"wouldn't you be embarrassed to PAY someone else clean up after you?"

[schrodcat]

Seething. SEETHING. I proposed getting a cleaner because I honestly think we're going to end up divorced if he doesn't start pulling his weight. He objected in the strongest possible terms and said "wouldn't you be embarrassed to pay someone else to clean up after you?".

But he is not embarrassed for me to do it, even when I got a weird dermatitis condition on my hand from the rubber gloves and my fingers kept bleeding. I am not kidding. I know that sounds Dickensian.

FFS.

Keyboard Dad - having a baby is so much more than sitting down and playing with them. In fact since I have had 3 I feel more like I fight fires than ever play or show them how to sort shapes.

There aren't enough words to describe the mental and physical effort of raising a human and worrying about them.

It takes me about 1 hour to leave the house - clothes, toilets, prepare bags to leave. 1 hour each meal time to cook and feed. 30 mins to put them down for each nap. 1 hour for bed time. None of that is playing with them.

I might not be doing it right but I'm doing the very best I can. I saw a meme that described getting a child dressed is the same as wrestling an aligator. Yes yes yes.

Number of days in my life where the baby slept well, napped well, played well, and I've sat down and enjoyed the calm of a blissful baby day -

Zero.

Keyboard dad you are hilarious.

Hold on a minute while I tell you all the ways you are working inefficiently in your job.

Oh no actually, I wouldn't have a clue - because I've never actually done it.

Ok, well now we're getting somewhere, aren't we? I may be "talking guff" but I've got you talking, haven't I? My questions are meant to draw out your thoughts so that we can discuss them, instead of just pitch forking.

Congratulations. You ARE the only person on here to be getting us all talking. How clever of you.

Anyway.

Do you feel like watching the little one all day is itself a job where nothing else can be done? Sometimes, yes. But 'watching the little one' also includes tasks to support the baby – laundry, washing up of feeding equipment etc. And don't forget that part of the point of maternity leave/staying at home is for the mother to both bond with the baby and recover from the pregnancy and birth.

But let's say that baby slept ok, baby fed fine, baby was happy to be lay on his play mat, or have a little nap, but mum didn't do the washing up or put a wash on, then surely that would be unfair?

I'm going to take an educated guess that this is not very often the case: as in, only some babies are like this only some of the time. So I don't think it's a very meaningful question really. But as a one-off, if there's a good day when the baby requires very little looking after and the mother has had enough sleep to function and is feeling OK herself (see above about recovery from the birth), then yes, some housework and chores could be done. But do you really think anyone on here is saying that a stay-at-home parent should never do a wash or tidy up?

GinAndColonic: I'm sure three is quite a handful, and I'm sure when they're older they will thank you for the fantastic job you're doing. I'm sure you still manage to put a few washes on (~5 mins quickly load, ~10 mins to stick in drier, + ~10 mins to quickly fold the previously dried clothes ) during the day though right? Or maybe wash up after breakfast? You wouldn't just do none of this would you?

I saw a meme that described getting a child dressed is the same as wrestling an alligator. Yes yes yes.

Amazing. I'm sure I'll have lots of fun with this in the coming years!

I'm sure three is quite a handful, and I'm sure when they're older they will thank you for the fantastic job you're doing.

Did you mean to sound so patronising?

I'm sure you still manage to put a few washes on (~5 mins quickly load, ~10 mins to stick in drier, + ~10 mins to quickly fold the previously dried clothes ) during the day though right? Or maybe wash up after breakfast? You wouldn't just do none of this would you?

What the actual jeff is it to you if she didn't?

LookJustCancelTheCheque from what OP wrote, it looked like only her husband worked? Maybe I missed something. My apologies.

I'm so glad that my SO doesn't communicate with my as offensively as most of these posts here. I think everyone just needs a G&T and to take 5.

keyboard dad a little advice DO NOT EVER say such a disrespectful thing to your wife when she has a newborn. That is the best way to ensure she gets PND.

Also I would love to hear your wife's opinion in 16 weeks about how easy it is to take care of a newborn baby and work and do ALL of the housework.

from what OP wrote, it looked like only her husband worked?

I don't knoq what your point is, sorry. Can you explain?

And what I think about your communication style would get me deleted.

Ever heard of Mansplaining........................

Keyboard you have no idea, and tbh probably never will, but both DH and I have said going to work (in our stressful, challenging jobs) often feels like a break.

Some days you can get stuff done, some days it's extremely hard! Lonely and draining. I dare say when you were young a lot of babies and kids were left to their own devices or even left to cry, lots of parents choose not to follow this route. So far today I've fed, winded, changed my baby 4 times, and have only been able to put him down for about 15 minutes total. I'm typing this one fingered while jiggling him on my shoulder.

Mansplaining. Ugh.

Xpost with Buunychops.

'know' not 'knoq', obviously!

LookJustCancelTheCheque actually that was heartfelt. I remind my mum quite often that she did a great job and try and treat her regularly, and when she apologises for not being able to help more (with the coming grandson), I give her a hug and tell her she's actually helped a lot. She raised six of us while maintaining a house and taught me how to work hard. She taught me that you don't have to be "full time employed" to have a job. Looking after a family is a job, but housework is part of that. If you don't maintain your house, you need help to do so.

I'm not trying to be patronising, but I'm male, and feel like I'm in enemy territory here. I'm actually quite a nice person, even with this Y chromosome.

What the actual jeff is it to you if she didn't?

Because we're talking about whether or not it's possible to do some housework while looking after the sprogs???

Put your bayonet away. I'm asking questions. Timid discussions aren't worth your, my, or anyone else's time.

Mansplaining?

No need to be sexist here.

I can only hope keyboard dad partner sees him for the clueless disrespectful misogynistic man he is and gets shot of him. Honestly he has no idea and from his attitude won't learn either.

Keyboard, you might not feel quite so much as though you were in enemy territory if you took on board some of the things people are saying. And your tone is patronising.

Put your bayonet away.... Timid discussions aren't worth your, my, or anyone else's time.

So what is it? Do you want timid, or do you want 'bayonet' (by which I guess you mean 'not timid'?)

I still don't understand what you mean by from what OP wrote, it looked like only her husband worked?

sorry if i upset you're apple cart

i guess this isnt one of them conversations where you try and work out problems i guess this is one of them ones where you have an angry outbursts for feel better

so dh should defo help out more

like his so is obviously tired so...just pay for a cleaner and stop being a tite arse!!!

if my so ever feels like it's too much, ill either do it myself or pay for a cleaner. life is too short for hate or anger or being fed up.

familys are meant to be happy, right?

Every so often I come across a post that makes me SOOOO glad to be a single parent, and I think I've just seen one (or even several - but all the same poster). Not going to engage, because I think posters like that get some sort of weird kick out of coming onto a predominantly female site to tell the little wimmin how they should be doing things.

So, getting back to the subject in hand, in a marriage which is working, getting a cleaner can be a practical solution to different standards of what counts as a liveable in house. The problem here seems to be that OP's DH won't talk about the issue - just thinks he can live like a pig in a sty and if OP has a problem with that, well, it's her problem. Meanwhile OP is coming to hate him - not have occasional flashes of annoyance, but really hate him.

I remember a poster on another thread about this sort of thing - saying of her husband's habit of leaving coffee cups around the place rather than washing them up - it may sound like nothing, but 3 cups of coffee a day, that's over 100 mugs a year he expects me to tidy away for him... So she asked him, not to tidy up, but to say, every time he left a cup "fuck you, DW'sName, this is your job..." He finally got the message. He doesn't do it again.

OP, if your husband refuses to see that in leaving the house dirty for you to deal with, he is effectively saying "fuck you, OP'sName" every time he does this, and he refuses to consider a cleaner, and you (understandably) hate him for it, then you really are into LTB territory.

From a man who has stayed home with 'just' two children: I also quickly realised that “being in the house all day” did not necessarily mean that you had any scope to wash up after breakfast - or indeed to eat breakfast - and that even a nap for the baby could be surprisingly hands-on. Without the perspective that comes from the swap, it’s easy for each partner to imagine the other relaxing at home/in the child-free office while they do the hard work of looking after the children/bringing home the bacon.

From another, also with 'just' two children: I confess I did imagine my time at home to be more freewheeling than it turned out, so the rolling deadlines caught me out: mealtimes, naps, nursery pick-ups, washing-up, laundry, tidying … it all piles up. My wife had set me three rules: that by 7.30pm, when she returned from work, the kids should be in bed, the flat not be a total bombsite and dinner be under way. In the face of the messy reality, she quietly dropped them.

Full article here

I wasn't going to be the first to shout it, but Keyboard Dad's posts should actually be used in a tutorial to explain Mansplaining. So tedious.

I would say it's more sexist to come on to a well established female dominated site and assume that it is your 'input' that has got people contributing.

How ever did we manage to think of anything to say before you got here? ?

Is it me or has KeyboardDad had a drastic change in writing style?

startrek90 Don't assume someone is the person their line of questioning portrays them to be. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Devil%27s_advocate

In common parlance, a devil's advocate is someone who, given a certain argument, takes a position they do not necessarily agree with (or simply an alternative position from the accepted norm), for the sake of debate or to explore the thought further. In taking this position, the individual taking on and playing the devil's advocate role seeks to engage others in an argumentative discussion process. The purpose of such a process is typically to test the quality of the original argument and identify weaknesses, if possible, in its structure, and to use such information to either improve or abandon the original, opposing position. It can also refer to someone who takes a stance that is seen as unpopular or unconventional, but is actually another way of arguing a much more conventional stance.

Sorry if this was out of line!

I can assure you that I put washes on, clean up daily, and on weekends, clean the house before my SO wakes up so she can have what I get when I come home from work to a clean house.

Just asking questions is all.

KBD out.