To think only 3 of the 15 migrant children look under 18

[AmyMiller]

www.google.co.uk/amp/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3843900/amp/First-migrant-children-arrive-UK-Calais-French-prepare-raze-Jungle-camp-ground.html?client=safari

This is so ridiculous, many of them look around 25.

Ha ha perhaps we are not nice after all
You are well dodge fam

Gobblin - I can't be arsed to check what I wrote but I wanted to say women are obviously at most risk but don't underestimate the threat to even strapping big lads.

I will add getting raped is horrific no matter who it happens to.

Winchester- I think what I want is to deal with where we are and move to change the system. However, having a small amount of experience in the system I don't think we can make real improvements due to the attitude of the public. Can you imagin the outcry if the government put serious money into camps in Syria.

Also, from a government POV the men/boys are cheaper to bring in than families.

I just wish it could be discussed with out the decent into victim blaming and what is very close to racism. You must be uncomfortable with some of the comments.

I am trying to humanise these lads because that is what I see and I want to share it but I am mocked and my professionalism called into question. How does that help?

Yes completely agree with that yesterday

Yesterday I agree. And being a conspiracy theorist I am certain it's part of a 'foster chaos, sow division, reap dependency and enjoy control' agenda.

We're doomed I tell ee.

gobbolino the world has gone mad, yes, the bigger the lie and all that.

Very true winchester - imagine if we were dealing with women and children IMAGINE!!!!

Bit: quote the racism or withdraw the accusation.

Some think the UK is a stepping stone to the US.

Bitofacow, please will you tell me (perhaps on next thread as this one is full) why refugees of any kind would consider the US preferable to the UK? Because it can't be the benefits system.

This is a genuine question (and I can't believe things here are so bad that I have to qualify my question, but such must be the nature of debate, and MN).

If young British males were pretending to be children for pecuniary reasons the public disgust would be strong, not because of a particular dislike of British males but because it's a despicable thing to do.

Bit

I believe the expression is RTWFT amalfimamma. I could be randomly rude to you but on the whole would prefer not to be.

No I believe it is indeed RTFT (read the full thread).

Yesterday - it feels like feminists are on the back foot at the moment, the whole Trump thing and the CE rape case.

The government has totally arsed up the whole asylum thing and has been doing for years.

But, but, but the kids I work with who are refugees are really, honestly, genuinely decent people who need a break. Obviously no policy should be made on the back of this statement. Just the tone of the thread and the way some posters dehumanise them is wrong and upsetting.

As women, as mothers, as human beings can't we extend a little sympathy and then get on with changing policy?

As I've said; the dehumanising goes both ways. I don't doubt that the ones you have encountered are good people, but I don't think we can make policies and laws that assume this.

As women, as mothers, as human beings can't we extend a little sympathy and then get on with changing policy?

Oh FFS

You save all your sympathy for the people you have met.

Some of us are capable of caring about far away people we will never meet and who are being shafted by allowing adult men to abuse the asylum system.

Nobody has disputed that the refugee CHILDREN (that is the real children we all want to help) are genuinely honest people who need a break have they? You know the CHILDREN the UK were expecting

No please don't play the race card to stop debate.

I agree with you we need a proper robust policy and a lot human kindness and compassion but we can't help everyone so we should help the most vulnerable and that's generally the women and children not men who are already in a safe country and could travel to safe camps.

Quote the racism Bitofacow: or withdraw the accusation.

As women, as mothers, as human beings can't we extend a little sympathy and then get on with changing policy?

as a woman, a mother and a human being I do not have any sympathy for a 30something man masquerading as a child. Nor will I ever have any sympathy for the apologists who say "ah well, shit happens but at least he's safe now" while ignoring that said man illegaly entered the country, took that place of a genuine child and if he lied about his age he'd lie about anything to get what he wants.

And I will not apologise for protecting myself or my children

ICancelledTheCheque Wed 19-Oct-16 21:37:24

we are a joke!!!

re settlement scheme taken a long time to plan!!!!!

whose bloody planning it - they need to be sacked! we are a joke! imagine the people smuggles laughing¬

"Some of us are capable of caring about far away people we will never meet and who are being shafted by allowing adult men to abuse the asylum system."

Good, brilliant, lovely I fully support what you are saying. Honestly.

I just can't work up any indignant rage for the 19 year olds I know who probably lied to get in but who are deeply, deeply traumatised young men. They may technically be adult men and they may have shafted the system but can't we spare some compassion for them as well?

I think everyone wants the system changed.

Bringing these men to live in the UK and colliding with their pretence to be children is nothing less than state sponsored people smuggling.

It's our Merkel moment.

Colluding

*I just can't work up any indignant rage for the 19 year olds I know who probably lied to get in but who are deeply, deeply traumatised young men. They may technically be adult men and they may have shafted the system but can't we spare some compassion for them as well?

I think everyone wants the system changed.*

and therefore you are justifying illegal behaviour. If you work in any official capacity as you claim you'd be obbliged to report said illegal activity not pat them on the back for being so smart and savvy.

Bit I think you sound a lovely person but if people just as innocent and as emotional as you are in charge of the system then I can quite see how men pretending to be boys got through.

As a woman and s mother I want to see women mothers and children coming here from war zones and repeat not men already in safe countries.

Winchester - I said "close to racism" - I specifically did not say racism because as you imply no one has said anything racist.

I am suggesting the tone and the implications are there even if the words are not. As always I could be wrong, reading what is not there. I think racism like misogyny can often be in what is not said.

However, if I am wrong apologies.

There isn't really a close to racism - there's racism that's explicit and racism that's implicit.

Reposted from FB from someone who volunteers in the jungle:

Right, I've been asked so my half penn'oth on the child refugees....

• the kids being brought over are not brought over in order of age, vulnerability, risk or need. They are being brought over because their paperwork is in order and their claims are verifiable.
• all are 'Dublin' kids- ie have family over here and so have the right to be reunified with them and have their claims processed here under the terms of the Dublin 3 treaty. Not a single child has been brought over under Dubs- the 'modern day Kindertransport' aimed at protecting the most vulnerable.
• there are girls in Calais but most are either with family (and so not eligible) or are Dubs kids- so with a few exceptions not in the current batch the Home Office are processing.
• there are some very young kids covered under both Dubs and Dublin. None have come over because of Dubs and they weren't allowed to photograph the Dublin ones.
• so they have photographed teenage boys, on the cusp of manhood. And expressed horror that they look like teenaged boys on the cusp of manhood. Not just that- they are teenaged boys who have slept rough in the most hostile of environments for months. So of course they aren't doe-eyed and smooth-skinned and vulnerable looking. That wore off along their horrific journey as that look makes you prey. (Also, as an aside, one 'kid' photographed was actually an adult interpreter)
• by photographing and identifying these children and making horrible insinuations about them, the press have made them targets. Which is shocking. But what is more shocking is that members of parliament have joined in. And called for dental checks (which are ethically dubious and scientifically discredited).

So. There you go. Now let's hope the rest of the Dublin kids get here soon, the press move on to vilifying someone else for a bit, and there is a plan for the Dubs kids.

Pigs fed and ready to fly.