Want to move , husband does not

[Saza09]

Talk

Dear all ,
I desparately need advice . My husband and I are both irish but have lived in lonon for nearly 20 years. I really want to move home to be near my folks and my husband's family . I miss ireland a lot and we are always there . I have always done so.

Part of the move for me is to have a slower life and a more rural small town life with family time. We have partied hard here and lived london to the full but i desparately want calm and quiet and rural views and most of all my folks and in laws nearby for my kids to have a family life.

Objectively , we have an amazing life here in London .

The kids (aged 7 and 5) are well settled here and very happy in a fabulous school and we have a wide range of friends (including irish from uni and childhood ). On paper , all looks good for london and very few understand why i want to move but I am terribly home sick and want a change of pace and direction. My husband has a fab job here and if we moved he would commute from ireland staying two nights away . I have tried to give up on this ireland thing but i just cant.

It is tearing our marriage apart as my husband does not understand my need to go home or why family is such a big thing (for me , my parents are aging and I want to spend time together before they die).

After years of arguing , we are on our knees about this. I finally persuaded him to put an offer on a house in ireland and we lost it today . I am heartbroken and angry with him for not making it happen (the offer was low and half hearted ). I am close to divorce. I know this is not just about "home" but about the state of our marriage and my unresolved need to be near my parents. However , I am so consumed by anger that I have had to persuade my husband for so long when it is obvious (since the birth our first child) that I desparately want to go back. I don't get why he can't see how much this means and why he has not until very recently been open to any discussion on this. I appreciate that he does not want to be separated from us and his careerbis successful and here. He loves london. is it wrong of me to want different things and expect to be listened to ? Why has it taken a year of constant arguing forhim.toagree to think about moving ? Feel like I am losing my mind . Advice please x

I'm Irish and grew up abroad, I always really missed Ireland even though I had only spend the first 7 years of my life there.

In our teenage years we started spending longer and longer in the summer holidays in Ireland, first renting then buying a mobile home there. In the end we spent the whole summer holidays, Dad would join us for about 2 or 3 weeks.

Do you work? Could you do something like that - live in London but have a 'summer home' in Ireland for extended stays there? I really found that having a good long time there over the summer was plenty to keep me going for the rest of the year.

I completely sympathise with the OP, it's a situation I have been in for many years. I moved from south wales to london 20 years ago, I never planned on staying more than a couple of years. I then met my wife. She has never lived more than a mile away from the house she grew up in. She moved from her parents and in with me, we live in the same street she grew up in - 7 doors from her parents.
Originally we thought this would be perfect as he mum would be close by to help with our 6 month old child.

Unfortunately her mum passed away 6 months after we moved in. Her father has a new partner and they spend at least six months a year travelling. FIL partner has never had kids, never wanted them and although she is fine with DS and DD she has no desire to be a step gran. Aside from FIL, my wife has an aunt she is close to and her son is a big help with babysitting etc. We get virtually no help from FIL except for the odd afternoon looking after the kids. He will not have the kids overnight.

I have been homesick for Wales for some time, we have spoken about moving there often, but there is always a reason not to move. I even suggested moving to an area of Wales where she has family (we visit them every time we are there). We would have a far better support network, would be mortgage free and I could look to retrain - something I would like to do but cannot whilst living with a hefty mortgage.

I miss the culture, the beaches the countryside where I grew up. Logically, there is no reason for us to remain in London, however emotionally she is tied to it.

This has been the cause of numerous discussions/arguments over the years. I thought we were making some progress last year, I was under threat of redundancy, which would have given me a large payout, we even went so far as to view a beautiful 5 bed detached house which cost a fraction of what our current 3 bed semi is worth. But eventually she said she didn't want to move and only viewed the house to keep me happy.

I don't understand her ties to where we are, she barely sees her dad, has very little family around (BIL and SIL are moving to the south west), and we have an option to not only be mortgage free, but in a nicer house, in a nicer area with enough money left over to invest in a couple of apartments to rent out - we could effectively retire before I am fifty.

I know that it won't happen, it's getting harder now as the kids are about to go to secondary school and it would be an upheaval to move them now. Maybe in another 10 years

To be honest though, there are other solutions than "London or Ireland" - living outside london and the DH commuting in daily, living a more rural lifestyle, but in the South East of England and possibly meaning they can afford a much larger house outside London allowing grandparents to come to the OP for a few weeks at a time rather than it being down to the OP to visit them. Or a smilar sized house outside of London, but using the extra money freed up by the move to fund a holiday home in Ireland so the OP and DCs can go for every school holiday easily.

The OP probably won't come back, but does seem from her update to have thought about what she was asking her DH to do was something that most people would consider unreasonable - sometimes you can get so fixed on what you think will be the only possible solution to your problems, you don't see what new, and possibly much harder problems it would cause.

The South East of England is nothing like rural Ireland though - and you're assuming the OPs' parents could travel. Mine can't, through ill health, so the burden is on me to travel to them with or without the children - and that doesn't take into account the OP's children being brought up in the UK with a totally different culture to the one in Ireland. Also her DH would have a longer commute and probably wouldn't see his children during the week if he's working in a demanding City job.

Basically, saying SE England is a viable option is like saying someone who wants to live in California should try Birmingham.

SpecialAgent, I think OP took the answers on board:

"Dear all ,

Just wanted to say thanks to all of you for the lovely, sage and kind advice . I think it reflects what I know at heart (sensible to stay put ) but whether we do that in the end I really can't say . I do need to return to counselling and we do need to work on our marriage also . But , in the end , I do think we will go back . You are correct about my marriage . It's always been hard work and lots arguments (but love and passion too). I wanted to say that all your posts have massively helped me today and I am looking at DH in kinder light as i think I had forgotten what I am asking of him (and the kids ). Will let you know if we do move xxx"

We obviously have very different interpretations of that update, but it hardly matters as I seriously doubt OP is coming back.

To the Irish posters: It's been really interesting reading about the cultural differences and what it was like when you moved back. I feel a bit educated, actually! So thank you

SpecialAgent, she was hardly likely to completely turn around her viewpoint over the course of one thread and decide that she wasn't homesick for Ireland and her family after all. I think the fact that she has softened her stance at all and is seeing things a little more from her DH's point of view at least shows that she has taken some of the comments on board.

I have and am reading them all . Thanks again . What is particularly helpful are the comments from those who have actually returned to ireland.

I think if we do return it will have to be close to family. My husband now appears somewhat open to change but is looking at houses 3-7 drive hours from family (in a cheaper and more beautiful part of ireland ). I don't think this will work given the need to be near family and the supposed point of move (for me). All in all , I feel more hopeful (but he often relents then his attitude hardens again against any move so i am prepared for that ). I am definitely more open and less angry as all your opinions are suggesting I had become obsessed to the exclusion of his (justifiable ) concerns . Lets see. This is an open book at the moment. I have lost my dream house (close to both sides family and airport with amazing view ) and I am grieving that and somehow praying the sale wont progress . I will keep you posted x

I can understand you want to.be near your parents. My brother moved to Belgium so his wife could do this. It's very difficult and having seen in action, I certainly wouldn't advocate a grass widow solution. Moving from the bustle of London to Ireland is a huge culture shock too. Are you certain you want to uproot your life here where your children are settled at school and your husband has a great job. What do you do all day? Maybe you need to consider a term time only job just to give you something to do. A compromise might be to move further out of London but still easily commuteable. I live in Zone 9 which is rolling countryside but still on the tube. You need to sit down together and work out your priorities. Would you give up your husband or his happiness just to be closer to your parents. My very Irish dad made it quite clear when I got married that my responsibility was to my husband now, not them. He would have been horrible to think he was coming between us. What do you think your parents would say? I love my hometown but I've realized I've outgrown it and would become irritated very quickly if I had to live there again.

Not meaning to be patronising, but are you sure you understand the finances of the move?

You lost the other house due to a low offer and now your DH is looking at houses in a cheaper area.

Are you gaily saying oh we'll realise £500k (say) from the sale of our house so can spend that while your DH is thinking hang on, set money aside for cost of commuting, cushion in case of losing job due to being less flexible about working hours and commuting etc....and really you've only got 2/3 of that to spend (obviously the numbers are just illustrative).

I kind of have the impression you're not spending much time worrying yourself about the practicalities. Which puts a lot of pressure on your DH.

Are you a SAHM?

I apologise op, I really didn't think you were coming back

Is there anyway your DH could find a job in his line of work in Ireland/ As others have pointed out, it's not like it doesn't have cities!

I wonder too if you have romanticised visions of living in Ireland. I can tell you it is not easy to look after aging parents on your doorstep whatsoever. Especially as they now feel they can say what on earth they feel like and kind it isn't at all. Whatever I've done is never enough.
You have what sounds like a brilliant set up in London. Fancy swapping for a week?
What are you gong to feel when and is inevitable, your parents die? What have you got left in Ireland other than some old friends maybe?
It sounds to me like your husband has his dream job and is happy, your children are happy and doing well and dare I say considering their futures; they'd be better off here with universities and employment here for them. You have to consider your children's futures too; they should be your no 1 priority! IMHO I MOST DEFINITELY THINK YOUR PARENTS WOULD WANT THAT FOR THEIR GRANDCHILDREN I'm wondering if you feel like this now that the children are older and moving on. Do you work? Maybe working part time would give you an outlet. Or get in touch with help the aged so you can befriend elderly people who don't have children or relatives? You could fly home on a frequent basis yourself too, to visit your parents. It would be a lot to ask a man to commute to/from every week when he's working full time in a job he loves. You, your husband and children have a social life in London too, museums and a host of other attractions to visit, good schools, good transport links, good hospitals.
I think to consider diverse for the sake of being near your parents would affect your children far more than you realise, affect your standard of living, impact on your social life and if your parents felt it was for them, they'd be devastated.
I'd suggest going to see Relate as its affecting you both to this point. It's serious. No getting away from it. I think you need to physically write a list and think who is most vulnerable; your children. Remember too; your parents have each other, their friends and adult social services. Your marriage and your social life are important too as you've obviously enjoyed those in the past. I suspect that once in Ireland, you'd miss London, especially after they're gone. You could end up in Ireland, divorced, limited access to your kids and no social life by then because when looking after elderly parents that evaporates. I know to my cost.
In your shoes, if I wasn't working, I'd volunteer or get a part time child friendly job, maybe in a school? That would stop you from over thinking things. Have you actually told your parents how this is affecting your marriage about your potential plans?

OP, my parents moved back when I was 7, my sisters were older and had to move back too. Out of 4 of us only one stayed and I came back to UK at 17 and loathe visits there now. It was so hard having to change schools, learn to live somewhere else. Keep in mind how tough it may be on the children too.

OP, why can't you fly there and back every month or even a couple of weekends a month?

Just as a trial?

Whilst I see you have hope of him changing his mind. Surely living 7 hours drive away is harder than it would be to get there now?

My in laws live 3 hours away. I wouldn't uproot my family, change the kids schools, live in the middle of nowhere (even though dh would like to) to care for them. I just wouldn't. It's not fair on the kids.

But to do it, but not near enough that you can help them out, seems insane.

And we work for ourseleves. We could in fact work from anywhere, so work isn't an issue. But I still wouldn't do it.

user1470269632 there are universities and jobs in Ireland. Ireland is also part of the EU and Irish students therefore have access to Erasmus schemes and EU funding that will now, sadly, probably be lost to UK students. There are schools AND hospitals in Ireland, and museums - it's really quite an advanced civilisation, believe it or not.

The Irish educational system has a strong emphasis on languages and diversity in subject choice and the standard of education is incredibly high. Most of the major tech companies have their EU headquarters in Dublin, not London. There are many opportunities there in all fields. A quarter of a million UK citizens live in Ireland BY CHOICE. So it's not that bad.

London is not Shangri fucking La. And if the OP wanted to move to Manchester, this thread would be one page long and full of people saying her DH was being inflexible.

The people who were moved as kids saying don't do it - were you that young?

Moving an over 10 year old I can see how that can have big repercussions for the child, they might hate it, feel an outsider etc. But a 5 and 7 year old? They'd adjust pretty quick I'd have thought.

I suppose if OP and her DH drag this out for another 7 years then they will have older kids on their hands who may well hate the move and resent them for it.

I've heard the Irish education system is pretty good. I would have thought moving kids this age would be ideal. IF the DH wanted to go.

user1470269632 to be clear - OP should stay in London because in Ireland the schools, universities, hospitals and transport facilities are poor? That is what you are implying and you are wrong - not sure if you are pig ignorant but definitely you are wrong. Why would OP want to befriend elderly strangers?....She doesn't yearn for the company of old people, she misses her own parents. You sound like a lovely lady offering to swap your own 'ageing' parents so you can rush off to all the museums - must be SUCH a bore for you! I think OP might feel differently about her parents, hence the want to move - lucky for her family, unlike your parents by the sound of it. Your comments about London being superior to Ireland are ridiculous.

Yeah, education certainly wouldn't be a problem. And in a rural location the schools would be small so the kids would get a lot of attention.

But there's no point going back if you're got be hours away. Totally defeats the purpose. It seems your husband is almost punishing you - "we can move back but I'm damned if its going to be easy for you"

I am curious what part your parents live in that is both rural and expensive!

Saza09 If you and your husband can't agree at moment definitely look into a holiday home - you can make it your own and it gives you some stability if you end up moving without husband, if things come to that. And it is a way to transition as well - to see how things would be permanently x

As an oldie I am amazed at the "get a little part time job" thing going on. How bloody patronizing is that? Is that what we fought for in the 60s and 70s, equality for women so other women could say, "there there dear, you just need a job that will fit round school to occupy your pretty little head."

We don't need men to put us down do we.

Judging by what you've said I think you have less money than you think you do. Perhaps your husbands offer wasn't stupidly low - perhaps it was what you can afford if he has to also fund digs in London during the week.

My husband now appears somewhat open to change but is looking at houses 3-7 drive hours from family (in a cheaper and more beautiful part of ireland ). I don't think this will work given the need to be near family and the supposed point of move (for me)

So he's not saying no, he's asking you to compromise. That doesn't seem unreasonable considering he's the one who will have to endure the stress of commuting internationally, spend so much time away from his kids and leave a city that he loves.

Yorksha

That's not a good compromise though as OP is probably worse off by way of seeing family.

3-7 hours is quite a big difference, OP - how big is his search area?!

Honestly I'm trying to imagine where in Ireland is 7 hours away from anywhere.