AIBU or is this normal these days?

[SultanOfPing]

I don't know if i'm completely out of touch, or if DH's ex and kids are completely taking the piss, so a couple of honest views would be appreciated... Basically, DH's ex wife has always been a bit 'grabby'. For the two boys, she gets about £150 more than the csa recommend - in total, close to £1200 a month for the pair of them. The £150 is made up of extra for clothes and dinner money. The two boys are 14 and 16, and the eldest is all set to go on to do A levels in September. A few weeks ago, he started hinting about new stuff for school. He asked for a leather jacket, boots, tshirts and jeans...we agreed on the jacket (it's not a cheap one that he's picked!) and two pairs of jeans. Anyway, the ex sent DH a text a couple of days ago...she's putting £500 of her own money (she doesn't work, so basically DH's/our money that we give her for the boys) towards clothes, footwear and books and expects us to match it. We have two young children of our own and, well, we just can't afford it. We rent a five bed house so the boys can have their own rooms, even though they only visit for a weekend every three weeks and half of school holidays. Anyway, as expected, DH's ex has gone mental. How DH is a bad parent, that he doesn't care, how he has no idea how hard it is for her (she actually left him for another bloke after carrying on behind his back for nearly two years and took the kids 300 miles away [and does nothing to help with visits]) and how he's going to alienate his boys if he's not careful. DH is stressing about it all because he's worried that he won't see his sons because they'll turn against him. Me? I wanna punch the bitch in the throat. Are teenagers really this expensive? Is this a normal demand for a 16yr old kid? We also give them pocket money that goes straight into their bank accounts, which they do nothing for (they don't help out in the kitchen or walk the dogs when they come up to stay, for example) and he has no intention of using any of that for his new wardrobe or books. This isn't the first time that she's asked for more money, and we always pay half (at least) towards uniforms and footwear - we also buy them everyday clothes, usually a couple of tshirts or a hoodie when i'm buying clothes for our two (2 & 4, so grow out of things quickly!). Are we being unreasonable by telling the boys' mum that we can't afford it (we'd have to get stuff on a credit card) or is it normal to fork out this much money? My friends all tell me that we do more than enough already but, well, they're my mates so possibly a bit biased?

cabrinha
"I also know that he didn't bother to stop her"

Blimey - you have NO IDEA of what may have been done/said/efforts made at the time. Or how difficult it may have been. My brother was in a similar situation and he would have ended up in a psychiatric hospital if he had challenged his ex on custody any more than he tried to.

Contributing £1200 a month PLUS all the extras described is more than generous OP.

URNOTBU.

I think she's stringing you along. She doesn't want you to buy half the list, she wants the cash so she can go shopping with him and "buy it herself"? My arse will she!

Notmuch - The CSA have had a number of different schemes over the years, the ex's wages weren't taken into account when the sums were done, thankfully mine aren't either. I have friends whose wages were factored in along with their hubby's - totally unfair, as the aim of the CSA is to put the child in the financial position that they'd be in if their parents were still together...so, why factor in the new wife's? I believe though that, once you're on a 'scheme', you stay on it despite what new schemes the CSA brings in.
Needs - indeed. DH made the choice not to drag the kids through the family court, and to keep his ex sweet in the hope that she didn't turn his kids completely against him or take them overseas. He's kicked himself several times over the years for not being tougher, but that wouldn't have done the kids any good. Better spoilt than overseas, I guess? His ex isn't a very nice person, even her friends admit that she can be difficult.

I have actually found that dss is costing us less now he is 15 as he doesn't seem to be growing as much/as quickly - mind you, he is 6'3" with size 12 feet so it'd be good if he didn't grow much more at all!

He is very fashion conscious but not to the extent of wanting new things all the time. We have a slightly different situation - dss lives with us (seen his dm for two nights in the last month) but dp still pays maints to the dm because he is scared the ex will keep dss away if he stops. We buy everything, pay for all school trips, uniform, obviously food, clothes, holidays, meals out, birthday parties, trips with mates.....

dm pays for none of the day to day stuff. But every now and then she buys him a SuperDry top or a pair of Nike trainers, neither of which we would entertain the cost of. She's like a female Disney dad but on his money.

I think it's awful that people use their kids in this way.

No, it's not normal for a teen to need this much spent on them. Yes, it is pretty normal for divorced parents to have these power struggles in which the kids are pawns.

It's miserable. As a step I can only advise you do your best to keep your head down and try to be detached about it. So, you're not being unreasonable that you can't afford it. But it's unreasonable that you are having to be involved, try to step back if you can.

cabrinha, my husband was in the same position with his wife whisking his children off despite the fact EW had got the marital home on the grounds she needed to be near us so the kids could come to us whenever they wanted which turned out to be 7 days a week and plenty of nights. We saw a solicitor who told us we would probably not be able to stop her taking them because they would ask the kids. They had been promised the world if they moved. My DH chose not to take her to court because he didn't want to put his kids through it and be the bad guy if he won. I didn't understand his decision at the time but now they are grown up, I can see his "putting the children first" in every scenario was the best one...they all came back eventually. My DH was not abdicating or backsliding his responsibilities as a parent, he was doing them in a way that worked for his kids and so may the OP's DH.
At 16, it might be time to give a clothing/book allowance to your SS. If it were me, I would reduce the monthly payment by £75 and pay it to your SS instead so he has money to buy what he sees fit. If he doesn't manage, he'll have to have text books for his Xmas present! I think it might be time for your DH to take a stand. It won't do his children any good to be shown a bullied father! As for the £500, I would be inclined to give an amount he can afford or ask to see the reading list. There is no reason to hand over money if you don't want to. Their clothes money is paid in with the maintenance so if you buy more, you are actually being generous. Let EW shout and scream. Once she realises you are not to be bullied, she'll have no choice but to give in. However, whatever you and your DH decide to do (it should be a joint decision), good luck.

I can't imagine being in your situation-it sounds very difficult!! Has the ex never worked?

Out - ouch, that's bang out of order of your dp's ex!! I honestly do try and stay out of most of the issues, and as I do most of the shopping, I probably buy the boys more stuff than their Dad so I think I'm quite reasonable about everything. Obviously, not this time though... I just think that, this time, DSS and his mum are taking the piss a bit.

I'd be saying you can't afford to give her the money and will use credit card to buy online what they need and have it shipped if she provides a list

YeOldMa - thank you!
Rollonthesummer - she hasn't worked in several years. Parents pay her rent, money from my DH, not sure if she's on the sick or works and it's just never mentioned? Both myself and DH learnt a long time ago that any questions about home or their mother result in a phone call telling DH that it's none of his business - no matter how innocent.

Why doesn't your h's ex work?

You sound like you're being very reasonable. He doesn't need an expensive leather jacket etc. He needs to get a job over the summer...

Tell the kids, next time they're round, what you pay for and just how much things cost.

I'd also start getting them to help around the house at yours too.

Flipping heck! I got £10.19 for my DD from my ex.

She is 18 now. The stuff I've done to keep her clothed, fed and a roof over her head.

£1200 ? a month ? WTF !!!

cabrinha, your comments are completely unfair.PSO are very difficult to obtain and typically a mum can move dc especially some years ago when 50:50 was uncommon..Mediation ahead of court often encourages the nrp to allow the rp to move if it makes like easier/better for the rp (usually mum).

Dh ex moved to be with her new bf, dh sought legal advice and was warned he stood no chance.He did eventually go to court when his ex wanted to banish him him from dc's life as she had a new partner/new family.

Some parents are manipulative and will do anything to get what.Dh ex did the same to the 2nd husband..is he also a dad who outsourced parenting or is it more likely some women are vindictive?.

When I went to college I didn't need a new wardrobe, didn't need any textbooks, nothing like that. It's fine if you want to spoil them a bit with new clothes but I honestly think £1000 between you both is completely ridiculous.

£1200 pm maintenance and her parents paying rent? Your partner's ex is in for a shock in a few years when her kids hit 18.

Where do you all live btw that people are wearing suits and business wear to sixth form and college? I'm in the North West and can't think of anyone I know that attended somewhere like that. I'm guessing OP/a lot of posters here are quite well off and in rich areas.

Jeans here, too! My sister's kids are in high school and their 6th formers wear jeans also. Step-son is also going to a jeans-wearing school - thankfully. We really couldn't stretch to designer suits!

I think business wear for sixth formers is utterly ridiculous. Most will go to university and will spend the next 3 years in jeans anyway. I can kind of see the point if they stay on at school and the rest of the younger kids are in school uniform but in a separate college they should surely be allowed to wear whatever they like.

That said, DD left sixth form college last year, we live in a fairly affluent area but non of the other kids there wore £500 leather jackets. I didn't even think leather jackets were particularly in fashion?

OP I think if you give her that extra money she will likely spend it on herself and get DSS a jacket that costs £100!! We give 16yr olds £20 a week in this house, DS1 eats 4000cal a day (ridiculous amount but he plays sport a lot) and even at that rate of eating I wouldn't have thought he costs more than £40 a week to feed.

Rather than thinking of it as giving money to the ex I think it would be nice if his dad took him shopping and got him something for school. Not £500 worth maybe but if you can afford to treat him to some nice trainers/a nice jacket he chooses. These things are important to some teens and he will likely appreciate it more if he sees it coming from his dad rather than going via his mum.

OP you ask whether it sounds like your stepsons/their mother are taking the piss, and to me, in all honesty? No.

He pays less than £600 pounds per child per month. That is considerably less than my teenagers 'cost' me. My son in particular - my weekly shop has gone up from £130 pounds to (currently) £210 over the past few years, with his huge appetite.

And this weekend I've taken my son shopping for new summer clothes, as NOTHING from last summer fit him. And he's worn through his trainers during the school year so needed those too. That stuff alone - to last the summer - was £300. And this is before I've bought new school shoes, rugby boots and probably new trainers again - they wear down quickly - and new uniform and casual winter wear for weekends and a new coat. I'm putting all that off until August.

Now, if I couldn't afford it then I'd have had other options. Primark, charity shops, EBay etc... And if their father genuinely can't afford a new wardrobe for sixth form then his son will have to purchase at least some options from those places, since he can't get a part time job as he's away every 3rd weekend. But I would leave it for your husband to realise that he can't afford it, in that case, and try to have as little involvement as possible yourself. The boys may well be upset that they don't get what some of their peers do get, and it will only make it harder for them to take if they feel that came from you rather than their father.

bingo I believe OP and her partner have already offered to take the boy shopping for what he needs and were happy to do so, however ex has disagreed and asked that they give her the £500 instead for her to sort it out herself.

Your high earning husband outsourced bring up his own kids, so he should stop whining about the cost of it.

Cabrinha I know who's sounding bitter here, and it isn't the OP. I think you are projecting.
I also think the ex-wife here is being dishonest somewhere along the line - she's very keen to not ever have anyone else involved in the buying of anything for them. I too think she is taking the piss.

Somerville I'm not sure what kind of lifestyle you have but I believe £600 pm per child is more than enough. £40 per week was more than enough for my mother to feed me as a teenager; all meals, snacks etc. I think this just goes to show that OPs question is a matter of perspective as to the lifestyle some people are used to/expect. However I would not say it is "the norm".

I was buying my own clothes pretty much at 16 with pocket money and weekend job money so no I don't think you should have to pay that much! He is definitely old enough to understand about money. They sound like they need a kick up the bum and a good talking to from dad about everything! And who cares if it gets back to mum, the boys will resent her if she tries to stop them seeing their dad! ( stable, sane and secure mother from a divorced mum and dad)

£40 per week to feed a teenager?!! Don't know when you were a teenager and what you ate, but forget that! School lunches alone is more than half of that.

The children's father can clearly afford that maintenance amount because he has been paying it for a long time, and then he decided he could afford more children.

Renotry Why is there any need to get permission from the ex to take your son shopping when his is with you? It's just a normal thing you do with your kids surely? I'm sure the son won't say no to a nice treat!