To not want to move to DH's home country?

[fannysatdawn]

We have 3DC, 10mo, 2 and 3. DH and I met and married in the U.K but he is originally from Egypt. The situation in Egypt was always very problematic (from 2011) and is not ideal now either for a family as a preference over England. We always agreed that if the situation improves we may consider having a house there when we retire. At the moment we go there 4 times a year for about 2 weeks to a month each time.

DH has suddenly decided he wants to move there now. He says he is having an identity crisis, feels separated from his homeland and he wants his children to feel they have Egyptian heritage.

This could not have come at a worse time for me. I have had severe PND since the birth of 3rd DC, I am in the wilderness of hormones and lack of adult company (I am a full time SAHM) and I too am having an identity crisis and DH fails to see that, just because it's not cultural or patriotic, it is the full time being a mum cliche.

My parents are very close to the DC as we live in England, they are a total saving grace for me because they offer me a lot of support where DH doesn't. DH feels that his parents do not get enough time with the DC (even though we spend about 4 -5 months a year with them.)

I am very torn because I believe in equality and treating both cultures the same and allowing them equal influence and weight in the DC's lives. But I feel I have already bent over backwards to accommodate DH's wishes. Eg we always holiday in Egypt and never go to any other country. All our free time is spent in Egypt. We are teaching the DC Arabic as well as English and I am learning Arabic. I have told DH's parents our house is an open house to them, even though they are not particularly nice to me and have made it clear they are angry DH married outside of his culture.

I asked DH if I refused whether it would be a deal breaker. He said it wouldn't end our marriage but he would feel that I would have "deprived our family of an experience essential to our health, growth and happiness." Which is basically opening things up to lay blame at my door for anything that might go wrong in the future.

What do you think?

Echoing everyone here.

DO NOT GO

In fact I wouldn't even go on holiday there anymore.

Dh & my parents are from a Mediterranean country & even we wouldn't live there because we'd have to adapt too much & that's with knowing the language & culture.

Another one saying don't go.

I lived in Egypt for three years (expat teacher) and we left because politically it was very unstable and there were a lot of interruptions to our daily life.
I have two expat friends who are married to Egyptians and they both have problems with MILs.
Also, have you thought about schooling? International schools are very expensive and local schools are terrible from what I hear.
Please think carefully before you go for a holiday again. As pps have said, there would be lots of issues if you were to separate from your husband.
Good luck with your decision.

I doubt very much that the OP's husband will be interested in paying fees for a decent international school, unless he is from a very wealthy professional family.

I imagine part of the attraction of going home will be the chance to make sure his children grow up totally immersed in his own culture without the pesky influence of non-Muslim foreigners and their silly ideas about equal rights for women, freedom of speech and secular living. If he cared at all about those things for his wife and his daughters he'd stay in the UK where his children can be educated perfectly well for nothing.

Amazing replies, thank you. Some stuff here I hadn't even thought about but has scared the bejesus out of me.

I wish I had, had mumsnet years ago when we were first married so I could see some of these red flags.

Definitely not going now. Even if it means the end of my marriage.

Thank God for that. Please don't allow your mind to be changed.

And even if you trust your DH and cannot conceive of a situation where he might try to trick you or to take your children to Egypt without you and refuse to return them, HIDE THEIR AND YOUR PASSPORTS. Give them to your parents for safekeeping. And if you agree to go to Egypt again soon (I wouldn't, under the circumstances, but if you do) then make sure YOU have the passports on you at all times. And check on your rights once you are there about wanting to come home WITH your children in the event that he refuses to come home with you.

If it looks likely that he would be able to refuse you the right to leave, or refuse to agree to allow the children to leave, then DO NOT GO. Not even for a holiday. If his parents want to see the children they know where they are.

I don't mean check on your rights once you are there, I mean check on your rights BEFORE YOU GO about what might happen once you are there!

Am I the only one concerned about OP going for their next 'Holiday'?

I nknow you've not mentioned it but if there are plans for a Holiday of a month to Egypt any time soon, don't tale your eyes off ypour passport OP.

If oh can work out there or is wealthy enough to have 4 months off work a year then can he not go alone and ypou stay here? Then he cpoikd pop here for the same amount as you pop there?

My dh is also Egyptian, we have been married for almost 20 years and have 2 children aged 12 and 10.
When my eldest was a baby we nearly made the move, even had the house up for sale. In hindsight I'm glad we didn't as Egypt is so unstable now, also your children's life chances will not be anywhere near as good as they are here.
Does your dh come from a city or rural Area op? Also how long has he been in the UK and does he have many Egyptian friends? Pm me of you like.

Do your children have Egyptian passports also?

I also say "don't go"

I get your DH feels sensitive though. Since the Brexit vote there has been a tide of anti-immigrant sentiment.

As an immigrant I feel a lot less welcome and have been contemplating the possibility of moving away from here for the first time in years...

It's quite a weird feeling being an immigrant in the UK these days.

I was in a similar situation, made the move (not Egypt but near there) lots of people quoted the book/film Not without my daughter took some getting used to but really enjoyed it. My dh on the other hand couldn't stand it and wanted back to the easy life in UK within a few months. He was shocked at how expensive life was, hated interference from family etc. I insisted we stay until children finished school year, which we did, but he was the first in the boarding queue and now doesn't even want to go back to visit.

There is an awful lot of scaremongering going on here regarding visiting, if you have any inclination that he may do something stupid then have the number of British embassy handy and they can have you out within the day.

It's not scaremongering woes it's just asking the OP to be sensible, cautious and realistic. However much she trusts her DH she would be utterly stupid to not take sensible precautions under the current circumstances. She stands to lose much more than just her marriage if it turns out her trust has been misplaced.

No, not scare mongering.
In any decision you have to consider the best and worse scenario. The worse case scenario could be terrible here.

Being cautious and sensible, absolutely, but many posters are advising the OP never to visit again.

I'm sorry you're going through pnd op
As the others have already said, please don't go. Your husband isn't even supporting you now, I can imagine how much worse it's going go be on that side and then stuck with his family who don't like you.
It's a backward place as well, your D.C. Won't thrive there. Please stay here with your support network, even if it means ending your marriage.

Thinking carefully about future visits isn't scaremongering, it's sound advice. Especially if OP does have 'any idea that he might do something silly'.

When visiting Egypt, if her DH decides to stay and not let DC leave the country, OP won't be able to take them out of the country. This is faft, not scaremongering.

This sort of thing is something people in multicultural marriages have to think about, especially when one has said he wants to move back to his native country.

OP - I don't know what sort of (written) assurances you would need to avoid this fate, but it might be worth talking to a lawyer knowledgeable about international custody issues before your next visit to Egypt, if you decide to go at all.

This is fact, rather. Not sure what 'faft' is

Although I would like to point out to MagicChicken that Egypt is not 'a shithole'. A bit scruffy round the edges, sure, but it's a fascinating & beautiful country.

My dc & I love living in Cairo & have an excellent standard of life - admittedly we live in our very naice expat bubble, but we've travelled around & seen a lot of Egypt.

I still would run a mile in OP's position, though .

Woesiswonderland
Your situation was rather different.
If the OP finds her position untenable living in Egypt, how much can the British embassy help?
The husband and his parents will tell the local police that this crazy foreign woman is trying to steal the children away from their established family home. The children may be spirited away to relatives. Can the OP afford to live independently in Egypt while pursuing a long and probably fruitless legal case held in a language she may not fully understand?

No no no

I'm no expert on British embassies, but I can't help wondering how easily they could get OP and the children out of Egypt if the worst happened? Could they really be removed quickly, or would the whole thing get bogged down in "international negotiations" while OP lived in fear?

It's perhaps not right to say "never go there with him again", but I certainly wouldn't travel until I'd taken some very good advice ... and even then, would Egyptian officials necessarily respect our own legal code?