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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

AIBU to say NO to an Islamic wedding?

440 replies

user1472724168 · 01/09/2016 11:21

Sorry about the USER 1 TRILLION AND 68..

I have created a new account as I cannot remember my account details for my main account. I am a regular user but did not want this linked to my main account.
I have been with DP for 5 years. We are expecting our first baby in December and we have been engaged for 1 year. We decided not to get married until we had a new larger property which is fine.
DP’s mum and dad are from different religions, his mum is a Muslim and she was shunned from her family when marrying her husband. My DP and his siblings were christened but raised with no religion. I was raised with no religion.
Once the older family members of DP’s mum passed away she slowly was accepted into the family again. She now practices Islam and fasts, celebrates EID etc.
When we first announced the pregnancy she mentioned us having an Islamic ceremony. Myself and DP both said no- end of conversation.

Last night his mum asks us both if we would do this ceremony, that she doesn’t ask anything of us and this will make her happy. I said no immediately whereas DP said no then when he was told it would be a 10 min thing and would not take much effort I could see he was thinking about it.

Once we got home he asked me and I said no and it’s not up for discussion. He asked me why not and I said no I am not religious, have no interest in Islam and I do not need a reason tbh. He said he wasn’t interested but it would make his mum happy. I said that I will make him happy if it was something he genuinely wanted but I am not in a relationship with his mum and do not need to make her happy.

We argued where he said that it means a lot to his mum, but nothing to me and would not affect my life in any way. He looked pissed off and said that I should not say I would do anything for him if that wasn’t true..
He is not religious at all and doesn’t care but from my point it will make his mum look more respectable in her community. AIBU to say no?

I am upset this morning and it is difficult to conversate with him about it as really I have no reason not to do it apart from I am not interested in Islam!!

OP posts:
Italiangreyhound · 02/09/2016 15:34

Puzzled looking at that article I am so very saddened. Why would a little boy not need is foreskin?

Puzzledandpissedoff · 02/09/2016 15:40

Maybe she has some (exceptional circumstances!)

Maybe, yes - though since she was pretty talkative about every little detail of her life, I'd have thought we'd all have known about it if so

Perhaps the vicar just went too far off piste for reasons best known to himself; he's since resigned (or whatever the word is for leaving the clergy?) and moved into a totally different field, so who knows ...

samG76 · 02/09/2016 15:45

Italiangreyhound - so you're saying that you're not Muslim, but if you were, you would take a particular view. Can you not see why this is grossly patronizing. Here are other examples:

I'm luckily not a traveller myself, but if I were I hope I'd decide that it's better living in a house than staying in caravans

I'm not a woman myself, but if I were I would hope I wouldn't need maternity leave - would just store up a bit of holiday and then come back to work after 3 weeks

Puzzledandpissedoff · 02/09/2016 15:51

Why would a little boy not need his foreskin?

I don't pretend any medical knowledge, but believe there are some medical conditions which make removal necessary ... though somehow I doubt most of these circumcisions are done for such reasons

Not for the first time, it's hard to imagine how dreadful practices can be prevented if discussion of them is considered unwelcome

ThumbWitchesAbroad · 02/09/2016 16:03

IT's said that King Louis XVIII had a too-tight foreskin that needed attention when he was an adult.
My uncle also had a late circumcision due to too-tight foreskin - wouldn't retract properly.

However, you can't know this is a problem when baby boys are tiny, so it's not a nice thing to do to them then for no good reason. DH wanted DS1 to be circumcised, because he had been and he'd "never had any problems with it" - not good enough! Thankfully, GP agreed with me and told DH that he'd have to get it done privately at a cost of ~£100 as it wasn't a medical need. DH changed his mind.

MagikarpetRide · 02/09/2016 16:05

I came on to say similar to thumb but see the thread has moved on slightly

On the odd topic of circumcision I know a lot of men who had it done for medical reasons as kids. The numbers requiring it are reducing now in countries where it's not standard practice largely because we're told not to pull back the foreskin of your child anymore. Did a lot of research into this when we found out ds would be male as DH had it done btw as a family member asked if we would do it preventatively. We decided not to in the end.

But the 1% figure often banded about from studies is the men who got all the way to 18 and still needed surgery, there's a higher drop out percentage of those who had to have the surgery prior to 18. Even with improvements the need for medical circumcision is still fairly high (between 5-10%) based on those studies.

bolgwrad · 02/09/2016 16:19

What to say? Ask DP what he would do if his Mum were dead (whatever he liked): so why does she have power over him now? Or does he want to accommodate her trying to atone for the trouble she had marrying DP's father? In which case she's trying to use your marriage for her own validation - extremely unhealthy for all of you, to say the least.

It's not as though DP and family are devout Muslims (apparently). Tell her you understand, but you won't be resolving her historical family conflicts - she either treats you (both) as adults or finds someone else to bully. Yes, bully.

Mycraneisfixed · 02/09/2016 16:26

The only thing you can do is keep saying NO. You don't have to give a reason and by just saying NO and not entering into any discussion or trying to justify your decision will make it easier for you to stand firm.
Trust your instincts and don't be guilt-tripped into doing the wrong thing.

justasecond · 02/09/2016 16:28

wapperswhere did I say anything about you mentioning Islam??? I was commenting on your uncle knobchoppers statement. Where is the proof that such a thing happens here in the uk?

Puzzledandpissedoff · 02/09/2016 17:18

Where is the proof that such a thing happens here in the uk?

Maybe have a look at the link at 15.31?

Hausfrau55 · 02/09/2016 17:32

Wooftweetwooftweet, you have got it so right!! Stand your ground 1 trillion and 68.

oblada · 02/09/2016 17:42

I haven't read the whole thread and certainly wouldnt agree on circumcision.
BUT for the ceremony: it wouldn't mean anything legally, it would mean sth to his mother, I would do it without any problem. I got married religiously in India because it was important to my husband's family and it didn't matter to us so why not. We then had a legal civil wedding in the UK. I'm of the view that if it doesn't cause you any harm why not. I let my mother in law do prayers/ceremonies etc as she sees fit with the kids as long as no harm done of course. It's a great education for them. And me too actually. I don't believe but it doesn't mean I can't find it interesting. Jst my view. :)

BlancheBlue · 02/09/2016 17:42

Circumcision for non-medical reasons is archaic. "cultural" reasons for removing a boy's foreskin ffs. I'm guessing that people who believe in this also have no problems with fgm.

mermaid8 · 02/09/2016 17:50

late to thread and the subject seems to have changed but I just wanted to say that no decent Imam is going to perform a nikkah between two non Muslims, it's ludicrous. Your DP's Mum is trying to redeem herself, but going about it the wrong way.

Craigie · 02/09/2016 17:51

If it was me I would say 100% stick to your guns and say no, but before you do, answer this honestly - would you still be this adamant if it was YOUR mum asking, not his. If the answer is still no, then you know what to do.

hotdiggedy · 02/09/2016 17:52

I am quite certain your guess would be wrong Blanche.

BlancheBlue · 02/09/2016 17:59

hot so what is the difference between the two then? As I said I am talking when circumcision is carried out for non medical reasons

MusicMania · 02/09/2016 18:00

Circumcision for non-medical reasons is archaic. "cultural" reasons for removing a boy's foreskin ffs. I'm guessing that people who believe in this also have no problems with fgm.

I'm not sure as I can't speak for others but if the answer is generally no, why? Why is it ok to mutilate boys but not girls? why is legal to mutilate boys but not girls? What exactly is the difference?

For those asking for stats (they seem compulsory in backing up anything on here these days), you won't find any but there are plenty of articles reporting high numbers of children admitted to hospitals in the UK due to complications, and a few deaths. Of course there are no reports as to who performed the procedures.

Here's one (I posted another earlier in the thread)

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2012/dec/17/male-circumcision-baby-goodluck

squoosh · 02/09/2016 18:05

Why is it ok to mutilate boys but not girls? why is legal to mutilate boys but not girls? What exactly is the difference?

I'm against circumcision but I really don't think the two are easily comparable. FGM is a far more barbaric practice. Male circumcison cuts the foreskin, FGM cuts the clitoris.

Janey50 · 02/09/2016 18:07

If you are not a Muslim,there is absolutely no reason that you should have an Islamic wedding. And you definitely shouldn't be having a specific type of wedding just to 'make someone happy'. To be honest,I think your DP's mum is being unreasonable to expect this,and he should respect YOUR wishes,not hers.

Hausfrau55 · 02/09/2016 18:08

Really fucking scary, scary shit - if DP converts to Muslim, any children produced in the marriage must be raised as Muslims. Would you want that??!!

And the following is even worse -
"Muslim men may ask their non-Muslim wives to dress more conservatively at least around their friends which will generally mean no cleavage, covering the legs and arms at least 3/4 of their length and preferably loose fitting clothes. They may ask that their wives not have male friends which is considered inappropriate mixing of genders. They will likely expect their wives to be more traditional housewives although this does not mean they will inherently have objections to their wives working outside the home but will often expect that they still take care of the home and provide the meals and care for children in addition to their jobs because they will view the home life as coming first and taking priority."
Once your MIL gets her foot in the door regarding Islam, it would be extremely difficult to close it AND lock it. You'd no longer have a voice in any decision making, including naming your children and circumcision of baby boys. I don't think any of this is what you would want.

Like I said, fucking scary!!

mermaid8 · 02/09/2016 18:09

where I'm originally from boys are circumcised when they are around 6 years old, its done at home, in front of everyone and then they have a huge party thrown for them. Most men remember having it done, I don't know anyone who feels they were mutilated or traumatised.

AmyH05 · 02/09/2016 18:11

If it was me I would say No. Once you have said Yes they will expect you to do other religious ceremonies too. This is how it all starts. You won't even realise it you will be converted. You must put your foot down and say no.

VicsterB · 02/09/2016 18:28

It must mean a lot to her if she asked.
If you put yourself in her position, your DP will always be her son so she'll likely always have an opinion and want to help her family - and you are her family now. In the long term life will run more smoothly (& she can help you more) if you can have open discussions about your views and reasoning and then make your decision. ...If only I cld do that with my own Mum.

Italiangreyhound · 02/09/2016 18:29

samG76 re "Italiangreyhound - so you're saying that you're not Muslim, but if you were, you would take a particular view. Can you not see why this is grossly patronizing."

I think you have misread my post. I said...

"I guess as a Christian I am lucky that this is not something that is required or even suggested within my faith. If it were (to repeat "something that is required or even suggested within my faith") I think I would look to the past and see it as something to leave in the past and not to continue."

I did not say anything about my being Muslim. There are different religions which involve circumcision and Christianity came out of Judaism, which has circumcision. So it is not a massive leap for there to have been the potential for circumcision to be included as a requirement of Christianity. In fact there is a passage in the Bible (New Testament) about this 'dilemma'.