Am I a bitch? I don't want DD sleeping over with these people!

[thenappyslayer]

DD is 9 and has been invited to a sleepover at the home of parents who I'm not keen on. Their kids are really really lovely!!! The sweetest most quiet little things you will ever meet.

As for the parents....I certainly wouldn't want my child staying in their home over night.

These poor kids are always waiting outside the betting shop after school, their shirt collars are always filthy, both have rotten teeth, the mother smokes over the pram of her newborn and the father has a foul mouth. He's always shouting at his kids for no reason and seems to have a mobile phone pressed to his ear indefinitely.

I've told DD no and said it's because she has to go to her grandparents on Saturday and we just would not make it back in time. Her and this kid are fairly close. DD feels left out etc as all the other invited kids are going and yesterday when asked by the mum hosting if DD was coming, I gave the grandparents excuse.

I felt guilty fibbing but what was I supposed to say? She seemed to feel snubbed and was quite snappy but I didn't take it personally considering I just lied to her face. I do have some shame.

Im sure you're thinking "well if the other parents are okay with it surely you're just exaggerating what these people are like". That's the thing. The other parents aren't as bad but are pretty close. I actually feel quite alienated.

Yes I come from the "nice bit" of the area, yes this was not our first choice of primary school but I'm NOT a snob. I come from a working class background (grew up on a notorious council estate from HELL until 15 when it was demolished ) as do all of my dearest friends.

Anyway...

Again this morning the bloody sleepover came up with 3 other mums. I gave my excuse. One of the mums said "of course you cant come" and gave the others a look. Then another mum said "well her grandparents will be there next weekend". It caught me off guard and I just gave another shitty clumsy excuse. I'm sure it was obvious I was lying. The kids went in and as I excused myself I was given looks that could have killed pigeons in mid air. Don't those women have bloody lives? I found the premise of the exchange oddly nosey/bitchy for grown women. Well, they average at around 26 (with 9 year olds) but you catch my drift.

It was only literally a 1 minute exchange but it did bother me a little. I don't want to come across as an uppity bitch who looks down on the chavy mums at the local primary school but I just don't have anything in common with them at all.

Have any of you ever really liked a kid but have not been keen on the parent?

Even though the mum was being snappy she did look hurt. I feel shitty.

I seriously don't think the OP was implying that ALL teenage mothers are bad parents or chavs etc etc
She was just painting a full picture of the women and yes there are SOME teenage mothers who are bad parents and chavvy and spend all day in the betting shop and smoke over their babies pram. I went to school with plenty of them and so I knew by her description exactly what type of women they are and no I would not have my children staying over at any of their houses either.

We all know teenage mothers can be fantastic parents with brilliant bonds with their kids. They can go on to run successful businesses and raise polite children who get 10 A* grades amongst all the other examples you have mentioned on this thread! So please calm down and realise she is not judging these women solely on their age, she is using all the information available to give an accurate description.

nappy
Perhaps wrong to laugh but I remember it clearly and it was funny. I remember standing at the window watching in awe as he ran up the street yelling "GLORIA!!" (Not her real name). Then the police turned up with lots more yelling and mum made me hide behind the sofa in case he started shooting.
They were all loved up again by the next day.

angielou123 Thanks for not calling me a cunt or telling me to fuck off. I agree. It was insensitive but I sincerely didn't mean anything about their parenting - only that at 26 despite still being young they should know better especially with 9 year olds it's not like they are new mums just learning. I do think 26 is young - not insanely young or too young to have a child but just young. That's all. 30 is young. You're hardly a pensioner. People have mistaken me saying young for child. These women are adults and I see them as such.

She's not a snob! OP has already stated the Father is shouty and unpleasant. Why would she leave her child in their care? OP YANBU. You're doing the right thing.

norajack Thanks - Had I not included those details everyone would be bombarding me saying I'm not being clear and I need to provide context etc. I mentioned class and age as I feel that it influenced their treatment of me. If someone in their friendship group said sorry DD is with GPs, they'd say oh thats fine. I say it and I'm the stuck up bitch simply because I'm not at the same they are. As I've mentioned before on this post judgement and snobbery goes both ways.

Then the police turned up with lots more yelling and mum made me hide behind the sofa in case he started shooting. They were all loved up again by the next day.

                                                         <span class="italic">^</span><span class="italic">^</span><span class="italic">^</span><span class="italic">^</span><span class="italic">^</span>^^

I can't cope I'm actually dying with laughter.

You've had a kicking here OP so for what's it's worth I think YANBU. If they are the kind as you state that leave their kids hanging out outside the bookies for them etc, you have real concerns about your kids safety and contentment in their care - I wouldn't if it were my child but as was suggested you can and should have a sleepover and invite the child to show theirs no prejudice against her children or the other mothers children

Having been both the posh mum (whilst in a hostel with pregnant 16 year olds) and the poor mum Ican appreciate both sides.
Best advice is be nice to the mums and get to know them properly ( possibly round yours). Not allowing sleepovers is a thing with some parents for a variety of reasons.

Yes you are. She wants to go. Do you really think she'll be harmed? Really? More than being left out? I've had mums not let their children sleep over here because I had a lodger. (Of two year's standing, doing a PhD and one of the nicest people I've ever known). Now I have a partner apparently it's ok. They don't know him either. Someone thinking that your home isn't safe - and that therefore your children aren't safe is deeply, deeply offensive and upsetting. Whatever you feel, and of course you are within your rights to make this decision, I think you have to take in the fact that you have upset people by the very nature of the thought that these people's home isn't good enough.

26 is not young. When I was 26 I was a doctor working 100+ hour weeks and making serious decisions at 2am. Nobody thought I was too young for that so stop with the age comments. Some people are immature at 60 (I fully intend to be) and some people are far too wise for their age at 6.

As far as the sleepover goes, I wouldn't do it. Let her go to the movies, party, dinner or whatever is happening before it and then pick her up in time for a late-ish bedtime at home. I don't let my sons sleep over at friends' houses unless the parents are also friends of mine. These people clearly aren't friends of yours, why on earth would you give them the responsibility of looking after your child?

We had a sleepover for DS2's birthday last year. One boy wasn't allowed to stay over, so he came to the party, had dinner, got changed into PJ's for the movie, cleaned his teeth etc with the others - then went home. Best of both worlds and I bet he got more sleep than any of the others did. Never again :)

HicDraconis whats wrong with being young? why does young mean dumb or stupid? 26 is young.

Hic, OP means they had babies aged 17 I suppose.

I'm 26 and i grew out of that screwing BS a long time ago. Guess you were right about not letting your child stay if they still behave like they are in school.

(Screwing is what he called the staredown in my day)

Wow this thread derailed big time.
Op's allowed an opinion whether you agree or not and i am sure there are some sterotypes some you grillers play into.

If its anything, since i'm having a mid 20's crisis with thinking i'm old, i appreciate op's comments about 26 being young

Lily well harold shipman had a PHD and he was a murderer, I think the judging people on their jobs has gone out the window this day and age considering the endless reports of the 'educated' doing things which the 'non-educated' also do.

And they did not know you knew your lodgers real details, its not hard to fake indentity. i am sure he never met your family or you his. You cannot compare a lodger to a partner.

YANBU. The only factor I think you need to focus on is that your instinct as a parent is telling you you do not want your DC staying in the home of these people. That's your prerogative!! I would only allow sleepovers with family or very, very close friends.

I wouldn't let my children stay because of the smoking, neglect, shouting etc.

However despite your best efforts to back peddle you are still a judgemental twat about age.

I think YABU. Your kid would be staying there for ONE NIGHT not moving in! I hardly think that it would have a negative impact on her.

I wouldn't let my DS stay over with parents like that, anyone who smokes round kids in this day and age is seriously neglecting the health of their child and therefore is not to be trusted with the wellbeing of mine. FWIW I don't think you are being snobbish. It sounds like the chaviness of the mums is the issue, I couldn't tolerate them either if they were behaving like 5 year olds. Hope you have better luck with the secondary school.

YANBU.

I didn't want dd staying at her friend's house where the parent is a single mum of six who's been sectioned 3 times in a year, where there are two teenage brothers (one who was wearing an electronic tag), and where the front door shows marks of a police battering ram.

Sadly now dd is 16+ she takes herself off there overnight and I can't do anything about it. Not happy though. The kids are nice, even the electronically tagged brother who is very caring to his younger siblings, but it's such a chaotic household. It's not just the family - it's all the dysfunctional friends they have lurking around.

Thanks everyone I'm not back peddling at all despite some of you needing that as an excuse to moan and groan about old ladies like me on 35 judging you. It's boring. As in said before if we were face to face you keyboard warriors wouldn't be saying half of what you are so I won't take it seriously. I've said sorry what do you want blood? Get a life. Tired of being judged? Aren't we all. Aren't we all. I was judged for not having kids young by my peers. I was judged and resented for going to uni, for bettering myself. I was judged and bullied for having violin lessons that my mum worked an ex tra ten hours a week to pay for so she never heard me practise and cried when she did. judgement bullying and snobbery goes both ways. I've experienced it from my own peers who i would assume should have been uplifting me , and I experienced it from people people better off than me. Teenage mums aren't the only people in the world judged. Older parents get looks. My dad is 17 years my mother's senior and I was bullied for years. They called him grandad and threw things at me. I'm not white but due to my parents insisting on no slang in the house I was branded as a coconut / uncle tom / every slur you can think of and bullied because of that. There is no such thing as worthy victims and unworthy victims. Just because someone has money now doesn't mean they are a snob. Just because someone doesn't have money and is a teen mum doesn't make them fucking martyr. I called them what they were and that's a group of young women who despite me explaining dd can't come wanted to be nasty. Again despite many posters wishing to ignore my background I can't look down on where I'm from, who I am. I lived on an estate that you wouldn't deem worthy to walk your dog, that half of you calling me a snob would never want to step foot in, let alone leave your child in for 24 hours. Bus drivers to this day avoid it past 9pm. Calling people snobs on mumsnet is easy, but it sure as hell defeats the objective of why youre even saying it, and reveals a snobbery of your own. It's digusting to assume someone is a chav or beneath you based on the way they speak or dress, just as it's nasty to assume someone is uppity because of their demeanor. If no one is better than anyone than why is their behaviour justified by their socio economic status and mine condemned by mine ? Why is it that because I have money now that I automatically think DD is a precious little princess too good for them , and they by default are just humble lovely people, a victim of my snobbery. I've said loads of times their kids are all actually great. You can have tendencies and habits another parent doesn't like and still raise decent kids. Half my friends were what you'd call teenage mums. A label which in inself reveals a lot about the person who uses it. If youre an adequate good enough mum why label yourself as a teenage mum? I don't walk around saying I'm a 20s mum.
What's wrong with me not having anything in common with these women ? I've been around posh people my entire life and never ever fit in with them either. But If I did a post as a working class mum whos kid had a scholarship somewhere and I didn't like those mums this page would be flooded with anti money fuck middle class people rhetoric. If I mentioned that they were slightly "older" mums who i felt were a certain way no one would give a shit. I'm inviting every one round in two weekends. The halarious thing is there was a post on here with hundreds of responses with the OP asking who regretted moving to an "up and coming area" and felt isolated. Floods of comments came in about having to bear playgroups with teenage mums and awkward conversations in the playground with chavs and regretting it SosoSosososososo much but having no money to leave and that didn't get as much flack as this post.

Before anyone jumps on me re: single parent with mental health problems - doesn't make her a bad person, but it does make her household a challenging one. 6 kids is hard for anyone, but for one seriously ill parent to manage alone? Not good.

"For large swathes of the population, it's not a fact of life. I don't know any current or former teenage parents."

Apple I meant that judging young parents does happen in today's society, rightly or wrongly. I don't know anyone round here who had their babies as a teenager either. Most of them became parents in their 30s.

Boredworkingmum020 the age comment was cringey but hardly lynch worthy. Funny how one comment makes you a million things. Even if I was a bit prudish about the teenage mum thing it doesn't mean id never leave my child with them which I have done .....DD isnt kept in isolation from her classmates This post was about a sleepover and a sleepover only. I'm a snob who's only not lived on an estate for the last 7 years of my life.

Two years ago my 8 year old was invited to something similar. I didn't know th family at all except they lived in the same road that a very high profile and awful murder took place. Many in the immediate community felt his murder was justified. He was killed by a local mob because they mistakenly thought he was a Paedophile. Even police went to prison for the cock up.

No way would I allow my child to go to a sleep over at a party like this snobbery or not. I don't give a shiny.

Putting aside the younger mum comment it would be a similar demographic and I stand out like a sore thumb in the area at times so I get where you are coming from.