To continue to wonder who is happy with where Brexit is heading

[Bearbehind]

Whilst I'm sure Leavers will undoubtedly think AIBU the last thread filled up so here's another 1000 opportunities to discuss what you think about where Brexit is heading.

[WinchesterWoman]

Oh bear I think you just forgot the 15 or so questions i asked you

rather conveniently

hope you're enjoying the stalking - the autumn evenings must fly by

[Bearbehind]

ww there was no way on earth I was going to bother answering your 15 questions because I had answered every question you posed prior to that and you dismissed my replies by saying you didn't accept them and that was the end of it.

Why would I bother answering more questions when a) you plainly couldn't answer mine which I asked first and b) you couldn't be arsed to discuss the replies I'd given before?

Oh and its not exactly stalking to be reading a thread in a section I'm very interested in. I imagine there's quite a lot of us reading it in horror.

I can't be bothered to get into the arguments again by posting but it is very interesting to watch you all try and avoid the actual subject as much as you possibly can- if it weren't so serious it would be hysterical.

[larrygrylls]

Some of these comments about Carnet are awfully ignorant. He is only responsible for monetary policy and has to carry out a mandate given to him by government (2% inflation target).

There is a real cult of central bankers at the moment. Most will do a very similar job and there will be no shortage of candidates for his inflated salary.

[Bearbehind]

Are you on the right thread larry?

Carneys hardly been mentioned here.

[larrygrylls]

Bear,

Yesterday from 19:27 onwards, with the first link coming from you.

[Bearbehind]

Why is it ignorant to think that more instability is not a good thing?

If you think any idiot could do his job why not stick with the same one?

If it weren't for him propping up the markets on 24th June we'd be in a very different place now.

Sterling didn't drop just because he said it would.

[WinchesterWoman]

there was no way on earth I was going to bother answering

and yet there you were with gideon alleging i couldn't be bothered

[WinchesterWoman]

and what absolute rot - I answered question after question and gave fuller and fuller explanations then I asked you a series of questions which you totally ignored - just totally, didn't even try. Now you're so pissed off at being called out on it you're trying to restart the row.

[Bearbehind]

A quick time line for you ww on Saturday

• I replied to your list of previous points/ questions at 18.11.
  
• You replied saying you don't accept those responses at 18.15
  
• I asked you why at 18.22.
  

Instead of continuing that discussion and telling me why you didn't accept them, at 18.24, 18.30 and 18.35 you asked me a load more questions

The fact is you do anything you can to avoid discussing things you have no answer to.

You've just shown your true colours on the pub thread so I don't need to pursue this any further.

[Londonmamabychance]

Oh why oh why do remainers keep trying to convince leavers that they're wrong in their argument? They were wrong all along and if they were the type of people who would listen to reason they'd enver have voted leave in the first place. Just give up on it. The comments I've made on this thread and others answering leavers misindformed views have been mainly ignored, and they were not even that hard to understand, they just weren't what they wanted to hear.

Instead of speding time and energy criticising the part of the population who was swayed by the utter lies and fantasies served up by the Leavers, Remainers should spend their time trying to establish credible political alternatives to the one party nation we have now. PLEASE DON'T FORGET IT WAS THE CONVERSATIVE PARTY THAT GO US INTO THIS MESS. Them and them alone. Stop blaming peasants and take aim at the rulers who created this mess for their own personal gain.

[Bearbehind]

londonmama you completely contradict yourself in that post.

On one hand you say why do Remainers keep trying to convince leavers that they're wrong in their argument

On the other hand you say instead of spending time and energy critising the part of the population who was swayed by the lies and fantasies served up by the Leavers

If you think they were swayed by lies and fantasies then you are also saying they were wrong in their argument.

I think it might be a bit if a tall order to completely change the British political system and blaming the Tories is all a bit pointless.

I think that best we can hope for is that people do start to question the direction we're heading in and try to make their voices heard somehow if they're not happy.

[RufusTheSpartacusReindeer]

bear

I dont think she is contradicting herself

She is saying that although they are wrong there is no point arguing with them as they arent listening

Or thats how i read it anyway

[Bearbehind]

I see what you mean rufus.

Sorry london, I did think it was odd as I thought you were a Remainer.

I've never really thought Remainers could convince Leavers they were wrong, more tell us why they think they're right.

Seems neither is going to happen anytime soon.

[Londonmamabychance]

Yes I did support Remain and still do. I just don't see getting much out of debating with people who votes leave, un whose case it's clear that the arguments made by remainders creates such strong cognitive dissonance that they'll never listen or take anything aboard. Or, perhaps they simply would never admit to themselves or anyone else if they have a sneaking suspicion they got it wrong and they'll stick to their decision for ever and ever.

Yes, blaming the Tories and criticising the entire political system is a massively tall order. However, I do not see it as pointless. Many people who vote Tory are remainders and have not realised how the state of the current Tory party is what created this situation, and will continue to do so. Thy way that the polls look now, Theresa May's Conservative party would win an election. And that would mean hard Brexit. The only way to soften or even (although this is possibly too unrealistic) avoid it altogether is voting Labour or Lib dems.

[Bearbehind]

I don't understand your logic london, there won't be a GE until after a50 is triggered by which time we're screwed anyway.

Voting isn't going to solve this crisis, it's what caused it.

[Peregrina]

We can blame Cameron for his stupidity. He obviously hoped to go into Coalition again and then he would have blamed the LibDems for not letting him have his Referendum. We can also blame MPs to some extent for not considering Leave winning and putting in a minimum threshold.

[Bearbehind]

What's the point though peregrina. I've seen you say this a lot and I really don't see what continuing to blame Cameron achieves.

I don't 'blame' anyone, what's done is done. I just want the damage limited as much as possible.

[albertcampionscat]

Yes. That's it. We need to find a way to avoid the disaster of leaving the EU while saving face.

[Peregrina]

I want damage limitation too, but unless someone admits to responsibility then there is a chance that no one will learn any lessons for the future. However, the damage would not have been done if there hadn't been the right conditions. Many would blame Thatcher for that. Maybe that is too simplistic. Some blame the Unions. I tend to regard poor management myself as being a contributory factor having had some mediocre bosses during my working life (and some good, I add.)

I also don't like seeing Leavers blamed en masse - because as Stephen Hawking said, the issue is complex and few of us were fully appraised of all the issues. Obviously some were better informed than others.

You can also blame Farage for shit-stirring. It has been asked what Murdoch had against the EU. The same could be asked of Farage.

[Bearbehind]

There's no one left to admit responsibility though.

DC bailed and TM choose the poison chalice so is never going to admit it should never have happened, she's chosen to see it through.

In decades to come DC might admit it but we'll all have been screwed over by then.

[Bearbehind]

because as Stephen Hawking said, the issue is complex and few of us were fully appraised of all the issues.

I'm sure few of us would disagree with that but that's why I voted Remain- there was no case to vote leave.

If you voted for change you should have had the foresight to understand the implications of that.

Sadly it was too much to ask.

[Bearbehind]

Night

[Bearbehind]

Night

[Bearbehind]

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