AIBU or is this normal these days?

[SultanOfPing]

I don't know if i'm completely out of touch, or if DH's ex and kids are completely taking the piss, so a couple of honest views would be appreciated... Basically, DH's ex wife has always been a bit 'grabby'. For the two boys, she gets about £150 more than the csa recommend - in total, close to £1200 a month for the pair of them. The £150 is made up of extra for clothes and dinner money. The two boys are 14 and 16, and the eldest is all set to go on to do A levels in September. A few weeks ago, he started hinting about new stuff for school. He asked for a leather jacket, boots, tshirts and jeans...we agreed on the jacket (it's not a cheap one that he's picked!) and two pairs of jeans. Anyway, the ex sent DH a text a couple of days ago...she's putting £500 of her own money (she doesn't work, so basically DH's/our money that we give her for the boys) towards clothes, footwear and books and expects us to match it. We have two young children of our own and, well, we just can't afford it. We rent a five bed house so the boys can have their own rooms, even though they only visit for a weekend every three weeks and half of school holidays. Anyway, as expected, DH's ex has gone mental. How DH is a bad parent, that he doesn't care, how he has no idea how hard it is for her (she actually left him for another bloke after carrying on behind his back for nearly two years and took the kids 300 miles away [and does nothing to help with visits]) and how he's going to alienate his boys if he's not careful. DH is stressing about it all because he's worried that he won't see his sons because they'll turn against him. Me? I wanna punch the bitch in the throat. Are teenagers really this expensive? Is this a normal demand for a 16yr old kid? We also give them pocket money that goes straight into their bank accounts, which they do nothing for (they don't help out in the kitchen or walk the dogs when they come up to stay, for example) and he has no intention of using any of that for his new wardrobe or books. This isn't the first time that she's asked for more money, and we always pay half (at least) towards uniforms and footwear - we also buy them everyday clothes, usually a couple of tshirts or a hoodie when i'm buying clothes for our two (2 & 4, so grow out of things quickly!). Are we being unreasonable by telling the boys' mum that we can't afford it (we'd have to get stuff on a credit card) or is it normal to fork out this much money? My friends all tell me that we do more than enough already but, well, they're my mates so possibly a bit biased?

I got free school meals.

bingo I'm not sure in my opinion OP and partner should just go ahead and get him the things he needs themselves and not give ex the £500.

The OP's stepsons won't get FSM's because their father earns too much.

No of course not, but FSM isn't the difference between my figure and the figure in OP... I'm simply saying £600 is more than satisfactory.

StrangeLookingParasite A friend of mine asked her ex not to take their teenager shopping because he always takes her to cheap places she doesn't like, and gets her clothes she then refuses to wear. The daughter - my daughter's best friend - is terribly polite to her father - an insecurity from seeing so little of him compared to his younger children - so will never tell him directly. Her mother got fed up of replacing it all with branded stuff, and made the plea directly. She got accused of being grabby, too.

When deciding who gets FSM they only consider the income of the household where the children are considered resident as with almost any benefit this is e one that recieves or would be eligible to recieve child benefit

But Renotry, that surely depends on the parent's earnings? More than satisfactory isn't the point - even if I agreed, which I don't, as mine cost me more than £150 per week each, and that's without adding up the extra cost of housing them (more bedrooms than I'd need if I didn't have them).

Parents who earn more have more available to spend on their kids. And the OP's husband and his then wife would have made a desicion about how many children they could afford. Those children may well feel resentful if their father decides he can afford more children and then as a result he can't afford things for them that they would like. Of course, the kids could be asking for too much - many do And then the parent/s can say no. But my advice for the OP was to let their father come to that desicion on his own, and enforce it on his own, because if his relationship with his sons is adversely affected by it, he then won't be able to blame the OP in any way.
I do have sympathy for her situation, and that of the boy's mother. I don't share a child with anyone who also has children with someone else, but I can imagine feeling somewhat resentful, in lower moments, that the resources that could be solely available for my children have to be shared with others that I had no say in the creation of.

But one of the shocks when I became a single parent - which coincided with my eldest becoming a teenager - is how much more
expensive it is when you're the only resident parent and are therefore permanently exhausted by meeting the kids emotional and practical needs and when people advise scratch cooking or going to 3 different supermarkets to source the cheapest ingredients you just want to cry...

YANBU since ExP left 14 years ago I have had the sum total of £300 and that was from a CSA claim. My DD is starting 6th form in September and has a part time job so she is buying her own clothes with a contribution from me. Absolutely gobsmacked that your DH ex is demanding that much money on top of what you already pay

Somerville - I know a lot of people whose joint income doesn't add up to anywhere near what my DH earns, and they have still have three or four (or more) kids. DH and ex stopped at two though because that's how many children they wanted, not because of any financial restraints. As for the contributions DH makes now, surely they are just that - contributions, rather than sole supporter? Turns out that DH uses the CSA figure calculated if we had one child, and although the CSA know that we have two, they base his sum (which he has reviewed every year) on just one other child - so ex definitely is getting more than she's entitled to! DH pays just over £1200 a month as his share towards the living costs of his sons - it's his ex's decision not to work, so surely it's unfair to expect us to pay more because she chooses not to contribute financially? There is no spousal maintenance agreement, money is meant as his 'share' of the boys' upkeep. I don't begrudge them that at all, it's just that the extra amount (and the manner in which it was requested) seemed unreasonable.

As for shopping from different supermarkets - they only shop in Waitrose, according to the boys...
Moomoo - bloody hell, that is awful!

Why isn't their mother working if they are 14 and 16? She sounds like a right money grabber, and lazy to boot.

Twins - she's five years older than me, smokes yet has a smooth, wrinkle free complexion. My sister, who regularly has both treatments, reckons she's definitely getting fillers and Botox. Never had the nerve to ask DH to pay though!! Glad it's worked out well with your step sons.

I'd try and separate out the irrelevant (if bloody irritating) stuff, such as the ex not working... from the important issues.

Hubby needs to put his foot down about doling out extra money for frivolous stuff and potentially doling out more than his fair share - I don't for a second think that the ex is fronting up 500 quid, I thinks he is just saying that to get 500 quid out of your hubby.

This has to be done in a way that is TOTALLY clear to the two boys that their father is NOT being mean or denying them anything unreasonably..

I would.. in his shoes - stop paying the extra over and above the CSA amount, and instead give that money directly to the two boys in the form of a monthly allowance to be used for clothing, school books etc.

Explain that sometimes life does indeed throw up extra costs, and ask the older boy to provide a list of the required books for college and then work WITH him to source those books second hand, or via deals on amazon etc...

All of this is about teaching both boys about budgeting and money management, a vital skill and potentially something they are not learning at home with their mother, and about giving them a bit more responsibility now that they are older.

Then its very easy to introduce the concept that he cannot actually fund every whim or desire they have at the drop of a hat, that money comes from somewhere and doesn't grow on trees..

And all this can be done wtihout ever once suggesting that their mother is in the wrong/bad/etc etc.

£500 + £500 on clothes??? For school?? Seriously?
Unless the school they go to is Eton, this is utter nonsense.

Oh my goodness, OP.

Much as it might be falling for you that your husbands first wife smokes, shops in waitrose, and has the gall to look younger than you, you really need to try to stifle your feelings about her and think about what is best for the children. That may or may not include a leather jacket. But they're at a crucial stage right before being able to choose whether or not they want a relationship with their father, and what form that takes, so he may want to pay the money rather than fall out with them right now. Especially as he earns more than the joint incomes of plenty of people who you know.
Or maybe he doesn't think it would be good for the boys and won't pay it. In which case, leave that to him to enforce and try to keep your opinions about heir mother to yourself.

It doesn't matter how expensive the clothes are, she gets money to feed and clothe them plus extra. If she wants more she should get a job. If he wants more he is old enough to get a part time job. Don't give more money. It's unfair to you and your family.

To be honest with you, if the mother involves the kids in this your husband should feel able to sit them down and explain that he pays £600 a month already for each of them, and that is intended to be spent on all of their costs, including clothing. Further, mother will receive child tax credits, which again is intended to meet the cost of raising them.He can work out online how much she will be getting.

In fact I'll save you the bother - it's £470 every 4 weeks, or £509 a month. So she's getting £1700 a month earmarked for the kids. And there's no reason on earth why she can't try to get a job.

It's not really anyone's business why she doesn't work.

It's annoying if they have the money to look after the kids but always claim to be broke (looking at dp's ex here!), yet being all coiffured and made up. But that's about her money management and, sadly, sometimes you just have to live with it, knowing you can't change another adult's behaviour.

It's pretty hard to us clothes for kids who are only with you one weekend a month. Lots of suggestions here are obviously from people who are not in split families, it is really different. You honestly don't get to teach them about budgeting. The best you can do is set a good example and hope some worms it's way in.

These days we tell dss he has £x (usually £100) to buy all his clothes for the new term (not uniform, we buy that) and drop him at Primark which is his favourite shop (but we don't shop there ourselves) then we go off and do something else and come and collect him when he's done. He has instructions on the min clothing he has to buy (e.g. Two jeans, three s/s tops, two l/s tops, one hoodie, one pack each pants and socks, pumps, any extra money he can spend as he wishes) and he just chooses what he wants. He refused to wear all the clothes dp bought him in the past so we learnt that lesson.

Presumably she gets child benefit too?

Seems she does an awful lot of saying no to him buying stuff.

It's time for receipts. Time to check the boys get the £500 worth of clothes you sent the money for....

I know it's not been given yet but you get the point I'm making.

Ah yes - forgot about child benefit. Add £149 a month to my previous figure. So that's £1,850 a month she's getting for them.

Hmm.... Reread the thread again and got a few questions...

Is your dh ex still with the man she ran off with? Or is she single on benefits?

Either way....

Why is your dh paying more over the suggested CSA amount? I would put a stop to that immediately.

The CSA payments is there to cover clothing. He absolutely does not need to give his ex £500 on top of buying clothing himself.

As for textbooks, again tell dh tell ex to buy it out the child support you pay her.

In fact dh needs to ask her for a rebate on the extra rent you pay as a result of her having an affair and leaving your dh!

Oh and get the proper calculation from CSA done!

There's a lot of parents being bullied by the other parent here. Stop pandering to them. If the kids don't visit because you've not bought them gold plated trainers I'd be tempted to say you'd be better off. Don't be held to ransom. It's doing no one any favours.