School: "no babies allowed"

[Lardeedar]

My DD's primary school insists that for all school meetings, nativity plays and parents evenings, no babies or toddlers are allowed to come. I have a toddler that I look after at home, and I'm perfectly capable of keeping him quiet (phone, iPad and lollipops given rarely enough to be novel seems to work) or failing that, I have curtesy and common sense enough to remove him from the location if he does decide to pipe up!

The school just assumes I have a nan up the road on hand to babysit whenever I want but I don't. These meetings or plays are always 2-3. Both my parents are working, as are my siblings and friends, they have jobs and the two that don't have their own kids and school runs preventing them from helping out.

I'm expecting my third child now and am really upset about all the plays and meetings I'll have to miss because they won't let me in with my newborn. Even if I did have available childcare I resent being obliged to leave my (probably breastfed) newborn for any amount of time for such a stupid policy. Is this normal? Are all schools like this??

Sorry for typos. Fat, stubby fingers and new phone. I'm not thick - honest!! 😂

Our PTA holds discos every term. Over the last couple of years, they have been ruined by parents who think it's an occasion to bring younger siblings. Therefore you have toddlers running across dance floor and dozens of pushchairs around doorways, which is a flipping fire hazard. The PTA have been unable to control it. These parents don't even buy a ticket for the siblings.

Microphones for those who are performing, to be heard, would help obviously. But that still won't excuse the behaviour of parents who sit there and allow their children to disrupt a school concert performed by CHILDREN. It doesn't only apply to Primary School concerts - Believe me! There is no justification, whatsoever, for ineffectual parenting - at the expense of others.

The children haven't put in weeks of practise for some screaming, whinging brat to be heard above them. And nobody, but nobody wants to take time off work and buy a ticket to listen to someone else's baby screaming for an hour or so.

If parents cannot parent properly then this is the result. As usual the minority have spoilt it for those who are able to parent properly. Saying that, when my eldest children were in Primary School - they are in their 20's now, there wasn't a problem with younger siblings. Any nonsense the parent was told to leave. Lately the noise levels at my 9 year old twins Primary School concerts is unbelievable! I, for one, am so glad this blanket ban has been imposed.

That goes for parents who whip out their phones to record their child's performance immediately after an announcement, by the HT, that recording is not permitted.

The school uses microphones for the children doing the story bits reading poems - but tbh even the vicar doing a very short prayer using the microphone, was drowned out!

And a microphone isn't much use to a boy signing who is upset by loud noises!

and pre-schoolers making a bit of noise is not a big deal

Yes, it is. Because that "bit of noise" may mean that a young child who has practiced all year and worked up the courage to say their ten words cannot be heard.

Midnite - you have quoted me, but I have gone on to say in every other post that I used to think this because my dad school performances were pretty quiet, and it really was just a little bit of noise from the little ones, and people took them out if they got too loud. If you read the rest of my posts you'll see I am well aware that it isn't always just a 'little bit of noise'!!

Such entitlement! The preschoolers won't even remember being at their siblings' concerts, but the child whose 'big moment' is ruined by noisy toddlers will! I was a primary school parent for 14 years and none of the concerts/plays etc were disrupted because children not yet at school weren't allowed. As it was the children had to do two performances (three before they got a new school building) because there wasn't room for all the parents/grandparents.

Exactly Fluffy, I don't want to take time off work and buy a ticket to listen to someone else's small children making a racket or running around the place!

The preschoolers might not remember not being there, but the older siblings and parents will probably remember not having their family there.

Trust me Broomstick, they don't. So long as they have had their chance to wave to mum and dad (as well as deliver their performance in peace), they are fine!

@Bestthingever - our PTA had to get quite 'ruthless' to stop this happening. Basically it is made very clear that only pupils attending the school may attend; then the children get in through a side door, and parents aren't allowed in either. If they can manage a day in school without mummy, they can manage an hour at their disco. Haven't had any problems.

But you wouldn't let your children's love for eachother and for you trump other people's right to enjoy their children's performance without massive disruption, zzzzz - that's the difference.

You'd take the little one out if they were causing too much of a row. You wouldn't let them hit another parent with their dummy, or run around, or play with noisy toys, or get on the stage.

If all the parents did this, the schools would have no justification for banning preschool age children and babies from performances.

And if your school is full of equally thoughtful and considerate parents as you, then performances won't be spoiled for the children performing and the people watching - and if such a school decided to impose a ban on preschoolers, they would be entirely unreasonable.

But as I said earlier, I suspect that Headteachers don't go for this Defcon 1 option unless they absolutely have to. They must know that it is going to be unpopular, and why would they put themselves in this particular firing line, if they don't have to?

Mine certainly were zzzz, AND all the other chiildren I know, AND they are all fairly normal teens now! They knew it was parents only so they had no other expectation; I mean, they don't take their preschool siblings with them to school anyway! Yes it would have been nice to take them, but it wasn't allowed, we accepted it, and the school was quite right.

Our PTA runs two discos: one Infants plus siblings; one Juniors and no siblings full stop. The latter is drop-and-run but I think the first one needs an adult to stay.

There is a swapover window inbetween, when the DJ turns the speakers up and puts the Frozen CD away.

YANBU.. really but It's hard. If my DD was in a play or something similar I would feel very miffed if a baby/toddler was being disruptive, but at the same time if I had a baby/toddler too and couldn't get childcare I wouldn't be willing to miss it.
My friend took her toddler to a theatre production her DS was in (semi-pro) that didn't have a stated age limit but was meant for 7+. It stated on the t&cs of tickets that although no age limits were in place you will be asked to leave if any children caused a disruption.. her toddler did what toddlers do and got fussy and she saw the usher heading her way so got up and left. Maybe something like that, make it clear on tickets and have a teacher act as usher/bouncer.
But for meetings I think if the school expects you to attend then they have to accept younger children may come too, In sure the parent would much prefer to not have a LO with them but it can't be helped.

But the point is, touch, that by excluding younger siblings, the school is also, in many cases, excluding parents. In my case, DD would have been able to have her dad while I stayed at home. But forany families, that wouldn't be possible and the children wouldn't have anyone to wave at. And in the case of families with a SAHP, it seems foolish to exclude that parent, the one who is generally responsible for school-related activities, from school events. For parents evening, in particular, it seems odd.

Parents evening is the easiest to accommodate as you only need cover for the 10 minutes of your appointment. You aren't the only parent in the school in this situation so you can buddy-up and each of you has 10 minutes of being in charge of 2 toddlers (probably strapped into a pushchair with a fistful of rice cakes) and 10 minutes in your appointment. It obviously takes planning and coordination but it isn't rocket science.

You do know there is no such thing as a 'normal' teen, that is why I said, "fairly normal" ie as in they haven't been scarred for life by the exclusion!

I don't think it's a bit early, at almost 20 and 18, and they don't remember not going to the school plays AT ALL. To also be blunt, I think you are attaching rather too much importance to these things! I didn't decide to exclude them but in retrospect it was the most sensible thing to do.

The point is, it doesn't bloody matter in the scheme of things!

It's a tough one. The littlies on stage deserve to not be distracted because for many of them, it's massive deal and if someone makes a noise or gets up and moves, it can throw them off their game.

Suggesting the performance is taped/streamed isn't an option because there may be some children in the performance who need to stay off the grid for safeguarding reasons.

A creche leads to a H&S can of worms if on the school premises. Nice idea though.

All things considered, I think more than one performance is the answer. A relaxed family-friendly performance (a bit like a rehearsal) then the big performance (adults/big kids only).