DD's refusing to wear a bra, her Head of Year is saying she isn't allowed at school.

[EmmelineW]

DD is 14 (Yr 9) she tried a bra at 12, hated it and has refused to wear one since. She did try a sports bra, which she wore a couple of times in the day but now refuses and would only wear for PE. She's very confident and popular, so it hasn't ever caused any teasing (she normally makes a joke and is very vocal about not wearing one, she says that if she wasn't, she would be bullied because of it).

She had PE today, which was the first lesson she refused to wear her sports bra, she was told to not take part by her PE teacher - her PE teacher is very 'down with the kids' and mentioned it to her privately.

I would just like to say, previously to this, I was called in to make sure that she had a female role model to talk to about periods/bras as it had come to their attention, that was all cleared up.

Head of Year sent her home today because of it and said she isn't allowed back until she wears one, as it's put under the same category as having a short skirt. Where do we stand with this? Does it come under uniform issues? I'm not really sure what they're saying she can't come back for rule wise.

I'm still unconvinced this thread is genuine. Even if it is, I'm still looking forward to seeing The Daily Fail's take on it.

Well, I'm sorry but there's no other way of proving its real. Mumsnet has checked me out, etc. I'm not sure what else can be done. If you don't think it is, maybe not comment?

Thank you stop

I get it from:
A) the idea that there is a halfway stage between school polo-shirt and PE top,
and
B) it was noticed that she didn't have a bra at the first lesson she tried it.

Why is OP on here, when she/he has made her/his mind up?

Maybe because it's my thread? I'm unsure why you're still on here tbh... After your comments

I already said I'm her mum too...

I'm so sorry about your sister.

Tara, I really don't think the odd glimpse of nipple in a changing room is that distressing. And fwiw, I don't find nakedness in changing rooms particularly uncomfortable. Perhaps it's because of my Nordic grandfather, of course.

I am also quite amused by 'talking about one's underwear is socially inappropriate' - Tara, I'm ancient but I do hazily remember that teenage girls have much racier conversations and won't faint at the word 'pants'.

I didn't say distressing. I said "uncomfortable". I think it's quite possible she is making some girls uncomfortable. Some people are at ease with group changing, and some people aren't. This is the case for adults and this is going to be the case for adolescents. It's hard enough for girls who are shy about their own bodies and sexuality without having to carefully not look at Jenny, either due to personal embarrassment or to avoid, "oi are you a lezzy?" (No, I do not condone homophobia, but I bet it's still around, yeah.)

I wonder, were such racy conversations in earshot of teachers? Or carefully conducted in single-sex groups?

Or were they perhaps conducted Very Loudly in earshot of fit lads accidentally-on-purpose, perchance? Not socially appropriate. Do that in the park after school.

Still on here for amusement! and waiting for Daily mail

Eh? They were all-female conversations, as it happens. And as it also happens times have moved on a bit and there are plenty of out lesbians at my daughters' not particularly leafy sarf London comp.

I have to say Not Wearing A Bra didn't affect my academic performance back in my own schooldays either.

Still on here for amusement! grin and waiting for Daily mail wine Yes

There you go then. All-female conversations, which definitely wouldn't constitute "very vocal" comments to any and all potential bullies.

Opinions will differ, as do experiences, but I don't think it has moved on much for LGB youth, and I think casual homophobia is still around. But then, I'm not from London, and if my town elected a mayor, I don't think a Muslim candidate would win. My town elects conservatives who vote against equal marriage!

I don't get the "it's my thread". Well, don't start one if you don't want opinions - especially in AIBU.

Until there is a "I AM REASONABLE" topic where only OPs are allowed, just posting to themselves, other points of view can be heard!

I think it still comes down to the OP's dd being "vocal" and the OP having been contacted beforehand about "role model" issues. I would swear blind that the average girl wearing no bra would just go under the radar. I don't believe most teen boys are dogs on heat. They have their moments, obviously, but thinking about my ds I think he'd think a girl being vocal about it was a show-off and/or a bit eueegh. A braless person minding their own business would be unlikely to attract attention or at the most the odd comment, not a big hoo ha from the school.

Rhoda yeah, I have to say, no-one ever commented on my braless state as a teenager before I gave in and admitted that even ordinary everyday life was more comfortable with a bra than without, which would have been at 14.

In fact, the only comment I ever had was as a breastfeeding adult running for the bus, when I couldn't be faffed with fastening ordinary bras and couldn't afford breastfeeding bras. (Rude teenage girl showing off for her male companion that was.)

I think it's quite possible she is making some girls uncomfortable
That is ridiculous. Even if her breasts are momentarily visible while she changes, another girl does not have the right to complain that in a girls changing room, she saw another girl's breast and it made her feel uncomfortable!
What if another girl had a see through bra on or a thin camisole top and someone saw evidence that she had nipples?
Should the underwear have to be a certain thickness to ensure maximum disguise?

Emmeline. I'm not saying it's absolutely not genuine, but surely you must be aware there are certain somewhat salacious sections of the media who would be only too enthusiastic to jump on this thread? Can't you just sit down with her and discuss it together? There is a part of me that has absolute admiration for a young woman who refuses to conform - but I'm also aware this site is frequently targeted by middle-aged hacks desperate for their next juicy titbit (pun not intended). What will you do if they approach you about this situation?

I'd absolutely ignore them. That's the last thing I want.

Then it's completely your call. I appreciate the awful contradiction between trying to raise children to be themselves and then wondering if life would be easier for them if you encouraged them to conform to social norms. It's a an incredibly difficult situation. Good luck.

This thread has moved on a lot since I last looked at it so forgive me if this point has been raised already.

Does your daughter wear anything at all under her shirt?

I am also impressed at her self confidence about going topless in the changing room. DD is is ridiculously embarrassed and self conscious about her body and wouldn't dream of not wearing a bra ever.

I really hope my DD grows up to be a "proper little madam" who is this comfortable in her own skin and not desperate to conform and fly below the radar.

I think this 14 year old sounds great, and I think you should be proud of her.

It is not easy to reject the clothes and behaviours that are generally deemed acceptable for girls.

More

She doesn't go topless, she toes the top trick, like 85% of the girls in her year

I really wish people would stop blarting on about "making others uncomfortable". It is not for women to modify their bodies to make others more comfortable. Your comfort level about my body is not important, only MY comfort level is important.