AIBU to let my children cry at night?

[LivingOnTheDancefloor]

My 2yo DS sleeps through most nights, but on occasions he will wake up and cry during the night. If I don't go to settle him, he will usually fall back to sleep by himself but it can take anytime between 5 and 45min.
If I go, he calms down immediately.
However, from experience I learned that if I start going to his room to calm him down, he will wake more and more often the following nights.

My husband thinks this is not fair to the neighbors and we should try to calm him down as fast as possible. I am thinking it is best for everybody to keep training my son to sleep through. AIBU?
I live in a terraced house, on both sides the houses have been converted to flats, so lots of neighbors. We live on a very busy and noisy street.

"Can't we just accept that different parents do different things and that is fine?"

Wise words Maybebaby

Savemefromwine- I think somewhere upthread, OP said that the crying was intermittent rather than constant for 45 mins

Yes YABVVVVVU. Settle your crying child. Imagine if you were upset for some reason and someone left you alone, in the dark, to cry yourself to sleep. He's 2 years old ffs. Comfort him.

Parenting is a 24 hour thing. Your job doesn't stop because you want to go to sleep.

Sorry if that sounds aggressive and I've not read all the replies. But your OP made me feel so sad

FFS comfort the distressed child. That's your job as a parent. I'm shocked and saddened by the idea that 2 year olds are manipulative bastards who need training. No, they are babies, who need help to learn to sleep safely and soundly. There's a world of difference between a 2 yr old who 'needs mummy's right index finger to get to sleep' and a child who wakes up in the night.
It's part of your job of parenting. Why is this so hard to understand? The less fuss you make about it, the less fuss there will be.
A friend's son was sexually assaulted at infant school by a fellow pupil. The first she knew of it was him turning up in their bed, night after night. She could see he needed reassurance, and let him in. On the third night he said part of what had happened.
Shit happens to kids and sometimes they need reassurance.
Let them hug you at night. You'll sleep.

Shimmy point taken

Thanks Saveme- it wasn't meant to be harsh- I thought your post was v measured! but people keep talking about the non-stop 45 min crying- so thought I'd set record straight!

I'm in the same situation except ds is 3. He won't fall asleep alone without crying (loudly and for ages). I've never been able to crack it because you can hear bloody everything in our flats and it would be really unfair on our neighbours.

So yanbu to want to leave him, but it's U for neighbours to have to listen to screaming for up to 45mins regularly.

I wouldnt leave it that long. There is sometimes a difference between proper crying and winging tho... my LO sometimes wakes up in the night and shouts and winges and i will just leave him for 45 mins if its that and he will just go back to sleep. If he is properly crying tho i would go in because he might be hurt or sick. Also sometimes he chatters to himself and id just leave him to that as well. If your LO is properly screaming i wouldnt leave him for as long as 45 mins.

5-10 minutes okay. 45 minutes not fair on kid or neighbours

People read all the OP comments,
Baby is not crying continually for 45 mins.

If the baby is hardly crying then why is the OPs OH worried about the neighbours?

I would make night time waking Dad's job.

I can't help feeling DH will not be so enthused about always getting up to DC if it is him doing it.

What I did at that kind of age was put my DS into a single bed. Stairgate on the stairs so if he woke at night he could come and find me.

Of course he didn't at first so he'd wake up and cry, I'd call through to him "I'm here, come through". Yes - probably more disturbing to neighbours initially - but after 2-3 nights of that he never ever cried at night unless he was ill or having a nightmare. He'd come padding through and either get into bed for a cuddle or just check I was there and then go back to bed. Sometimes he wanted to come and chat or play or have extra things and I just would respond sleepily and basically make it clear I was sleeping and wouldn't do a lot other than an arm over him - if he wanted to talk I'd gently say ssssh, if he kept fidgeting I'd lie him down still. If he was really disturbing me then I'd wake up a little and say "If you want to talk/move/whatever he was doing you need to go back to your bed." And he would, or if he was reluctant I'd take him. Then I'd settle him back down and stay for a little bit if he was v unsettled or just say to him that I was tired and needed to sleep in my bed now and he was normally okay.

It doesn't have to be a choice between leaving him to settle and going in to him all the time, so this is just another idea. I think that letting them have free movement is less disturbing to everyone and it also helps break the habit part because they actually have to expend some effort to get what they want rather than lying there and crying. They can still have it! But I found that it cut night wakings down. Whether it was because he felt reassured that he could come to me any time he wanted to (and so needed/wanted to less) or whether it's because he woke and thought "Where's Mummy? Oh she's next door. I could go but it's cold outside of the covers" and dropped back off before he summoned up the energy to do it, I don't know, but I had initially been going in to him and like you I found it happened once and then kept happening, whereas this was a novelty when he first was allowed to do it and then after that it dropped off quite sharply.

Reading this through again, I'm astounded that some people are more concerned about how their neighbours feel than their child. Seriously. People leaving their children to cry reminds me of the NSPCC advert where poor Miles learns that nobody comes if he cries. And no, this is not an over exaggeration.

You know what, if you look up the effects of high cortisol levels on the brain, you wouldn't dare leave your child crying for 45 fucking minutes. At this point it doesn't matter if it's continuous or not. Your child is distressed. But if you PPs that agree with CIO would rather fork out for loads of therapy for your kids in later life instead of doing your job now well that's your prerogative.

Kilgrave I think that's overstepping somewhat, I really do. I understand it's an emotive topic but that's dramatising to the highest degree.

Constantly and excessively high cortisol do have lasting effects, BUT professionals are at pains to point out that although cortisol levels do go up with crying, this is nowhere near the damaging levels referred to, which typically result from genuine cases of neglect or abuse where a child is either hurt or the vast majority of their needs regularly and systematically ignored. You'll probably refer me to the study that showed babies' cortisol levels remained as high as when they were crying on nights they fell asleep without; and I will refer you to the fact that this study was conducted in a sleep lab - an unfamiliar and stressful environment. Don't go scaring the bejesus out of some poor mother thinking she's damaged her baby for having let them whinge on and off.

Please don't compare a normal, loving parent to a neglectful or abusive one. Unlike cases the NSPCC has to deal with I have no doubt OP feeds her child. She clothes her child. She loves and comforts child. She IS parenting her child - she IS doing her job. There is no harm suggesting gentler ways for her to do that, and in fact she's said she takes that on board and will look into it. Good for her.

I'm also sure we could all look at each other's parenting and say "god, feeding your child crap like that, I hope you're prepared to pay out for all their medical bills in the future. Poor kid", or "letting your child get away with behaviour like that, I hope you're prepared to stump up all the legal bills when they find themselves in court when they're older - poor kid!", or "doing x,y,z with your child, that's cruel, I'd never do that, they'll end up in therapy" - god it infuriates me! It't not helpful, it's not kind and I find it arrogance of the highest order.

Note: I'm not a CIO advocate, I breastfeed and cosleep - if that matters. But I hate HATE this whole "it's the kids I feel sorry for" attitude, as if bleeding-heart concern making hurtful sweeping judgements about other parents more palatable.

eatsleep is talking sense.

I don't agree with CIO either but the level of hysteria on this thread is a ridiculous.

Shimmy Thanks for involving your partner in the discussion. We had a similar approach to what you described.

Regarding all the stories of teens ending up with issues/depression because of crying as babies, I can see the idea, but how do you KNOW it was from the crying? Children go through so much, I am sure some people believe that teen issues are due to parents fighting, parents leaving them all day to go to work (absolutely not saying it is wrong to go to work!!), bad diet, too much TV... In my opinion it is likely that issues later in life are caused by a set of factors, I wouldn't say crying at night will automatically lead to troubled teens... but agree that it can have an impact in some cases

For me I believe the crying at night was just symptomatic of my parents parenting. They would just 'shut off' whenever they felt I didn't 'deserve' their attention. It felt like I had to meet criteria to get affection - be this hurt, be this poorly etc etc. Exhausting as a child trying to work out when you deserved attention and when you didn't. And I believe left me when a permenant sense of insecurity / not being worthy. All this is symbolised for me by the memories of being alone and scared at nighttime, knowing my parents were near by but I wasn't allowed a hug.

eatsleep is talking a lot of sense, agreed.
Also- if someone wants to play the cortisol card -then I'd refer you back to my lovely and extremely attentive friend whose child still cries most nights at the age of 5 and she will not try even the most subtle take on controlled crying. Do you think 5 years of very regular crying might have had an impact?!
To be honest- we none of us really know and something will be proven scientifically one minute and rubbished the next. I was a bag of anxiety during my first pregnancy worrying about all this "scientific" stuff- cortisol/adrenal glands- I'm fucking up my baby before they're even born!! I take things much more with a pinch of salt now- even Oliver James, a psychologist I rate, has made plenty of U-turns- one minute he's stating that personality is hardwired by age 3, the next conceding that it's much more elastic than that!
Sorry, I digress, but think carefully before you call a decent parent criminally neglectful.
By the way- me and my brother were utterly cosseted as kids- do you think that's why I had such anxiety in pregnancy? Is it why my brother's a little bit odd?! It's ludicrous to make these leaps.

Ha, Shimmy, you sound like me :D

I was extremely anxious in pregnancy. I did so much research into this whole cortisol thing once ds was born; every time I came out of the shower to find him crying I worried his neurons had been dying off in their droves! A little perspective is a wonderful thing.

In direct contrast to batterie.....I was left crying at night and also remember it. I remember feeling furious, absolutely raging, at not getting attention but I also learned that when mum said 'it's bedtime, time for sleep, I love you but will see you in the morning' no amount of raging was going to get me my way. I also found it strangely comforting that I wasn't left wondering would she or wouldn't she come and give me attention if I started up. I've grown into a confident and extremely happy adult. I love my parents and think they did a great job. I always had clear boundaries but in the context of clear love and support. So Batteries, I don't think your problem with your parents was being 'abandoned' at night.

I will say that I'm sure there was a type of cry my parents would respond to. I know they wouldn't have left me crying in my own vomit. But what we are discussing here is habitual crying at night and I think the OP is handling it well under the assumption that there is a lot of love and attention during waking hours.

45 minutes leaving a toddler to cry is awful

A minute or two ok any longer please go and see to the poor child

He could be having nightmare, soiled nappy/bed, been sick

Anything

Don't ignore them it's a shame. It hardly more than a baby.

He not it

that's the thing, eatsleep: pregnancy and child-rearing are intellectually/ emotionally overwhelming and we are bombarded with "information" and advice that actually isn't helpful and can make harridans of us all- I remember being appalled that a colleague of mine wasn't breastfeeding- I was extremely judgemental (hopefully, not openly). Now, I realise it was because I was having a thoroughly miserable time breastfeeding but doggedly sticking at it, so why should she bottle-feed? I bottle-fed my second after 2 weeks' breastfeeding and feel no compunction about that.
I think battery and dolly are interesting examples of the same behaviour being interpreted differently and, as battery says, it's basically down to the overall parenting. We've always said there'll be loads of things we get wrong but they will be tempered by a secure and loving background.