...to be considering leaving?

[shinyredbookcase]

On paper, I have the perfect life. I have a well paid job I love with flexible (but long hours). I have healthy, happy children and a nice house in a nice area. DH is a stay at home dad and he's really good at it, very committed and involved with the children, has great relationships with each of them and additionally he is very practically supportive of me. I have friends and get out to see them once or twice per month.

DH hasn't touched or spoken to me - other than practical things to do with the kids, without making eye contact - for twelve days. We've not had sex for a month, and we rarely have sex more than once per month. I can't remember the last time we spent time together alone: once the kids are in bed he says he needs time alone and spends time on his computer or out running. I've checked his phone and computer (there are no passwords) and there's no porn, weird emails etc. He is a bit less tech savvy than me but more than capable of a secret phone / private browsing etc. Though I just don't see it in his character.

I've tried to speak to him about the coldness and distance in our relationship and his lack of interest in any kind of emotional or physical contact with me many times. His parents are the same and but he knows I don't consider this normal and that I am unhappy. He knows the very specific things he does that make me feel unwanted and unhappy. He's asked me to initiate sex and tell him I want to spend time together in the evenings, but when I do he consistently turns me down - he's either tired, needs time alone, had planned to watch something on the television, etc etc etc.

I've been blunt with him - he says he isn't gay and he doesn't masturbate. There's no health problems that I know of - he eats well, is physically fit. I am of average appearance but no different to when we met. A tiny bit heavier but of medium build and good personal hygiene. I shower before bed.

I understand a SAHP needs time alone to recharge and can get 'touched out' but our kids at school age and the youngest is just finishing Year One so for the past two years he's been alone 9-3.15 every day. He does the bulk of the housework but I clean bathrooms, do ironing and cooking at weekends and share the school drop offs.

I'm not sure where to go from here. I've asked him if he wants to split up and he says the children need him, he is planning a professional IT course to get him back into work now the kids are all at school, and that I'm asking too much. I can't imagine the rest of my life like this.

Whatever the OP's DH may or may not have, doesn't really alter the situation for the OP. Something she mentioned herself. But some people on the spectrum have commented who still would not dream to abuse their partners like the OP's DH does. My brother is someone with highly functioning Asbergers and yet he doesn't act this controlling or cruel. Each case is probably pretty unique but reading about his attitude and behaviour, it sounds far more like someone who is manipulative and emotionally abusive. Until recently, it appears the DH had the emotional upper hand with the OP pleading and being distraught over his coldness and rejection. But since she has detached herself and stopped reacting in a familiar pattern, her DP is becoming more unhinged and his moods more volatile. That is typical when you remove their control and change how you react to their manipulation. The calmer the OP appears and the less she shows signs of being hurt by his coldness and rejection, the nastier he gets.

As someone who spent almost ten years with a malignant narcissist what you describe sounds very familiar. His behaviour will become more spiteful. This is not healthy for you or your kids. And I worry about how he will use the children as weapons against you in case of a separation. He won't be reasonable, his world is so black and white. You are either with him and agree with his world vision or you will be his foe. You need to prepare for an exit plan and work out custody arrangements etc. But living with someone so malignant is unhealthy for all of you. Your kids are going to pick up on this. No one should be living in such a tense environment. I really feel for you as forever having to tread on eggshells around someone is exhausting.

I have just skimmed through this thread and have been thinking this might be ASD/Asperger's. My DS has ASD and a lot of what you have said sounds familier. There is a book called "Loving Mr Spock" by Barbara Jacobs and Tony Attwood written specifically for partners of people with Asperger's. Maybe you could buy or borrow a copy from a library and see if it sounds familier. If you feel it could be this then there is also a charity called Action for Aspergers (can be found with a google search) which helps families of people with the condition, it might be worth contacting them.

Another one here who was in a similar situation with my ex. I loved the ground he walked on, and we had a terrific relationship at the start. But when he started a new course he started resenting me - because he resented himself. He was not the great whizz that he thought he'd be, he started failing the course, and, of course, it had to all be my fault, because it couldn't possibly be his, could it? Whereupon every single thing I did was wrong and he didn't want to touch me or speak to me...

I don't even think he knew why he was doing it. He's Aspergers too, and I think all he knew was that he was hurting and failing and I wasn't making it all better, therefore I was part of the cause. He eventually left me, under rather bizarre circumstances (deciding he was in love with a girl on his course, without having had any contact or conversation with her, yet they were going to 'be together'. They weren't, and aren't). He told everyone he'd had a breakdown. He hadn't, he just couldn't cope with not being brilliant at everything.

Sorry shiny. I think your 'D'H has come to realise his limitations. Maybe, in his head, you are 'holding him back' - maybe he's not doing as fabulously as his imagination told him he would - and it must be you, mustn't it, it can't be him?

Shiny try doing this online test as though you were him, and see how it scores. aspergerstest.net/aq-test/
It's not a diagnostic, but is usually used a starting point to give to a GP to ask for a referral. If he is undiagnosed AS, he's very likely to be quite baffled by how the NT world operates, particularly (excuse stereotype but based on your posts) the emotional and non-logical side of things.
If you get quite a high score as 'him' then maybe it's time to try and not judge him from an NT perspective and investigate the world of AS and see things from his perspective so you can understand.

Living with someone with neurological diversity is challenging, but it can work. I've not read the book that Cheesecake recommends, but based on the author Tony Attwood who is one of the foremost in having adults with AS/ASD recognised, I'd order it anyway.

You've tried so hard to make things work, please don't give up until you've investigated this angle.

Agreed, OP. He may or may not have ASD, but it doesn't change things either way, other than perhaps being a useful prism through which to view the behaviour that brought you to this point. Making sense of that may become more important once you've moved beyond the crisis immediately at hand. But ASD or not, he's also behaving like an asshole.

I've blocked him from being able to text or email me because he's been sending me horrible messages. He now has to speak to my face if he wants something, and if he's nasty or passive aggressive, I'm leaving the room. I'm otherwise being civil and just getting on with my life.

This is a really shit state of affairs, and no way to negotiate family life. Honestly, how long do you think you can keep this up without going up the looby loo tree? How long is his course?

I don't really have any advice because there has been some great people on here already.

I have to say though, he is treating you you very very badly. The more information you are sharing has moved it from being cold and distant to being actively nasty (and in my opinion abusive)

In your situation I would be making plans to leave, seeing solicitor, unblocking and saving the abusive written messages etc.
In the short term your right the break up would be awful but in the long term my feeling is I (if I was in your situation) would look back and think I can't believe I stuck it for so long what a waste of those years.

Good luck, were around for support when you need it.

By the wAy my partner and step daughter both are asd and yes your dh behaviour sound sometimes similar but let me tell you neither of them would ever treat me so shoddily, and if they do through panic or frustration etc they do eventually recognise enough to show me that they did not deliberately want to upset me (even if he doesn't apologise) and show me that they care!

Your dh just doesn't so even if he is on the autistic spectrum that is not an excuse to treat you like shit all the time!

his course is for three years, but he's getting until January to settle in, get used to it and find a way to deal with his stress. If that doesn't happen, he is leaving.

I feel much stronger than I did - less hurt by his behaviour, and, to be honest, less interested in finding out a reason for it. If he has a non-neurotypical issue, or he's depressed or anxious, or he secretly hates me for some reason he's deciding, in his wisdom, to keep secret from me while refusing to leave me for it, or if there's anything else - well, nothing excuses how he has been behaving. I've had a cold hard think - and rather than being sad that he doesn't seem to like me, I am realising that his passive aggression, his pettiness and his inflexibility, the way he genuinely seems to think that if I differ from him, I am lying or mentally ill - all add up to me not liking him very much. I'm sorry that it is like this and I am hoping it is stress and things will settle down. But if they don't, I am not willing to be his punch bag.

I'm really glad to hear that shiny!

I still think you should use these next few months to prepare and research what your position will be. Get advice from a solicitor, start saving abusive emails get your finances and paperwork sorted etc just so your ready. I'm not suggesting creating a dossier to screw him over but with the children involved you need to prepare for the future esp if that includes separation and divorce

Things will be hard until January so use here/friends to keep you going. You might find it easier though as there's been a shift in your head.

So pleased to hear that! It sounds like things have become very toxic, and at least separating it like this in your mind will protect you against his attempts of mental abuse.

Shiny

I can't imagine living like this. Great that you're making plans. Good luck.

Thank you.

I am not sure if I should tell him he has a deadline, or just keep it to myself and watch what happens.

I do think that me refusing to pander to him and not get upset when he is spoiling for a fight is making him escalate, which makes me think that this isn't a case of him having a non-typical neurology, but him just needing me, for whatever reason, to depend on him or be begging him for attention.

I think if I do tell him, he'll use it to start a fight, or throw it back in my face, or take it as a challenge, or ignore it or laugh in my face. And I'm not really interested in a discussion with him. What I want to see is him getting a grip on his own life and own emotions, and starting to express himself directly as an adult. If what he expresses is that he's got a problem with me, I am open to hearing that. I am not open to being on the receiving end of abusive or catty remarks.

I think I will just go on as I have been doing, information gather, and see where we are once he'd had chance to settle into this course.

Don't tell him.... if you do, he could change his behaviour to something more compliant until then and later revert.... you need to see if he will settle down to something more positive.

I knew a man like that once, his parents were also devoid of emotion and lived separate lives together. Maybe he was a bit on the spectrum idk, I think of him as being a stoic in the tradition sense. He never experienced emotions 'physically' but explained he had them in his head as a sort of 'mental thought'. He tried to be like everyone else and fit in but eventually accepted he could never have what they had and gave up trying.

He also preferred his own company and needed a lot of it, but also put a lot of effort into acting normal for the 10% of time he spent with other people. This made him seem perfect during the time I did spend with him. He never had any drive to achieve something, it wasn't laziness it was just a lack of the 'emotion' that creates motivation, he didn't seem to need or want money, sex, or anything really.

A drunken weekend and he got a women pregnant. He never wanted children but was very determined his child would not turn out like him (or his parents). He intellectualized that the best thing to do was to move in and create a family, he said he loved the woman but didn't act romantic or like he was excited by her. He became the SAHD because the mother had a good well paid job. Apparently he became almost a perfect dad, worked very hard, did everything for his DC, cooked, cleaned, entertained etc.

The issue was that all the effort he could muster for the outside world was transferred from the mother to the DC. As soon as DC was asleep he needed to be alone. Mother got nothing, he couldn't look at her, talk to her or be in same room as her. It wasn't that he hated her it was because he was literally unable to cope with the level of emotional interaction that both DC and mother needed. The mother asked for more attention, went down the therapy route and all the things mentioned in this thread but the fact remained that he couldn't cope with any level of emotional contact beyond the child and the more he was asked to explain what he felt the more withdrawn he became. All the well intentioned interventions to give them quality time together, more intimacy etc made it harder and harder for him to cope.

2 years later she walked out, thinking he was an evil emotionless bastard. He did not understand what he had done wrong and why she was being so cruel. He was given full residency and the mother paid child support.

I got in touch years later and found out the conclusion to the story. The breakup destroyed the man, he still doesn't know what he did wrong. Someone he loved (albeit not in an emotional way) hated him, his life had been one long burden loving a child that drained him of the ability to interact with society and it all caused him to have a mental breakdown. He is just a hermit now waiting for life to pass him by and ironically ending up in tears every night. I think the only thing that stops him killing himself is that he succeeded in one thing, his DC broke the circle and managed to have the normal emotional interaction with the world that he couldn't.

You will be leaving the children as well

A judge will be reluncant to change the status quo

OP. I agree you should probably keep that deadline in your head and let it underpin a fact-finding and forward-planning mission, rather than detonate a nuclear reaction. I really wish you well in what sounds like an awful - and tricky - situation.

Anon, that's such a sad story. For both of them.

OP, hope things are going ok.

Name changer here. Wanted to say how much your posts have helped me, Shiny. I have almost cried with relief to see my feelings described so exactly. My DH isn't like yours but there are similar underlying themes. I'm slowly coming to terms with the implications and trying to work out how to live from now on. I want to be with him but he has to help me to change things. Hope it's going to work out well for you 💐

This thread just came up on the 'your on list' so I read the whole thing, beyond the point when i disengaged before. I wonder how the OP is. Really hope something has changed, maybe the course has altered things. My husband is still at SAHD. Kids in school / nursery. He's not emotionally distant like the OPs DH & overall we've been getting on better recently but I do still worry about him long term . . . Want him to get back to work for his own confidence and ultimately I do worry that it could damage us long term

When I was a sahp I still had full access to the finances as we have a joint bank account. Having to ask for money isn't great for relationships. It's a bit demeaning

Shinyredbookcase, I hope you'll be able to come back and tell us how you are. Things are slowly getting better here as I get my head round the implications of DH's diagnosis. It was your posts about your DH that helped me to join the dots at last and I will always be grateful for that.

Is he autistic?

This has answered so many questions about me as a mother thank you I have given my child all of my emotions and now cannot deal with my dh to the point we hardly talk it's like living hell and I don't know who's responsible only that we never seem to work it out