To think there aren't enough decent men to go round?

[elementofsurprise]

I am sick of men - haven't had a realtionship for ages, so it's not caused by any particular one, just a general observation of the crap specimens the patriarchy has produced.

Was hit on yet again last night by a man who seemed perfectly nice and intelligent and polite to start with but got weirdly pressuring and controlling when I tried to politely decline. Is it so impossible for men to actually be pleasant and get to know someone? Must they always think with their dicks? (Wasn't out partying btw!)

And the ones that appear to be pleasant functional human beings turn into childish selfish assholes after a while - is there a way to avoid this? Because being friends for months/years first (so you think you know them) just seems to lead to a situation which is a prolonged 'chase' for them and they don't want you once they have you... My last boyfriend treats his female friends far, far better than he treated me.

I am 30 and worried I will never have a partner, because the cliche appears to be true - "all the good ones are taken"! And there seems to be more nice, normal, considerate etc etc women around than men. Sadly I am coming to the conclusion that this isn't just perception, but due to societal expctations, meaning men are just more likely to be overgrown children/inconsiderate/selfish/poor lifestyle/alcholic/poor hygeine/other massive red flag etc.

Sigh.

• resists the urge to correct that too

I'm all booked up voyage, sorry about that.

How is it women's fault if they meet ghastly men? Don't follow the logic of that.

It's all our fault quiteirregular. If we date a string of men who all turn out to be knobs-our fault.
If a seemingly nice man someone once worked with is single-our fault. (It's our long list of unreasonable demands you see, like washing sometimes and not being a dick)
And, apparently , if we end up married to a man who never lifts a finger and acts like an arse-our fault.

Logic has nothing much to do with it.

The older you get, the more you know about yourself and what you're looking for in a partner. So the number of men you'll consider goes down. Meanwhile the pool of men is also going down.

So you are not being unreasonable. The pool is shrinking. It's shit.

But you're approaching the age where everyone who mistakenly married their childhood sweethearts starts to get divorced. There'll be fresh fish in the pond soon! I released my ex-husband at 32.

The man I am with now has never really been in a relationship before. Not really. Which presents challenges as you can imagine. But he's very decent indeed. Keep the faith, my love.

But you're approaching the age where everyone who mistakenly married their childhood sweethearts starts to get divorced. There'll be fresh fish in the pond soon!

Exactly! That's how I see it too.

Well, whatever anybody perceives a decent man to be, they clearly do exist, albeit not necessarily in adequate numbers. The real trick is FINDING your decent man. Then keeping him provided he measures up. That is my final facile contribution tonight coz I'm off to bed soon. 'Night all.

Op has a chip on her shoulder the size of Godzilla.

Become a lesbian?
Problems solved op.

Why are you saying that? Or did you just fancy being unpleasant and bullying?

Ooh generalisations ! Tell me what you think about blacks or Asians!

MIL has a boyfriend twenty years younger than her. It's odd ( she's the most middle-class-looking old gal and he's a brick shithouse covered in tattoos and bald/beardy/biker), sure, but she's happy, he's happy, what they do is nobody's business. I think it might be seedy if she was dating someone super young (what does Madonna talk to her 24 year old boyfriend about at night; do they watch The Last Leg together and discuss Josh W's sexual prowess like DH and I?) but someone in their 60's dating someone in their 40's is hardly weird.

I do, however, raise my two DCs with the conscious thought that at some point they're going to have to be released into the wilds and seek partners. They're boys so I try to teach them all the things boys should grow up knowing; how not to be dicks towards women, to listen, to respect, to fend for themselves, to cook and clean. It's fucking exhausting. But the long term gain is that they (hopefully, god how much I'm hoping) they won't be those dreadful man babies you hear about whose Mums still wash their pants when they're 34. DH was once one of those men. Married life has been a baptism of fire for him.

I'd better get some spectacular christmas presents from my DIL's when the DCs are grown ups.

I think there is an ego involved in describing someone as normal or desent, and rightly so.but be clear that it's your normal or decent.
Describing a future partner as descent or normal because they want to settle down or not is naive. Obviously the character traits of being nice and honest, are essential.
I don't see a man/woman's decision to meet someone and spend 2 years in 5 major cities over the next 10 years a less or greater decision than buying a house and marriage. Neither is normal or decent.

Kanewreck Describing a future partner as descent or normal because they want to settle down or not is naive. Obviously the character traits of being nice and honest, are essential.

Well, it was those essential traits I was referring to in my use of the word "decent'. I was using the term very broadly - including plenty of men who might not be my personal preference (for example someone who doesn't want children) but would be good partners for someone else. It's just that, in my observation (and I'd love to be wrong about this!) there seem to be more men lacking stuff like basic household skills, looking after themselves etc. that women. I actually know several men who are pleasant, intelligent/interesting, and fairly kind - but nonethless lack essential life skills or have drink/drug issues. And I do think it comes down to socialisation.

Fair enough. I think your view maybe skewed by not ever dating your eligible girlfriends. I'd guess you have maybe lived with one but not for the last 2 years.

Sorry. I just read your post. I was a bit reactive (in a drunk way. I didn't read all of the post).
I can tell you that most single people, as you know, do more than most people within a couple to maintain their home. They do everything.

Or, Kanewreck they simply don't. When I met DP, his flat was messy, he rarely cleaned, lived off takeaways & convenience foods. Like many of his peers, all of whom were holding down responsible professional jobs. They were more than capable of doing so. They just chose not to bother, as they were happy with that. I don't know one single female who lives like that.

And while many will say OP is being "picky" I bet nobody would be lining up to live with a partner who can't clean up after themselves or contribute domestically. The domestic crap then gets delegated by default to the partner who does give a shit (usually the woman). The resentment this causes in relationships is huge. Definitely one to avoid!

Socialisation, indeed.

Find one whose mother beat him sufficiently. Housetrained, eager to please, will never answer back. Ok, they scream a bit from the nightmares and you mustn't startle them from behind, but nobody's perfect.

It's quite hard to find women over 35 who don't have kids where I live, and if they don't have them they most likely want them. I agree that dating in your 30s is kind of a fraught business, because it's so loaded.
If I'm a 35 year old woman who wants children I want to meet someone who at least wants the same things, or, if they don't want that with me, they need to be really honest about it, and quickly.
(I'm not in this position, but a lot of my friends have been)

I have seen time and time again men and women get into ltr, and be together for years, with the man saying "mm, kids, maybe, one day" but not ever going for it because she isn't the one, but at the same time not ending it, so she is left dangling, agonising about whether to cut her losses (which gets harder and harder as the years go by) whether to wait and hope, or to just accept that she wont have a family, knowing that if he wanted to, he could leave her when she's 45 and go and have kids with someone else.
My friend, 40 has been with her boyfriend 6 years. He doesn't live with her, but he's at her place most of the time.
He won't make plans with her, she has been very clear that she wants to live together and have a family.
It's not going to happen.
Now, I like this man, he is a quintessential "nice guy", but he IMO what he has done is not decent. My friend loves him, and if he couldn't give her what she wanted, he should have ended it. And yes, she should have ended it, but I guess she decided to wait and hope, given the slim pickings out there.
So, what I mean by "decent" isn't necessarily someone who is willing to get married, it's someone who can be honest about what they want, even if that means ending something that's quite comfy for them.

DisgraceToTheYChromosome

Ha! Literally me, then.

I think your list of criteria widens as you g through life.

I'm single and do enjoy the 'me' time.

However I hope one day to meet my Mr Right. He will have to be right for me though, I'm not prepared to settle for ok or right most of the time.

I've had my children and done the whole marriage thing. So I guess I'm not in need of a man as want a man if that makes sense.

The longer I live alone the more ' male' jobs I do myself. I've just put together a lovely lamp table something I would never have attempted when married.

I sometimes miss having intimacy with a partner but even that is swiftly resolved with a good selection of sex aides and imagination.

I really would rather be on my own than suffer anyone less than perfect. For me.

I've just been in a holiday by myself; something I've been a bit anxious about in the past. It would have been nice to share things, but on the other hand I could do exactly as I want.
It's made me happier to be single.