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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

AIBU to think the teacher is in the wrong?

264 replies

Walshie123 · 12/02/2016 12:59

DS is 12 (in Yr 7)

He rarely asks to go to the toilet.

He was in an Art lesson (he had a lesson before this, so it wasn't just after break/lunch and the toilets are locked during lesson change) and asked if he could go to the toilet, it was 15 mins in.

Teacher said no and he left it. 5 mins later he asked again and she said that she had already told him no and he said that he really needed to go and she said that he can't.

5 mins even later, he got up and went over to her and said that he really doesn't think he can hold it anymore and he seriously had to go and she told him to sit down and get on with his work.

He said to me that he would have walked out at that point, but the toilets are locked and you need a note to get the key and he went over to the sink (he said standing helped) and that's the only way he could possibly keep it in. She said he was taking too long to wash his hands and he wet himself.

He then went over to his teacher and asked if he could go to medical as he feels really sick and she then told him to stop it and stop trying to lie his way to the toilet. He sat down.

When the lesson was over he began to cry and the teacher went over and asked what the problem was and she obviously saw because before he answered, he said she began to just back away and start to write on the board and told him to just go to lunch.

He got up and phoned me from the toilets and I went and got him (I pretended he had an appointment, someone else's was cancelled so he got it quick (wasn't true)) and now he refuses to go back, he thinks everyone saw, but by the sounds of things they didn't?? I just don't know what to suggest :(

AIBU or was that teacher in the wrong? (Fair enough if I'm being unreasonable/DS is, but just not sure what to do)

OP posts:
Original poster
Walshie123 · 12/02/2016 15:09

timelytess - she wasn't polite about dismissing him, no "I'm really sorry but it is policy".

Also, there are bits in their planners to be signed for the toilet and some teachers do allow it.

OP posts:
BillWagglestaff · 12/02/2016 15:14

When I was a teacher there were a couple of times when (perfectly well behaved) students I had allowed to go to the toilet during lessons was marched back to my classroom by senior management and both I and they were bollocked in front of the class.

I am no longer a teacher.

waitingforsomething · 12/02/2016 15:15

Wow . I'm a secondary teacher and it is very annoying and disruptive when students ask to go to the toilet. My first responsive is always no - not during a lesson. This puts off anyone trying it on for a break! If they ask again and say they are really desperate I usually say yes- a) they are brave enough to have asked again b) you can tell immediately by their behaviour that they mean it .
I'm sorry for your son what a terrible outcome

BillWagglestaff · 12/02/2016 15:15

*were

HappyChristmasPratcheters · 12/02/2016 15:15

I'm a supply teacher. Every school I work in (secondary) says I am not allowed to let students out in the middle of lessons to the loo. If they ask in the first few minutes I generally let them go and mentally chalk it up to switch over time.
However as supply I have no idea who is trying it on and who isn't. On the occasions when I have let pupils go to the loo I then have upwards of 10 students also wanting to go, and it's hard enough as a supply cover teacher to keep them working without them all having a jolly to the loo and disrupting the class when they come back in. If I have a double lesson I let them go at the half way point, or I negotiate to let them the leave the lesson 5 minutes before the end as long as they finish their work - so they still get to go but are not late for their next lesson.
Occasionally I have let pupils go mid lesson - and on a couple of occasions they have either gone walkabout, or on one memorable occasion self-harmed in the loos, and sometimes been the chief suspects for subsequent loo blocking ups and damage.

It's a really hard call to make when you don't know the kids involved.

When I have been a permanent teacher however I did use to let them go as long as I thought they could be sensible and not mess around, or didn't suspect them of meeting a mate to get up to mischief...

Zariyah · 12/02/2016 15:16

Oh your poor boy, I feel so sad for him. :( I hope he's ok. I rarely use this word as I think people on MN exaggerate but I would be furious at the teacher and the ridiculous policy of locking toilets.

MaidrinRua · 12/02/2016 15:18

That's a disgrace!

I'm a teacher, admittedly primary, but I ALWAYS work on the assumption that if a child asks more than once than they do need the loo and I let them go.

Your poor DS. The teacher sounds utterly cold and cruel. I would email/call the head ASAP...she might be able to catch the bitch for a word on her way out.

HappyChristmasPratcheters · 12/02/2016 15:19

BillWagglestaff that public bollocking happened a few times to me as well.

Although to be fair the loos were being consistently flooded, damaged and faeces-smeared in lessons - which then made it impossible for ANYONE to use the loo until they had been fixed and decontaminated. I'm talking sinks pulled off the walls, toilet bowls wedged full of just stuff, etc :(

HappyChristmasPratcheters · 12/02/2016 15:21

Just out of curiosity what would people do here if loos were consistently being vandalised in lesson time (putting them out of use for hours if not days)?

You can't put up CCTV in toilets....

StatisticallyChallenged · 12/02/2016 15:24

If they're locked at changeover I'm surprised it doesn't happen more often-afternoons at my high school were 4 x 40 minute periods long. If your year group was the last allowed to go for lunch you might only have finished eating or drinking 10-15 minutes before classes started so wouldn't have needed to pee out whatever you drank at lunch before going back to class.

Iirc lunch ended at 1.05 and school finished 3.45. How many of us would need the loo in that time frame?

ExitPursuedByABear · 12/02/2016 15:26

Your poor son. I feel a bit tearful just thinking about him in that situation.

StillDrSethHazlittMD · 12/02/2016 15:29

Happy You can put CCTV on the doors leading into the toilets. You can check the toilets every hour (like cleaners/staff do in most pubs, bars, theatres, shopping centres).

StillDrSethHazlittMD · 12/02/2016 15:33

Walshie I'm sure I'm not the only one who would appreciate you coming back to the thread and letting us know how you get on with the school over this.

CalleighDoodle · 12/02/2016 15:36

If youre checking the toilets every hour all that is going to mean is you find the Vandalism within an hour.

statistically i frequently go from 7.30 am until 1.15pm without a toilet break because i dont have the time. Sometimes i dont get to go all day. It would worry me more if i couldnt hold it for under three hours!

GlitterNails · 12/02/2016 15:37

Your poor son, that's really horrific. Also think the policy of locked toilets is awful - what about girls in their periods? Often teenagers have heavy and erratic periods - I know I certainly did, and had to rush to the loo between every class to check I hadn't leaked.

Also remember running to the toilet to throw up a couple of times when I was ill at school.

The minority of people that mess around shouldn't lead to humilating others. If they have time to send someone to lock the door all the time, why not station someone outside them, or train a camera on them so they can see who has been in there for too long?

Original poster
Walshie123 · 12/02/2016 15:38

Medical is right opposite the locked boys toilet, so I don't know why that's locked, the medical lady is just opposite!

OP posts:
Woodhill · 12/02/2016 15:50

How can all the dc go to the toilet at same time in break. Perhaps they feel comfortable going in the loo when there aren't any people around e.g bullies

I've worked in secondary and it was discouraged but there was some flexibility.

shovetheholly · 12/02/2016 15:50

How awful for your son - not just that it happened but that the teacher was so awful in dealing with her mistake. I feel so very, very bad for him.

You must be livid. I would definitely complain to the school. And ask them for a plan to help support him in returning, because he must be really scared of being teased or bullied.

For what it's worth, DH is a university professor and he once had an 18 year old wet herself in an introductory lecture. (The students are, of course, allowed to get up and go to the loo if they need to - for some reason, maybe chronic anxiety, I think she just lost control). He said that he just felt awful for her humiliation and arranged for her to get a lift home with a female member of staff (with a bin bag on the seat!), while trying as far as possible to reassure her it was OK. I guess that shows that these things can happen! Telling this in the hope that as a story it might make your DS feel less 'alone' to know that older kids have had the same thing happen, and that they've gone back to class and been supported.

ValancyJane · 12/02/2016 15:52

I work as a teacher in secondary, and in the teachers defence, it may be that SLT are having zero tolerance with students going to the toilet during lessons and may have already given her a telling off for letting students go in lessons (not saying I agree with this, but we are constantly reminded at our school that they shouldn't be going in lessons etc).

For what it's worth, if he'd asked a second time and is a trustworthy student who had rarely asked before, I would have let him go!

StatisticallyChallenged · 12/02/2016 15:57

Ffs it's not a who can go without pissing the longest contest. Sometimes I'll go all day and barely go at all - I hate strange loos - other times its far more often and it's not always a straight link between what I've had to drink that day and frequency either. It's a fairly long time to not have the option for no matter how desperately you need to go.

ZiggyFartdust · 12/02/2016 15:59

If you as a teacher get a "telling off" for letting children piss when they need to, you need to have the wherewithal to tell whoever is giving out to sod off.
They shouldn't have to ask you twice, or have to be deemed trustworthy by you in order to go to the toilet. You're a teacher, not the bladder police.

PortobelloRoad · 12/02/2016 16:00

Another story to ease the social worries, my DD was too nervous/anxious to ask to use the loo on her first day of secondary, in front of the whole school in assembly, she wet herself, brutal. She survived and can look back and laugh now, no bullying or teasing. It will be ok Smile

That teacher sounds like an arsehole. What is wrong with people?

Making an issue of going to the loo only adds to anxiety, you can't wet yourself from anxiety itself, but it can make people hold it far too long and wet themselves, a humiliating and very upsetting thing to happen. I hope he's ok OP.

IdentityRequest1 · 12/02/2016 16:03

TimelyTess,

I was also a teacher, and it's true - there's no way of telling who is putting it on. However, when a kid asks 4 times, it's more disruptive to have him keep asking then to let him go. Also, my main issue is how a 12 year old boy is dealt with when he has wet himself and is crying.
Everyone makes mistakes but as an the responsible adult you have to deal with them appropriately and in a way that minimises the humiliation of your pupils.

ricketytickety · 12/02/2016 16:07

I wet myself when I was his age. Only people who took the mickey was my sister. No-one else batted an eyelid. It was in art too and I told my classmates I'd spilt water on my lap - they seemed to buy it.

Hrafnkel · 12/02/2016 16:14

ziggy it is not about wherewithal. These people are our bosses, who wield an awful lot of power. In any of my jobs - pre-teaching and now - I can't imagine telling my boss to aid off would go well.

I echo posters who have said they are under pressure not to say yes. However, our lessons are 100 minutes long. By year 9 they tend not to ask, ever. In years 7 and 8 I say no the first time, or I ask them to complete the current task first. If 15 mins or less until lesson end I say they need to wait. If they are desperate and can't wait they let me know/I can tell.

Agree also that students are avoiding work or meeting friends more often than you'd like to think. When a nqt I let a girl go who came back reekin mg of smoke Sad

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