I think I have stopped loving my son (who is 11)...

[23Bailey]

I feel like many of you will hate me for this...

DS is 11... He is in Secondary School...

He is an absolute pain in the arse. I get 5 phone calls a day from school (each lesson) telling me all the things he has done - swearing, being rude, insulting teachers, insulting pupils, throwing things. It's really beginning to get to me. I tell him off/I take his gadgets away/I have tried the softer approach/the stricter approach; nothing works.

I go in for a meeting once a week. For them to just tell me how awful my son is to teach and how awful he is to be around. I feel like a total shot mother. I'm trying, but he doesn't listen. He doesn't care. He hits people/starts fights... He has been excluded 8 times in Yr 7, already. They have told me numerous times that he is close to going to a unit. He couldn't give two shits. He isn't nice to me, he hits me, says I'm a shit mum and sometimes wishes me dead. He pushes over his baby sister, calls her names, etc. She's only 2. It's getting ridiculous... I have taken him to the GP, they said he is just a bit lively and I need to take him out more - how can I do that? When school have told me to punish him. Then school nurse referred to CAMHS, he was assessed for ADHD, and a few other things. He is fine. He started therapy (CBT) but was so rude to her, she refused to see him.

I'm at my wits end, he's literally a horrible little boy. I'm sorry but he is making everyone's lives horrible. Children are refusing to come into school because they are scared of him hurting them, etc.

I don't know what to do anymore.

The description of PDA is a general one. Not all children will show all the characteristics to the same degree. And if it's not that it could be ODD (oppositional defiance disorder).

Either way you need to go back to your GP and tell them your family is in crisis and you need an urgent paediatric assessment.

PDA can swing under the radar because of the cleverness with words and not obviously displaying the other ASD signs. Its driven by anxiety, so if he is really scared or anxious then all you will get is the nasty stuff to be honest.
NONE of the parenting strategies work with PDA, you need PDA strategies.
Look at this ladies blog for some tips.
understandingpda.com/my-daughter-is-not-naughty/
and more on strategies www.pdasociety.org.uk/families/strategies

OP, I'd ask this to be moved to SN Children. There are a lot of posters there who are well placed to help, whatever the situation.

I'm afraid schools and CAMHS are not always the beacons of excellent and conscientious provision you might like them to be, and help and advice from other parents can be invaluable in navigating that.

How/did you bond with him after having him. Could it be an attachment disorder, he has.

suburban rhonda sorry I'm sure it was education welfare back in the day for me , but if not then the school will give any contacts needed for referal, I've never known anyone to pay for their child goin to a unit but perhaps it's different for different parts of the country.

ODD and Attachment disorder are both often misdiagnosed in PDA.

OP it sounds like an underlying issue. It's not for us or for you to diagnose but insist he is referred to someone to re-assess him. Who assessed him for ADHD? Was it CAMHS (mental health). In my area it is extremely hard for parents to get things like ASD / ADHD diagnosed and the majority of parents sadly spend years being passed from one professional to another, blamed, or not listened to.

Just because a professional has said he doesn't have ADHD doesn't mean he doesn't have something.

If school are calling you in then make use of that. Ask them what they are going to do? Suggest a CAF/CWAN meeting where everyone comes together regrding your DS and referrals are made.

A behavioural unit for schooling may be a good move rather than a bad move. They have better staffing ratios and tonnes more experience. If he is not managing in his current school and there are issues with other pupils and staff they may support you.

I'd also ask your little one's health visitor for advice if she's good and familiar with you. HV's can be a bit of a postcode lottery though but it's worth a try!

Well there is clearly something wrong with him.

And it is clearly not your parenting/fault as nobody else including his dad and trained professionals are any better at handling him.

How shitty of them all (especially his dad) to just walk away and leave you to deal with him by yourself.

He needs to go into specialist educational provision. Presumably your local provision is the unit you mention. He needs to go there. You won't have to pay for specialist provision. If he needs it the local authority will pay.

Who said he is "fine"? That's clearly bollocks. Has he been assessed by an educational psychologist?

My advice is to apply for an Education, Health & Care Plan. You can do this through the school or by going to the local authority directly. You will have to be a bit persistent/ insistent as they will try to fob you off. IPSEA is a good support organisation for parents with children with special educational needs.

Please feel free to ask more questions here or PM me. I have knowledge of the process of applying for EHCPs.

Does his dad work too? Would he support you in seeking a private assessment? Long shot I know but may be a route to consider ...

We bonded very well, but was a very happy baby, would sit with anyone. Loved people, etc. It's like a switch clicked when he was able to walk.

I know it's different, but when you're being abused, you do everything you can to get away, but when it's your son, it just isn't possible to get away.

Thanks all for the advice. The unit is an outstanding unit, it has 115 kids Yr 7-11. However, it's rare for someone to get more than 3 GCSEs at a pass I'm not saying that's bad, but I will worry about his future. He will be mixing with a lot of children who can't be in mainstream and I don't know how helpful that is? I don't know, I just find it a little sad.

His dad doesn't work he claims that he doesn't need to. It pisses me off as I'm trying to juggle 3 jobs.

Some children go back to mainstream school after assessments/diagnoses and correct intervention and strategies. Don't write it off. He will get access to the help he needs.

My advice is to apply for an Education, Health & Care Plan. You can do this through the school or by going to the local authority directly. You will have to be a bit persistent/ insistent as they will try to fob you off.

I'm not sure who you are talking about when you say they try to fob you off. We have well above the national average number of children with statements / EHCPs in our school (seven in one of classes). If a child needs support but doesn't have an EHCP we have to pay for that support from our general school budget. Why on earth would we fob anyone off if instead we could get funding for the extra support?

If the unit can stabilise his behaviour, he can progress into your local FE college and gain more qualifications there. His education will be delayed by a year or two but that's worth it for the behaviour management skills he will acquire in the unit.

If it's anything like the PRUs in my LA (pupil referral units), you can be in one for as little as six weeks and then return to your school.

Well if his dad "doesn't need to work" I hope he is supporting you financially!!

Dad sounds a bit of a dick!

I'm not a mum, so my input isn't great, but firstly big hug It sucks you're doing this all on your own.

Secondly the unit might not be a bad idea. My brother, who I love to death, was a grade A asshole. Never criminal, just nasty and unpleasant to everyone. Eventually he went into a 'residential support unit', and stayed for almost a year from about the age of 12. It gave us all a break, and he got a bit of structure and one on one time. It didn't help he was gifted so up two years but emotionally immature so showing off to the other kids.

He's now 29, settled in a long term relationship, two kids, managerial role, owns two homes and renovates in his spare time. If you'd asked anyone - family, teachers etc - they'd have predicted something much less pleasant, but because he got the support and the boundaries he needed, he's done well.

Go back and see your GP, reach out to any organisation you can for help - he needs it, and so do you and your daughter. Maybe see if there's a local Big Brother chapter nearby?

Good luck.

The unit does seem good, but the school hasn't actually put him through to one yet... He hasn't been expelled.

I get £50 a month from their Dad for both of them...

Where I live the LA have to make referrals to 'short stay school' units (formerly PRU), which will come via their previous school. You should find out the process for your County.
Are there any support groups where you live?

SuburbanRhonda from my experience and other parents I know the fobbing off is from the local authority when you put in for assessment for an ehcp (or a statement previously). My son's school told me my request would likely be refused (and it was) but we got it eventually after appealling and the school funded a 1:1 in the mean time out of their existing small budget.

I agree with you that generally schools WANT assessments so they get some aid to their support budget. I don't think anyone was suggesting school staff have an ulterior motive.

OP do go in to school and ask for a meeting, I really feel for you.

Only throwing this out there, but my nephew was a horrible child, similar to what you are describing but when he was ten my ds took him to family therapy which they both attended for a while and then he did by himself and he changed right around. It was like he was so used to people disliking him that he felt that anyone meeting him for the first time who was nice to him was being a hypocrite and he would show them up for the hypocrites they were and the therapy managed to turn him around to assuming that people would like him.

Your son seems to have got into a vicious circle where everywhere he goes people dislike him, including his own mother, so why on earth should he make the effort.

I also noted that when my dd was small if we got into a cycle where I was telling her off too much it was like she stopped loving me and once she stopped loving me there was nothing I could do to get her to behave. So I had to win back her affection before it was worth trying to change her behaviour.

3 GCSEs at a pass sounds better than what he will get where he is now. The school seem not to give a toss if their only answer is to exclude him and make idle "threats" about a unit.

But I don't blame the school. My son is a nightmare, it's just because having 3 GCSEs wouldn't get you into college and they have said to me and DS that it has to be a last resort because it doesn't help your future as you are with lots of expelled children too

The education system is very different from the days when if you missed your GCSEs in school you were written off. (I work in the system. I get students who dropped out of school to achieve an honours degree, often at 1st or 2.1 level.)There are opportunities to catch up throughout life. he isn't going to get GCSEs in the school he is now, and it sounds like he might not even get three.

You can't cope any more. Push for him to go to the unit and be dealt with by those who are expert in this sort of behaviour. They know exactly where to draw boundaries and have tried and tested strategies to change the way he behaves and interacts.

You're not a failure as a mum. Something inside him has snapped, and it needs to be mended. If he had a brain tumour you wouldn't feel guilty about letting someone else fix it. Take the same approach.

This sounds very very tough.
I'd ask to meet with the school, explain all you've put in the op and see if they have access to any other programmes. Fresh steps used to do one where the student went to the pru for 6+ weeks but it was essentially a way of getting them back into mainstream and engaged. There will be others but it requires the school to be on board as they can fund it and they are expensive. Tbh if he's been excluded 8 times he is already causing them significant problems. If they are close to expulsion he MUST legally have been seen by an EP so ensure this has happened- request it and do the request both through school and Gp.
Try to put aside your fears re GCSEs and the pru- he isn't coping in mainstream and he's many years from GCSEs, as well as there being numerous options if he doesn't get them all at 16.
It sounds like many people have walked away from him over the years don't give up on him(I'm sure you're not) - there clearly sounds like significant undiagnosed issues (sorry not an EP!).