past may be a big factor? are you reluctant to raise it because he will say you are exaggerating, or that the past is in the past, and make it feel you're being daft? Has he spent many nights crying over his impact on DDs behaviour? Has he wrestled with guilt over the bad choices he made? It doesn't sound like it :(

It may not be why your dd is angry towards you, but even if it's not I do think it's something you need to work through. I'm genuinely suprised that your dh isn't comforting you and making suggestions and if he doesn't think his behaviour in the past has anything to with dd today, isn't he concerned about why she seems angry to only you?

I'm going to assume he's said nothing about her treatment of you, that he's said nothing about the buying everyone but you gifts, that's he's happy for you to carry all the blame, that's he's not going to say I'm her oarent and half responsible, that he's watching you tying yourself into knots, wrestling with guilt, paying her fines, crying etc etc because all you want is for her to love you and treat you properly, just like you did for him when he was 17 because you wanted him to love you and treat you right. Does that sound like a man who loves and respects his wife? I'd put money I'm him wimping out saying "I don't want to take sides"

I wish I could give you a hug, I really do, you blame yourself for your bad choices, but two parents were involved and while you chose to stay, he chose to abuse. Even if it's not the reason dd is treating you this way, it's the reason you're putting up with it and it's the reason he is doing fuck all to help. I'm sorry.

Good post Just.

Just. Thank you for what you've said. He thinks he sided with me by not going to the dinner but failed to realise that it just made things worse. He thinks this is the usual mum and daughter bickering - we're both really strong headed so there is history. Recently though it has changed to be quite hurtful and personal (from her side).

He said to me this evening that tbh the dinner invitation is no different to me taking her alone to spa days - which I guess is kind of true? He already told me not to pay for her fines and I went and did it anyway as I didn't want to screw my mum over or for my daughters credit to be ruined. That was my decision to make and as someone said up thread I then can't pull the martyr card (which I don't think I did, just thought she'd be a bit grateful).

And Just. I'll take the hug. Thank you 💐

I see that you are still minimising/ignoring/glossing over his behaviour op. What has he really done to support you and apologize for what he did?

Get your head out of the sand - you won't sort this out until you do.

Yes I think I agree, I think you need to go back to the beginning and start again with your husband. I think you should tell him that you think your dds problems stem from being emotionally abused as a child, by him, and witnessing him emotionally abuse you. I don't think you've said whether or not you both fought and argued? I assume it was rather one sided. Then perhaps he will understand and you can then present to your dd as a united front.

She's justkeeping herself safe the way she's always had to op.

Cosy up to and idolise the bully, desperately try to gather their approval.

Also pick on the weaker person that the bully has singled out, to earn extra brownie points and hopefully keep yourself out of harms way.

And your still with him. She had that in her whole life. You've just managed to successfully bury your head in the sand.

She has a right to be angry.

If he'd said "yes a meal with you would be great, but Xmas eve is tricky, everyone looks forward to spending the day together like we usually do, why don't you come over Xmas eve, and we'll go for dinner the day before/after" and her response is to tell him he's ruined Xmas, that she's blocked him and then gives you all gifts except him. Would he be angry and hurt? Or think it's normal father Daughter stuff? Would he be ok for you not to challenge it?

Him saying the meal is the same as you spending time with her is a bit different as you won't be doing it on a day that's typically spent doing something else, and he probably knew that declining and saying you were not happy would make it worse.

Telling you not to pay her tickets again he knows would make her worse both in her immediate reaction and also further down the line when she can blame you for not being able to get credit for a mortgage or whatever.

Might be worth having a think about why he seems to advise or handle things in a way that makes your Daughter more angry with you?

Non of things are supporting you, or solutions to help you all, and addresses non of the issues he's helped create.

He could tell he thinks that she should be paying them herself, and he thinks it's not fair on you, that he thinks any damage to credit ratings and inability to get mortgage in future as a result will not be your fault but her own.

I don't think you should be paying her fines, but do understand why you are. The same reasons you'll have tiptoed round him years ago and did whatever so to minimise his meanness to you. Yes you're choosing to pay them, but it's a choice between paying and getting some shit from her, and not laying and getting loads of shit. Made worse by a husband who isn't offering any support or backing you up.

I hope you don't feel like I'm getting at you OP, I'm not, I just think your husbands actions from the past play a big part, but also his actions (or lack of) now are contributing a lot now too.

I too wanted to join the voices saying that you still need to do some unraveling of what happened and therefore what's happening now... and work on your own emotional health.

There are a few abuser-victim type dynamics going on, and the only thing you can change is your reactions to things, so better to work on making the situation better for you, and hopefully seeing a change through that. And I do mean genuinely better for you rather than bearing the brunt of other people's emotional state, and being the one that's forced into the self sacrificial role where you decide to suffer the consequences of someone's actions so they don't have to feel any consequences themselves.

I do have sympathy with your DD as I have that same burning rage directed at my mother that makes any interaction tense and horrible, as TBH, any interaction is too much interaction for me. However, that's because my mother both failed to protect us as children but also was the perpetrator of terrible damage, though she continues to pretend otherwise. So, I get how bad this type of situation is where one person is screaming with rage and fear inside, which trickles out into every word and deed. I hate myself for being like that though, and feel utterly trapped into a situation where I can't 'be ok' at least on the surface. I only do this when I'm trapped in a very upsetting situation where the old shackles are being forced on me again and yet I cannot take it anymore, so I hit out and feel pretty damn explosive because I'm backed into a corner. I in no way justify being consistently nasty to another family member... which is rather confusing considering my own personal situation. However, that's MY specific situation, and not yours or your dds. Which is something some other posters might do well to remember...

I'll throw in the thought that your DD may not be in full control of the way she's behaving though, (not as an excuse for her behavior though). She may find it very hard to be polite if there's a big gaping hole of unresolved blame & fear going on that she can't overcome at the moment... but also I'd say that does NOT mean you should sit there and take it, OR that she's hitting out at the right person.

Protecting yourself sends the right message, not one of anger or retaliation but one of self respect and refusal to step into the role laid out for you.

Good luck, and please ignore posts that appear to be projecting their own rage onto you.

The thing is that it shouldn't need to be about you. You say your DH "Picked up on your feeling" and that's why he told DD to change the day. But that's not right. Didn't he have the feeling that Christmas Eve was a whole-family day himself? Why did he make it about you? If he felt that Christmas Eve was a family day then he could have offered to pay for you and DS to come along while DD paid for his part of the treat, or he could have put it off; but either way he could have made it very clear that he was doing it because he wanted to spend Christmas Eve with DS and you. Or if he was happy to go out with just her on Christmas Eve (just as you and she went off for spa days) but he was concerned about DS and your feelings, then he could simply have told DD that he needed to discuss it with you first. That's what grown ups do. Instead it sounds as if he made the decision without consulting you first, and then put responsibility for it on your shoulders.

You can't fix the card and present for Christmas problem because that is your DH's job. He is her father and your husband. It is his job to talk to his daughter, to make it clear that he values presents from her a lot less when they are not shared with you. If it didn't occur to him to stand up for you over that, well, that means the problem isn't just your DD. It's also your DH, still, even after all this time. Maybe he is even getting satisfaction from having the two of you fight for his attention.

As for the parking fines - why would your mother be screwed over? Is she senile? If not then it would be her choice either to pay the fines or not. Your mother decided to take your DD in and that decision has consequences. You are not treating your mother like an adult but like another child who has to be protected from her own decisions.

So don't take it all on yourself. You might be one part of the problem but you are certainly not all of the problem. It does seem to be easier for you to roll over and take all the blame than to set boundaries and decide what you will not put up with. But it really isn't just you - there is a dynamic going on between your mother and daughter, and between your husband and daughter too. I agree with the people who have said some counselling for you could help a lot. So that you can set boundaries and decide what you can change and what you can't, and where you need to put yourself first. And when to leave other people to get on with it and make their own mistakes.

I've only read about half the thread (sorry), but just had to offer you a virtual hug, OP.
Leaving aside the issues with DH, apparently girls don't really appreciate their Mums until they are about 27! (According to some study I once read about). I truly appreciated my Mum when I had my own children.
Hang in there and I think it will get better

Op, what you are doing is amazing. You are taking a long look at yourself, and seeing where you trip yourself up, and you want to take steps change it. This is how people heal, psychologically and emotionally. When you learn to see your patterns, put boundaries in place, and say enough is enough (to anything in your behaviour, or that of others that you can see is out of balance), you will see big changes in your life.
The key is to be loving dyo when you say " I'm to blame " or "it's my fault" that's not helpful. It's enough to know that all actions have conseques, so to end up in a different place, take different actions.
And yes, as others have said, a therapist would help guide you through all this.
I also like how you have stood up to the bullying posts on here.
You can do this. All the best with it.

The "abuse" might be a red herring. You have not said much about what it was. was he violent to you and your dd or just selfish and not involved?While neither is good, one is far worse than the other and the dd might not have picked up on selfish behaviour, staying out all night etc. Perhaps your dds behaviour is because you are getting too involved and not giving her enough space. Do you try to control too much, perhaps as a way of compensating for what you have described as a less than ideal household? You also sound a bit needy - do you cry a lot in front of your daughter? - you hinted at that above. If so, you should stop letting yourself get so involved - you might be making your dd feel guilty for hurting you and then she gets angry that you have made her feel guilty or she might just think you are being silly and over dramatic.. Agree anyway you should take a step back and let your daughter come to you when she is ready. I also think you should ask her direct, why no present for you and tell her that that is not kind but don't show emotion. Then step well back.

You said your daughter text you saying you ruined the Christmas Eve meal with her father, does it not seem obvious that he must have told her it was down to you he cancelled it? It also seems like she's taking the piss massively, she knows you'll give her whatever she wants and pay for whatever she wants regardless of her behaviour which is completely unfair. She already acts like she hates you , which I'm sure she doesn't she just seems to be lashing out at you for attention but I would seriously suggest cutting back the spending. Still give her the essentials but not the expensive coats or the tickets, treat her like an adult get her to sort her own car insurance. If she questions why you've backed off just make a small comment along the lines of 'I don't want to get it wrong again' something she can't throw back in your face. And have a word with your husband it seriously sounds like he's stirring.

“It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; Roosevelt

Hi Trishan. I don't think I'm suffocating just perhaps I'm known as the one in the family who's pragmatic and gets things done. Hence leaned on to do just that. If anyone asks for something it gets done immediately.

I did suggest the dinner should just be rearranged post Christmas not that it should be cancelled entirely, but she wanted to do it on that day only. To be fair was arranged week before, my husband was just dumb and didn't work out it was Christmas Eve. I did take DS to my mums for dinner so she could take him, but I'd obviously ruined the plans by then.