my son is 48, but totally lost

[dunnowhatsbest]

please help someone.
my son is 48.
he was given an excellent start in life, education and support.

before he even began to work, at 21, a divorced older woman became pregnant, and this was the beginning of events that have led to where he is today.
over the following 2 years he couldn't earn enough to support them, so she decided she was better off on benefits so she didn't "need" my son anymore.

Although he was needed to pay for expensive private education for his son, which she demanded, threatening to withhold access if he didn't or couldn't pay.

he did pay throughout his son's education, which left him in massive debts which he has to this day.

he was made redundant, and searched for suitable employment to continue paying, but was unable to manage to earn enough.

I supported him financially as much as I could, rent/car/clothes.

eventually with everything falling down around his ears, I paid for him to go abroad to live with his older sister, which he has done for the last four years.

but, this is my worry.
my son's visa has expired, and he needs to return home.

he expects to live with me (I am in my mid 70's), and support him.
he is penniless , still has debts, no prospects, no credit history to apply for rental accommodation, no car.
simply the clothes he stands up in.

I don't know what to do.
I haven't been in brilliant health, my husband had a heart attack last year.
the worry of what I can do to help is giving me sleepless nights.
what can I do?

When you don't allow your children to learn to stand independently on their own two feet, don't be surprised or complain when they are incapable of standing independently on their own two feet.

Surely he'll have to go to the council, declare himself unintentionally homeless (ie. Not move in with you first or you'll be stuck with him) move into the B&B or hostel provided, then either sign onto Jobseeker's allowance or go on the sick? If he has to start from scratch then so be it! Many others have to do so and at his age he certainly isn't your concern financially.

When your son first told you that his ex was threatening to cut off contact with his son if he did not pay private school fees, did you not tell him he had legal redress? If not why?

Surely it would have been a lot cheaper to pay for him to take her to court than to pay for private school ad infinitum?

(Not even sure a court would allow her to take the child to Australia without his consent if it could be shown that he was a regular carer of the child.)

Why did you carry on helping him and so indirectly sub your grandson's education when your grandson was a grown man? Would it not have been kinder to point out to him that neither of you ought to do that, and that most youngsters who do not come from wealthy families manage by a combination of loans and working in the holidays?

How open have you been with his son during his adolescence and later about your own financial situation and your needs? How often have you found ways in which he can help you?

yes, I did tell/advise him regarding the legal route.
he kept replying that she would refuse him access if he did that.

of course I explained his options, but he was too afraid to go against her.

even increasing his debt, (they had split years earlier) by demanding a car as her one was very old. he took yet another loan to buy the car, explaining that it was for his son to get to school, more than for her.
of course it would have been cheaper in the long run to take the legal route, but he wouldn't go against her demands/needs.
I spent many years telling him he was destroying himself financially, but he said it was for his son.
I have explained numerous times, I am retired now, and not in a position to help him financially.
but now, after 4 years, he must return to the uk, there is nothing more I can do.
the whole family have told him for years he is destroying himself, but his reply is, it's for my son.

logicalthinking, my 2 daughters have very successful working/personal lives, one is ready to retire at 52 in her own right. so both have been allowed to stand on their own two feet.
obviously they made suitable life choices, but their brother it seems did not , despite all the many years of advice he received from us all.
I am not complaining about my son.
I am concerned that at his age, his life is still financially in a mess.

OP, have you ever actually said to him "I explained to you that if you did not do X, I would not be able to help you? You chose to do X and you will have to find a solution because I cannot." And then stood by it?

Do you yourself think you have different expectations of your female children?

Or do you think it is something about him that makes him unable to understand the basic laws of consequences? Undiagnosed SN of some sort?

And conversely something about your daughters which means they would not take advantage?

op your son will find someone else to take him under their wing and will still be blaming his ex (and others) in 20 years

There are many men and women that simply do not grow up and blame everyone else for the choices they have made and you are playing along with this. They will even go along with others to allow themselves to still be victims of their own choices

If he has been living with his sister why hasn't he been putting money aside, why didn't he go to court, why didn't he stay here and work he will have an answer for all these but the simple truth is he will always have an excuse but you don't have to excuse him for being this way he chooses to be

Bloody hell Barbarossa !

Yes it is. But you keep bailing him out has not made him a more responsible human being, in fact its made him less so because he's always known he can rely on you to come to his aid. He's almost 50 years old!!!!! For goodness sake, tell him the buck stops right here. He needs to become self supporting for the first time in his sad life. And if that means cutting off his 27-year-old son at long last, so be it. Quite honestly it would do them both a favour to make them both stand on their own two feet.

11 month pregnancy. Is the son actually his child?

Barbarossa want some pie and mash with that??

If your son is paying for the son/grandson to be at university he must be earning while he is living abroad.
However, you do not know how much he is paying.

Before your son returns to UK he will need to have a job that pays for all his bills, and accomadation. He can apply for jobs whilst abroad. Some jobs come with free accomadation like working in hotels.
If he wishes to rent privately a deposit of one or two months rent is normally needed in advance and a reference, that includes a room in a shared house.

Social housing seems to be unlikely, due to some councils having 27,000 people on their waiting list. He will not be a high priority.

If your son is returning to the UK surely he must have a plan ?
He should have saved some money for his return to the UK
Can your daughter lend him some money ?

It doesnt make sense that he is paying to keep someone at university, but has no money himself !

You obviously brought your son up to be very responsible, as he's supported his son throughout his education. I can tell you - as a University lecturer - that most Masters students are self-supporting, either they get a part-time job or they take out a student loan to finance themselves through study. So he can let his son stand on his own feet now, especially as he's so broke. I have no doubt that your grandson will completely understand.

With that burden off his shoulders, your son will be able to apply for jobs and relocate anywhere in the country, which is a great plus-point for him. You might give him a month's accommodation with you to enable him to get a job and spend time with yourself and his father.

I moved back to the UK five years ago and it's a big thing to start over, but it's also very liberating. Get your son to sign up to some employment agencies in his field and he should very quickly be feeling more positive. Who knows where he'll be by the time he's 50?

You are 70 years old, you love your son, you don't want him to hate you, you don't want him to think that you don't love him, it is difficult, phone up and steer him to go to the council and apply for accomodation, they should give him some and he needs to sign on, (don't tell them he has been out of the country tho) get benefits and then he can grow up, keeping him and looking after him will keep his brain at 17 years old, it's a know fact, many physiologists will tell you this.
Help him by all means, but don't look after him.
By the way are you sure the boy is his?? The woman sounds so horrid, that she could of picked him because he was a sweet kind sort of chap?? DNA test I think is in order, ask the son, he is old enough to understand, if he ever gets to see him?
Is he on the sons birth cert?? It makes a difference.
Good luck and be strong x

I think Lisawordbird does make a good point - your son clearly is quite responsible in some ways - you have helped him but he has also worked and put himself through hardship in order to support his own son. So perhaps not that he is wilfully irresponsible, but rather that he has learnt particular values. As others have said, you can only 'retrain' his thinking in this respect by redrawing your own values very clearly and forcing him to adjust his expectations accordingly. It may be less of a wrench than you expect, who knows. If you have never asserted your real expectations by following them through in your actions, then it seems silly to complain that he always takes you up on your offers of help. Not meant to trivialize your concern here at all, just wondering if he might actually take it better than you anticipate.

Was meant to read "redrawing your own boundaries "

runnerselbow Mon 16-May-16 01:27:08

"So perhaps not that he is wilfully irresponsible, but rather that he has learnt particular values. As others have said, you can only 'retrain' his thinking in this respect by redrawing your own values very clearly and forcing him to adjust his expectations accordingly. "

This is very well put. It seems as if both your son and you have a habit of dealing with child-related problems by throwing money at them. This may seem like the easiest solution at the time, but in actual fact people, even young people, are often better helped by showing them that you trust them to manage for themselves.

It's that old thing about "give a man a fish and you help him for a day". Your son seems to be replicating learnt behaviour by giving his son regular fishes instead of teaching him to fish for himself.But it may not be too late to change. And it is better for him to change now, while he is still young enough to work, rather than in 20 years time when you may well be gone and he is too old to work.

GDarling to sign on you have to provide proof you've been made unemployed e.g. letter from employer ending your contract. You also need to provide wage slips and a P45. Lying to them is not a good idea.

I don't understand why people insist on posting inaccurate information about things they obviously don't know anything about: those posters who have insisted only 1st year undergraduates get accommodation, this just isn't true. Most universities have housing, sometimes on campus, for graduate students. It may well be that the OP is being taken for a ride, but I don't think it's helpful to provide false information in order to prove the point...

Sorry OP, but it sounds to me as if you raised a mollycoddled hobbledehoy who has always been able to rely on his mother to bail him out. And now you've realised that he will keep looking to you to bail him out, despite your age/health problems. He's incapable of standing on his own two feet because he's never had to.

You have to be brutally honest with him and tell him that he's an adult (and has been for 30 years!), and it's long since been time that he fends for himself. You can't go on like this - it's not fair on you and it's actually unkind to him. He has to learn to look after himself and face the consequences for his own actions.

If your son does come to live with you temporarily then you will be able to draw up a tenancy agreement and housing benefit will pay you rent. He can still be on the council waiting list and then claim job seekers until he gets work. They will help him into work.

If not then an organization called Porch light may be able to help him.

Has your son got an undiagnosed anxiety, autistic or depressive health challenge/illness please?

What does your son say when you tell him you may not be able to house him?

Wishing you the very best of help as it must be very confusing for you at 70 especially if you have health problems.

Do you find you have a strong attachment to your son and find it hard yourself to let go??

Most grandparents support their grandchildren, that's normal, school coats, shoes , holidays and education fees to name a few.

Surely this is family and what we do when we care for each other? however we should do it in moderation??

Tolerance love and understanding at home facilitates a peaceful community, then society and then hopefully world peace. Its all a learning experience before we move off this earth...3 score years and 10 is not a long time in the bigger picture, life is short and full of illusions!!

Anyway good luck to you all

I think everything you've done had been with the very best of intentions and I personally think children should always have a place in your home no matter how old they are. I've made some shitty life choices purely because nobody did have my back there was no plan b and that didn't do me much good either. At least if you Molly coddle as some call it you can look yourself in the mirror.

P.S.

You will be surprised at how many peoples lives are financially in a mess but its hidden.

Some people have large motor vehicles which are about £25k of debt, they don't own then outright, and then on top of that numerous credit card debts to the tune of £20k average and then on top of that high mortgage debt which they can just about manage as interests are so very, very low.

A few hikes on the mortgage interest rates to say 8% will put many people into the same position as your son in just 6 months... beware of judging others too harshly when we are possibly 6 months away from the same financial mess!

I think the time has come for my son to make his own arrangements regarding his housing and work.
I have just emailed him asking exactly what preparations he making for his return to the uk.
waiting for a reply, hopefully we can talk tonight.

he is fine when responsibility or decisions are taken out of his hands
he is definitely a follower, not leader.
although he is prepared to work for long hours, if he is "led" and given instruction.
he has many qualifications, and opinions of his own.

i don't have exceptional attachment to him, no more than your average mother.

he had a relationship a while back, but didn't want to commit.
he is like a feather blowing in the wind.
yet he always smiles, but just goes which way the wind blows.

I know that must have been hard but I think your making the right decision .