Where is London?

[namechangenumber45]

This is not intended to be a "London bashing thread" so please take question (from northerner) in spirit intended - one of curiosity.

I have been watching the news and an awful update on situation in Penge where a young boy and woman killed. I've never heard of this suburb and couldn't place it on a map - but on looking it seems to be a bit further from what I'd class as "London".

So my AIBU to ask where London starts and finishes?

Have the boundaries expanded? Are there some areas that would be SouthEast a few years ago but are now London?

when i lived in hornchurch it wa essex nothing london about it

yes that was thirty years ago

They always say that the Harry Potter experience/studios are in London, but they're not, they are in Hertfordshire, a 20 minute ride on a train from Euston I'll grant you but they are in Leavesden a part of Watford Hertfordshire.
There are very grey areas about where Greater London ends and the likes of Surrey, Essex, Hertfordshire begin.
I was born in Barnet and on my birth certificate it says Barnet Hertfordshire, but now Barnet is called the London Borough of Barnet!

It is London if it has a London postcode, which I am sure Penge has.
The other week I walked there from Crystal Palace which is in Zone 3 I believe.

The M25 is such a defining feature - there is no argument which side you are on - that if it isn't yet the touchstone for being "in London" it will become so in generations to come. Even if the underlying administrative boundaries don't match, everyone will know what is meant.

As far as I know, it's the only city in the world with such a clearly defined orbital boundary - quite unique.

maybe Berlin? not sure

I'm still pissed off about my 0208 number,
But then I'm also a postcode snob after years in the wilderness.

limitedperiodonly Loughton IS NOT patrolled by the met police since 2000 as I told you last night re Chigwell. Is is part of Essex police jurisdiction

As far as I know, it's the only city in the world with such a clearly defined orbital boundary - quite unique.

Paris has the Périphérique which seems to cause even more arguments about what counts as the city and what are the suburbs than what constitutes London.

We're on the border of harrow and Hillingdon, both London boroughs but postcodes are Ha or Ub. It's zone 5/6 on the tube and letters come with Middlesex written on the address. I still class it as London though but we're outer London. The feel is different - a lot more suburban and peaceful - than where we used to live in Holloway, Camden, Highgate, kings cross, and Finsbury Park areas. Some areas like Pinner do have quite a villagey even rural feel but we can all vote in London mayoral election here. I did have someone in Watford tell me they were shocked and didn't realise that living in Watford they couldn't vote, as they'd thought of themselves as still being in London cos they have the tube.

Again Blanche I must bow to your superior knowledge. A lot has changed since I lived round there. But I have an unwavering belief in what is Essex and what is East London that no one will ever change.

firawla I agree about Hillingdon, Ruislip, Pinner etc. It's definitely Outer or greater London despite the Middlesex HA postcode.
And to whoever said earlier in the thread that Romford wasn't in Essex, having lived there, the RM7 postcode is Essex.
Ilford, Romford, Dagenham are all in Essex yet, part of great London

There used to be a TV programme on all that was hip and happening in the capital called 01 For London.

I was thrilled to be part of it all because we had an 01 dialling code. I lived on the far eastern stretch of the Central Line. That's not London.

Harrow only became part of London in the 1960s ... before that it was in Middlesex (don't bother looking for it now - it's long since gone).

At school in the 1970s, a lot of the textbooks were stamped "Middlesex County Council" (and then overstamped "London Borough of Harrow").

lurking yes but a large amount of people seem to deny the 1965 boundary changes for (not sure what) reasons

Paris has the Périphérique

That did cross my mind but my impression when I was there was that it was closer to the North/South circular.

Returning to the M25, just to show how things used to be .... it was originally proposed in the 1940s before being completed in 1996.

Whens HS2 due again ?

As a Londoner, I reckon there are several areas
City of London - the square mile.
Central London - anywhere with a London postcode eg N1 NW1 SW1 SE1, E1 etc.
Greater London is the London Boroughs eg LB Merton, LB Richmond, LB Hounslow, LB Hillingdon, LB Bromley, etc., and also areas such as the Royal Borough of Kingston (which technically is in Surrey and part of Surrey County Council).
DH also thinks LB Kensington and Chelsea and LB Lambeth is Greater London but I disagree. I think it's central London!

yes but a large amount of people seem to deny the 1965 boundary changes for (not sure what) reasons

Probably the same people who all "live in Pinner". Like our cunty next-door-but one neighbour. Except we all knew it was either South Harrow or Rayners Lane, but no. Their lad at school always gave their address as "Pinner".

Living in Brum now, there seems to be a similar "thing" for Solihull

Hayes and Hillingdon were still using Middlesex in the 80's when I visited my nan, but were greater London whereas nobody wanted Slough where we lived I wonder why

Well, Oxford Airport calls itself London Oxford these days, so....

minstrel I can assure you that Kingston is part of London (it is a London borough) despite Surrey County Hall being located there.

But when I used to drop a postcard to my mum in Wealdstone, I would still put ' Middx' - it is still a postal thing isnt it?

Don't forget London Luton just to really confuse things...

and Surrey CC have no jurisdiction over Kingston

Blanche that is because in the old days, Middlesex (and maybe Essex?) came as far as the river, and Kent and Surrey started on the other side. That is why we have eg 'The Middlesex Hospital' in the middle of London.

I'm zone 2, SE, 7 minutes from London Bridge but not on the tube (although if the Bakerloo line extension rumour is true, I will be in about 18 years). I'd count that as London.

DPs family are from Hampton - does that count as London? Borough of Richmond.