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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think the nursery manager was right?

244 replies

user1478265589 · 14/12/2016 10:22

My friend works in a nursery. Last week just before 8.30am (a busy time for them and they were short-staffed as two nursery nurses were late) an unknown woman bashed on the door, and when the manager answered, said she needed to use their toilet. She was insistent and emotional, said she had Crohn's and had the right to come in as she was registered disabled. Nursery manager said no and directed her to the public loos about 3 mins away. Woman then soiled herself, and asked to come in to clean herself up. Again, manager said no.

Since then, this has massively kicked off on Facebook, with the nursery and manager 'named and shamed,' the woman has said she'll report the nursery to Ofsted and the police and there's nasty posts all over the nursery's FB page. Staff are worried the nursery will be shut down; manager is very upset at the vitriol and insults being aimed at her.

AIBU to think the nursery manager didn't do anything wrong?

OP posts:
LittleBusses · 14/12/2016 13:06

I would think it's a safeguarding issue if the children's toilets are not separate from adult ones. (Unless I'm misunderstanding the set up).

Tomorrowillbeachicken · 14/12/2016 13:06

I think what she's done after says a lot about her character

stella23 · 14/12/2016 13:08

I'm a nursery manager, and she did exactly the right thing, ofsted would also agree, if you pm huge Nursery name I'll write a nice post to support her choice

Miserylovescompany2 · 14/12/2016 13:08

I sympathise completely with the lady concerns. It's an awful degrading/humiliating thing to happen.

But, and it's a HUGE BUT, this woman might not have been someone in desperate need of a toilet? She could of had a serious mental health condition and been capable of anything?

It's the job of the manager/safe to ensure the safety of all in their care. That's why the majority of nurseries are fitted with locked doors that have intercom systems.

I think those posting outrageous comments on FB would be ever more outraged if harm had come to the children within that nursery?

MrsFozziwig · 14/12/2016 13:12

Misery I think those posting outrageous comments on FB would have been posting outrageous comments whatever the nurser had decided.

There are some people (the sort of people who get involved in these things on FB for a start) who are just spoiling for a fight and would have criticised the manager whatever decision she made.

The moment that woman banged on the door the manager had lost.

Aki23 · 14/12/2016 13:12

Manager was right. Her priority is to protect the children. Would you publically show your support?

Awwlookatmybabyspider · 14/12/2016 13:12

Im hoping the nursery manager sees this thread, so She knows people are behind her

Soubriquet · 14/12/2016 13:13

Yes!

If you can't link the nursery, what about sending the manager this thread privately so she knows she has done the right thing

StatisticallyChallenged · 14/12/2016 13:14

Depends re toilets, ideally they should be separate but it's not always possible especially in older buildings. Or there might be a separate staff loo which is tucked away in a random corridor or even basement. Probably depends where you are but around here there's very limited building space and a lack of appropriate premises, plus lots of listed buildings. The Care Inspectorate tend to take quite a pragmatic view IME, cos otherwise there would be a very big shortage.

Indrid · 14/12/2016 13:15

People with mental health problems are much more likely to be a victim than to victimise others.

I agree the manager was correct but let's not add to the ignorance

MollyHuaCha · 14/12/2016 13:16

I don't do facebook, so I've no idea what the woman has posted. But in this thread there are so many people running the woman down, I find it scary. She has Crohn's and simply could not wait another moment to find a toilet. As for doing a country poo - no! Not only is that disgusting and illegal, the woman had diarrhea. Non-infectious. You cannot catch Crohn's. I doubt she stood at the door "arguing" - she surely was pleading desperately, knowing she cd not possibly walk to the toilet 3 mins away. Standing there squeezing her buttocks together, in the knowledge that a toilet was there and she could not get to it. Whether or not the nursery staff were right, I do think that we live in a very very sad society in 2016 UK when a person has to suffer the indignity of soiling herself because she's not allowed to use a toilet.

HOHOHOvariesBeforeBrovaries · 14/12/2016 13:18

Molly there was a garage across the road, she could have asked to use the toilets there.

glitterazi · 14/12/2016 13:19

Whether or not the nursery staff were right, I do think that we live in a very very sad society in 2016 UK when a person has to suffer the indignity of soiling herself because she's not allowed to use a toilet.

It's a sad state of affairs, yes. Absolutely right that she wasn't allowed in though.
She was more than likely in dire need but the children's safety comes first.
Ever since the Dunblane massacre there's tight laws on this thing now. You can't just walk round schools or demand to be let in.

monkeywithacowface · 14/12/2016 13:21

Itsmine I've already said several times that the woman is wrong for what she is doing to the nursery and manager. What I meant was it's not helpful or fair for people to start suggesting that the woman could have "easily" made it to another toilet if she hadn't wasted time.

JohnnyMcGrathSaysFuckOff · 14/12/2016 13:25

Would love to know where all these nurseries are where you can walk in off the street.

DD is at a fairly average nursery. We had to make an appointment to view the place whilst I was pg, and bring ID. Actually I needed a wee whilst we were there and was told no as the loos on that floor were only for children. Fair enough.

No one is allowed in except staff and carers. I see deliveries being made in the morning and they are either dropped at the front door, or the delivery man is escorted round the back through a key-code gate and drops the stuff in a sheltered area they have. He doesn't go into the actual nursery building at any time.

Anyone who is not a parent picking up the children needs a password and ID and I have to have informed the nursery in advance that that person will be picking up DD on that day. Like, DMIL cannot just decide to rock up one day with no notice, even though they 'know' her and she has picked up DD plenty of times before.

I thought all that was pretty standard.........

itsmine · 14/12/2016 13:32

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

VoodooPeople · 14/12/2016 13:34

I do feel sorry for the woman having to soil herself, but slagging the nursery off has lost her most of my sympathy.

As has been said, the nursery's duty of care is towards the children they are looking after, not a stranger knocking at their door wanting to use the loo. I'm not sure where the toilets are positioned inside the school but it sounds as if she might not have made it to them anyway.

There was no way of staff knowing if this was someone in genuine need or an estranged parent (for example) trying to gain access to the nursery. That might sound OTT but people have mentioned how easy it is to buy the Crohns card and radar keys so technically they prove nothing. The disabled badge is a red herring.

IMO the nursery manager did the right thing to ensure the safety of the children in their care.

BikeRunSki · 14/12/2016 13:35

The nursery did exactly the right thing. At the children my children attended (youngest left in August this year), not even parents were allowed to use the toilets, as staff and children's toilets were in the same place.

Sara107 · 14/12/2016 13:39

I would imagine all nurseries, and schools too have a policy of not allowing in strangers - they have to completely control both who is going in and who is going out. At dds nursery primary school the set-up is similar, only known people are let in and you have to authorise anybody else to take your children out. The school also have procedures in place to lock down any individual room in the school. These security measures are in place because of events like the Dunblane massacre. Luckily a rare occurrence in this country, but still, it happened once and happens in other countries too. All the day-in day-out following of procedures is completely pointless if you then make an exception for whatever reason.

brownpurse · 14/12/2016 13:42

For a crohns sufferer three minutes away might as well be three hours. I imagine she jumped out of the car saw the nearest likely place and went for it. When she was refused entry she would have known that she couldn't make it to anywhere else. I can't understand her wanting to bring this to the worlds attention and the nursery manager was well within her rights to refuse entry .I feel real compassion for her and sad that we live in a world where we have to be so suspicious of each other.

alotlikeChristmas16 · 14/12/2016 13:42

if i heard a local nursery had refused a stranger access, I'd be more likely to use them as they showed good judgment imo. We do live in a world where random atrocities happen and all children should be the safest they can be. I feel sad for the lady concerned but what she did after is not at all nice.

LittleBusses · 14/12/2016 13:44

Who has 'slagged' the nursery off?

Soubriquet · 14/12/2016 13:46

The OP has said that the FB reviews have

Gileswithachainsaw · 14/12/2016 13:55

How many people would have let her into their house?

How many people would have not been in trouble when they spent the morning cleaning the toilet instead of at their post doing their job?

How many people would allow use if the private staff toilet? Because that's what it would have been. Not a public toilet but one which the staff have to use.

How many people would really change their luck on a complete stranger cos whatever she has that's wrong with her she was still a member of the public. And the public do often- lie
-steal
Partake in illegal drugs use

In the toilets.
- leave the mess fir others
To clear up.

It's very easy to start having a go when it's other people apparently being "mean"

However I bet no one would have really let her into their home.

Original poster
user1478265589 · 14/12/2016 13:58

The woman posted on a local community/selling page which is where most of the vitriol was, but also on the nursery's FB page, giving it a 1* rating and ending with 'I hope you never have a situation where you need to use your judgement as I fear it is lacking when under pressure.'

Other people also posted on the nursery page after reading the post on the community group, saying they were 'disgusted,' 'horrified,' 'shocked and saddened,' 'wouldn't leave a dog in your care, let alone a child' 'you should be ashamed of yourself' 'this establishment has zero empathy for human beings' etc etc

OP posts: