DD is calling social services on me in the morning

[moodymelting]

DD is 13 and has turned Kevin and Perry overnight.
She has turned into a nightmare.
When ever she is told off she resorts to telling me to 'go away and leave her alone and name calling or covering her ears shouting la la la . She will NEVER admit she is in the wrong or apologise. She will do nothing at all to help in the house.

She spilt sweets she had bought all over my bedroom floor along with cut up tights and cardboard she had been messing with. I asked her twice to move it and she refused resorting to her go away and leave me alone tactic. When I did not back down she has gone mad! She walked into the kitchen and tipped my rubbish bin all out on the floor saying she was not picking it up and I could.

Apparently I want a perfect child because she's never done anything wrong, I am selfish, mean, she hates me. I'm a rubbish Mum and she would be better off with a different Mum than me who is a tight mess because I have refused to go tomorrow to pick up something for her when she's behaved like this.
Oh and she barricaded the room door shut with a chair so I couldn't go to bed.

I have told her that if she likes I will dial the number myself and I am sure they will rush right over to a child behaving like a total brat in-between dealing with the neglected kids who have no clothing/food or being abused

How on earth do you deal with the teen strops????!!!
N/C btw as everyone on my Facebook will know my user name otherwise!

fourage

When your children realise they are socially inadequate because they don't know right from wrong. or perhaps when they are in prison.
When they realise and tell you that you have done them a disservice by not preparing them for life.
Maybe when they are in a pub and their unacceptable behaviour to others earns them a punch, or much worse.
Seen it all before my love. Children need discipline through punishment sometimes the niceey nicey approach seems to work, they give in for a quiet life, but you can't always be there.

newlife. I am not your love.

I have three adult children and one teenager. They have a clear moral sense.

Good luck

I call everyone love, we do where i come from, it's meant in a nice way, non threatening.
They may have a clear moral sense but do they have common sense? Are they streetwise and do you really know what they are like.
Have they never been in any trouble at all, not at school, ever.
If not as a pp suggests you must right a book to inform the world how children grow up to be perfect individuals without ever being punished for anything.
You'll make millions.

newlife, I am happy to answer your questions, but not when your sarcasm is spread so thickly.

Do any of them have long term partners, Fourage?

I dated a man who could do no wrong in his mothers eyes. There was always an excuse for his behaviour. He never had to face any consequences.

My god what a total utter cock end he turned to be. The man was utterly bereft of any sense of personal responsibility. He would be genuinely puzzled if it was pointed out that his behaviour was rude and upsetting. He was even more puzzled when I LTB. Why on earth would anyone find fault with such perfection

He's still a lonely old tosser now, it's still not his fault.

fourage

I find it hard not to be sarcastic after your posts to the OP were so awful when she only asked for help.
I know you are wrong and don't need to meet your children to know this.
I don't care if you answer the questions or not tbh.

I've met grown ups who were never properly disciplined it is pitiful and their mums thought they were perfectly socialised too.

fourage are you a politician?

You just avoid the difficult posts as though they haven't happened. I have pointed out several punishment dogs get having to go on a lead when they won't listen to recall commands.

But you haven't acknowledge it. You haven't acknowledged that several posters have said they would or consider divorce as the consequence of the husbands actions if they threaten violence or topped the rubbish out on the floor.

I truly hope your children go through life with never a problem. I hope that when they do receive their first punishment they take it in their stride and it doesn't shock them.

I hope they never go through life and make the wrong judgment. Say the wrong thing, lose their temper.

I don't think it will happen. Because they are human.

We all make mistakes and do the wrong thing. We all befall real world consequences. It's life.

You think you know everything about your kids. But you don't. No one knows everything about everyone. We all have a private part of our life and our own head.

You can never realistically say 'I know my kids won't find themselves in the shit because they made the wrong decision'

Do you think people aren't shocked when their kids are arrested? Commit crime? Get the sack for gross misconduct?

Do you think all parents see it coming?

I don't know everything about my kids.
My kids are not perfect.

I don't punish. I don't know why you find that so upsetting. And for the PP , no my kids have never been punished in school. Not once.

I don't think Fourage's children will end up in serious trouble, necessarily, that kind of behaviour is normally learned either from peers or parents. I do think they will find it hard to maintain meaningful relationships, where they may have to put the feelings and concerns of others before their own from time to time.

When I 'punish' my children by making them clean up their own mess, I am not only teaching them that I won't clean up after them, but that their future partner is unlikely to take kindly to such behaviour also. Ditto back chatting, bandying around insults, being general pains in the behind etc. Children need to learn, via consequences that this behaviour will not be tolerated by other adults, not their parents, not their teachers and not their future flat mates or partners.

It's not all about obedience, it's about shaping reasonable and socially adept adults.

I disagree itwillwash, my kids above all else are empathic. They care deeply about the feelings of others.

I don't think anyone is upset.

I am shocked to find a poster that so lacks empathy for someone asking for advice. I am shocked you think you are so perfect that you can tell people they are dysfunctional.

I am shocked that a poster with such strong opinions ignores answers to questions she has been asked.

I am shocked that anyone would think there is only one way to parent children and that their way is the only right way.

I am shocked that anyone could think their children are so perfect and they know they will never have any problems.

First of all, you can't have any idea if your kids were punished in school, they don't always tell you if they can get away with it, and school certainly don't tell every little punishment. I have grown up dc and know this too.

By your own admittance you don't know everything about your kids, so how do you know your parenting has worked, in terms of no punishment to instil discipline.
How disciplined are they? You can't answer, nobody can.
You can say well they can get up on time, hold down a job etc, have a gf/bf, which is ok, but how do you know how others see them how they are perceived. You have no idea like the rest of us.

fourage as I said earlier, forget the word 'punish'. Have you EVER imposed any consequences on your DCs' behaviour? Think all the way back - did you ever remove a toy from any of them as toddlers because they threw something or refused to do as you asked?
I agree that you'd make an excellent politician as you just refuse to answer any questions you don't like and just keep repeating the same sanctimonious bollocks.
You don't think a dog being put down for attacking someone is a punishment. Would you agree that it's a consequence of their behaviour?

I found out my DC had detention for incessant chattering because I intercepted a Snap Chat (she'd logged herself in on my phone and not logged out) meant for a friend.

It was totally not her fault of course, the teacher clearly hates her and wants to ruin her life

I didn't punish for that, she'd already been punished, the detention was the punishment, but I did gently point out that the teacher probably didn't hate her, rather she just wanted her to get a decent education.

She still believes the teacher hates her but according to DC2, who is younger and therefore less prone to drama, she hasn't had any more detentions for incessant chattering.

She didn't tell me herself, nor did the school inform me, it was a break time detention. Her friends fill me on bits occasionally and her sister, unbeknownst to her tells me everything she confides in her

I'm still not deluded enough to think I know everything she gets up to when I'm not there.

So if they are not perfect that means they occassionally make wrong decisions. What do you do or did you do when they were younger if they made wrong decisions?

Just talk ?

I think the problem is fourage has some special definition of the word "punish", which is possibly akin to beating with sticks. Whereas most people here mean punish as in, deal with consequences or time out.

I have never removed doors - but we did have to remove the last bathroom lock, as one child would lock themselves in, and it was dangerous.
I have had a rule with one child for a while that their door had to be open, unless pre-agreed (to get dressed etc.) but that was on medical needs, they hated it, and we endeavoured to allow them as much privacy as we could.

It is never helpful to just tell a parent that "everything they have done since babyhood is wrong and if you'd just done it my way it would have worked wonderfully". What's past is past. And unless you have parented my children, you have no idea. It is pretty well established that children are not "blank slates" but have some needs and character traits pre-programmed.

Fourage - you are annoying people because of your self-righteousness, just as much as people who claim you have to force young children into obedience do.

haha, I was always in trouble at school, & rarely at home. However my parents would have had a fit if they knew all the nonsense great fun I was involved in...
really, actually I'm delighted that I did it. How boring to be goody two shoes !!!!

People do not always use harsh punishment. Sometimes a light sanction to teach and guide children is used. Also this is often followed with expectations, redirection or discussion.

Farage a child having to use their own money to replace the dinner they ruined is actually punishment, it means that actions have consequences. The fact that your daughter did this suggests that she has learned from previous experience that actions have consequences. To impose consequences on actions is punishment. Children learn through experience, so just telling them that actions have consequences can end up with the parent being a broken record voice in the background and will not be nearly as effective as experience.

Saying "No you can't have that?" to your child is a sanction, have you never ever said no to your children? I doubt it. If you ever had then you have punished. Do not equate the word punishment with harsh discipline. It doesn't always mean that.

I think the problem is fourage has some special definition of the word "punish", which is possibly akin to beating with sticks. Whereas most people here mean punish as in, deal with consequences or time out.

I think she is 'mis understanding' on purpose. It's been clarified several times but doesn't fit her agenda. So she has ignored it. Which matches the rest of her posts.

Fourage , not nigel Farage

If my teen shoplifted I wouldn't punish. I would be really disappointed though and that would be punishment enough in itself for my children. They hate our disappointment.

I do issue small consequences but they are for more trivial things that I get fed up nagging about such as tidying up, leaving shoes out etc.
For more serious issues there is no point in punishing unless they are natural consequences. My ds has had detentions for not paying as much attention as he should. We've talked about the reasons why the teacher has isssued it, the need to get a good education, again trying to give reasons why it's necessary to conform. Will he get more? Possibly but he probably would if I'd punished heavily as well. He'd resent me more for punishing heavily and is less likely to want to please us. But we haven't got into the vicious circle of bad behaviour /punishment yet. This works for my DC. It might not work for other kids where their peers opinions are more important than their parents. Mine have relatively nice friends so parenting them is probably easier. I think peers have a lot to answer for.

It's chicken and egg though. Have they got nice friends because of the way they've been parented so they demand and give respect to their friends, or or is just luck?

This parenting lark is bloody hard.

We've talked about the reasons why the teacher has isssued it

lovey you have a nice chat - wait till something serious happens and a chat just won't cut it. I'm sure Mr Police man will see there's a "reason" and just let it slide..... Think we should try that approach ....

That's a bit harsh when I've said it works for my kids, may not for others.

They want to please. They do please us except for the usual teenage messiness. If it aint broke why fix it? They've got to 14 and 16 so we're doing something right. I've admitted this might be luck.

What's your problem sally ?

Fourage - my neighbours take the same view as you.

Their kids have just been throwing stones at my windows.

grapejuice I thought your post was really interesting. When I posted on here to say that DD had been arrested, there were quite a lot of people suggesting what I thought were extremely harsh punishments- one poster suggested that I leave her there overnight (I assume they thought she was in the Police station- she was actually still at the shop) and remove all privileges until at least Christmas.
On the way there, I was all ready to go in with all guns blazing but, when I actually got there, her eyes were red raw from crying and my instinct was to give her a hug but I resisted. She went straight to bed when we got home but I went to the loo at midnight and could hear her still crying in her room. The next day was Mother's Day and she spent the whole morning apologising for ruining my day. She didn't say a word about handing me her phone and hasn't complain about being grounded. I almost feel bad about doing it now but know I have to stick to it.
I know that my disappointment has actually had much more effect on her than taking her phone away and grounding her.
The difference between your posts and fourage's is that you acknowledge that what works for your DCs won't necessarily work for others and you recognise that parenting is difficult.