AIBU to not pay off DH's debt? (apols for long post)

[bookwormthatturned]

I'm trying to get some perspective on this so would appreciate your thoughts ....

My DH has largely not been employed for the last few years following losing his job at the same time as his father died. He has had a number of fresh starts which haven't worked out and has not had an easy time.
Discussing finances isn't something he is comfortable with so, after getting a vague response whenever I asked how he was financially I ended up leaving it to him to tell me. DH had an amount of cash reserves and was still contributing to the joint account.
It now transpires that he has a significant credit card debt. Talking about it DH had an expectation that I would pay this off (I received a legacy from a relative that would just about cover the debt).
I'm reluctant to do this. The same thing happened a few years ago and we put that amount onto our mortgage (DH had previously funded some improvements so we just 'refunded' an amount of this from the mortgage to cover the debt.)
I have offered to take out a joint 0% interest card and (I'm working so would have the credit rating to do this) transfer the debt onto this. I've also offered to cover the minimum payments while DH is job hunting but he doesn't want to do this. Instead his plan is to continue using the card and then pay it all off as soon as he gets a 'proper' job. I've been encouraging him to be flexible and look at any job to help the cash flow in the short term. He has now taken a Christmas casual job which is due to end shortly.

Sorry for a long post and all the background but I'm losing the plot here. Am I being an unsupportive cow not to just pay it off? My concern is that DH would just carry on using the card and things could escalate again.

TIA

also glad to see posters think its easy to walk into a job after being unemployed for several years

The person who thinks that is HIM.

The person who thinks that is the one who is refusing to cut his cloth, but wants to use up all of his wife's recent inheritance paying off a credit card he ran up without her knowledge and continue borrowing on the card.

He wants to spend as though he already has a high paying job and borrow on a credit card to pay for it.

Utterly idiotic.

I don't believe that the OP wasn't aware of the credit card, where did she think he was getting the money from to pay the bills? If she thought that it was his inheritance then why is it acceptable for him to use his inheritance but not the OP?

If she thought that it was his inheritance then why is it acceptable for him to use his inheritance but not the OP?

So the man should get to spend ALL the family money fannying about and not getting a proper job?

He's blown through one inheritance already.

Is it only when his family is completely destitute that his wife is allowed to put a stop to his delusional spending?

"The person who thinks that is the one who is refusing to cut his cloth, but wants to use up all of his wife's recent inheritance paying off a credit card he ran up without her knowledge and continue borrowing on the card."

cut his cloth? he used the CC to pay for his half of the HOUSEHOLD bills ffs - where did OP think he was getting this money - did it grow on trees?

they also kept a nanny on while he was searching for work - OP was working PART TIME - she obviously didn't earn enough to keep the household bills up to date and pay a nanny - where was the money coming from? oh yes, DHs inheritance... but lets ignore those things and carry on telling OP to keep her money.

If the genders were reversed then the responses would be oh so different.

Sorry John I disagree.

For me it doesn't depend on gender. It depends on why the decision was made for him to still pay half. Did he insist or did she.

The only reason I don't think the OP should pay off the debt is because he didn't tell her. Why didn't he tell her? Because he didn't want to sell the bike or get a job. Or because he knew she would insist he still had to pay half.

As I said I am interested to find out what the OP has been doing with the extra money she has been earning since it's not going in bills. Because she states her job is one of the reasons he has struggled to find work. The answer to that will these questions will make my mind up.

Not the genders of those involved.

johnluther I agree that I think she had a good idea that he was racking up debt.

I can't help but think that as long as he kept paying she was fine with it.

I did start this thread thinking the OP absolutely shouldn't pay his debt off, because

1 - He didn't tell her he was getting into debt and give her chance to avoid it

2 - He has said once it's cleared he is going to continue to do it.

But the Devils in the details and the Op isn't giving those details.

At the moment I am on fence. I can see both sides but without the details I can't make my mind up.

The dh has decided he is looking after the children without a joint discussion. In fact he doesn't even say that himself with the ongoing 'looking for a job' situation.

If they need to use capital to pay the bills and continue in the way they have that is not sustainable.
If his cc is paid off what then?

The op has been chugging along believing he would get a job (and to the person who said would he really not want a job - Erm, no, there are plenty of people both men and woman who would like to be 'kept' - which again is fine IF it is a joint decision)

The OP has stepped up and taken on more hours. He needs to step up too and that starts by him taking responsibility.

And if he is depressed about his dad's death he needs to see a Dr.

TheGoodEnoughWife but hes not kept is he - he is paying for half the bills and putting it on his CC.

"The dh has decided he is looking after the children without a joint discussion"

there may not have been a discussion but OP hasn't given us that info. OP must know though that he looks after kids whilst her DH doesn't work - does it need a discussion?

^cut his cloth? he used the CC to pay for his half of the HOUSEHOLD bills ffs

Well exactly.

So the household bills are more than this family can afford.

Therefore his genius plan of using every penny of his wife's legacy paying off his credit card and then continuing to spend as he has been is totally fucking stupid and her plan of taking on that debt herself and paying it off is actually very generous of her considering this is the second time he has run up credit card debts he couldn't pay off.

The argument they are having is because he wants to continue to spend money in the same way he has been.

He sure seems to enjoy this "financial abuse" some of you are determined to see.

It's a real indication of basic societal sexism that a woman offering to pay off her husband's debts isn't enough. No, she must give him every penny she has before he should even consider facing the reality that he is an unemployed man who can't afford his current lifestyle.

Part of the childcare though must be the extra hours OP is working? Which she is only doing because they don't have enough money coming in?

Maybe the OP would like to go to part time and he could work part time, regularly, and then they can share childcare and she would not have the whole 'he is looking after the children so you must find his spending' issue to deal with?
He doesn't seem to be suggesting that or any suitable solution (as I have said the debts being paid without significant changes to the income/spending is not a solution as the situation will just build up again)

And surely, when the debts were building up, he had some responsibility to bring this up? Clearly we don't know how conversations have gone and yes either one of them must have known the situation wasn't sustainable but he KNEW he was spending money he did not have! Thinking OP will just pay it off.

And if, being kind to him for a bit, he thought he was doing the right thing and looking after the children while the OP works more hours he should have spoken to the OP and said he cannot contribute half any more?

Why is it up to her to take the lead? He is a grown man spending beyond his means and if the had communicated they would have seen together that it couldn't go on and changes need to be made.

He was earning bits and pieces and the OP did ask if money was okay - what else is she supposed to do but take the word of a fully functioning adult?

Part of the childcare though must be the extra hours OP is working? Which she is only doing because they don't have enough money coming in?

But she increased her hours and so pay, thinking that he could afford his half of the bills.

So where is the extra money she is earning? He is paying the same as before, she thought, comfortably. Her half has remained the same. Yet her wage has gone up.

It doesn't make sense

I should think her extra money is going on everyday items like a bit of extra money does. But let's squeeze her a bit more while her dh carries on doing what he likes!

That's not what I said though is it.

Yes you did, you inferred that she had extra money and therefore should be paying more? Or that's what I got by the 'he is still paying half, where is her extra money going'

I bet she is paying more - I expect all those 'incidentals ' are falling to her now. However, if her savings have gone up in this time I may think differently (but I still say it takes two to tango and he has to take responsibility- if it was a sahm I would feel the same and she would be advised on here to TALK to her husband. Exactly how the dh here should have talked to his wife)

I didn't infer anything.

I have asked the questions.

In a partnership one person loses their job but carries on paying their share of household bills. Their full share.

The other increases their hours an wages but it's still only paying half. The same amount they were before.

It doesn't make sense.

You are inferring that she must be paying for extra things. You said 'I bet she is paying for incidentals' But she hasn't said that. She hasn't answered.

I have said all along that she shouldn't pay this debt off because he never told her that he had gone through his money. But I also think she had a good idea it was gone.

I have posed several questions and can't make my mind up, until she answers them. If she does.

But with him paying half the bills we don't know if there wasn't enough money coming in. She said part of the reason he has struggled to find work is to find it around her job and kids.

Which is a problem lots of sahms returning to work have. But doesn't mean they have to keep paying half the bills.

As I have said I am on the fence. There are things that aren't clear, which may sway me.

Can you not just sit down at the table with all your monthly outgoings, debts, income and savings and work out a new budget? You could do it without & with your inheritance?

Sounds like you both need to get a grip on finances now there is not a regular second income?

Seeing all the figures written down should help decide what you want to do.

Personally I would not spend my inheritance on my dh debts. I would on joint debts but not on feckless debts that have been run up with no plan on how to pay them back!!

For the 'extra money' from OP's extra hours, I doubt there is much? Her DP's income when he had his proper job likely covered half the bills, plus leaving disposable income/spending money. When he lost the job and was just paying half the bills, that disposable/spending money for days out with the family, clothes, food etc was gone, or greatly reduced. So she's working more hours to fill in that gap?

Some posters have commented on information missing - I've been trying to be as objective as I can in what I posted as in reality this is a really emotive issue.
DH wanted to carry on contributing to the joint account when his father died. I suggested him picking up a short term job while he tried to start his own business to avoid using his inheritance for living expenses. I also periodically raised this issue of childcare costs and letting our (brilliant) nanny go. DH did not want to do this as having the nanny meant he could focus on the business, then, later, that he could focus on job hunting and take up a job rather than us having the stress of finding new childcare in a hurry. While our nanny was with us DH had sole care of 1 child at school and 1 pre-schooler for one day a week.
When our nanny left we did not replace her but used a nursery for 2 days a week up until our youngest child started school.
When I had the opportunity I increased my hours, DH reduced his £ contribution to make his funds last longer and I increased my contribution. This is where my extra earnings have gone.
I have managed to keep my working pattern flexible so as to be able to pick up childcare as needed but as the sole earner I had to take any opportunity to increase the family income.
Some posters have picked up on the issue of the bikes and read into this that DH is spending lots of time / money on them. In reality DH rarely rides them and, while they are saleable, they would only cover around 20% of the debt. The bigger financial drain is the garage which is used for the bikes and storage with a rental cost of around £1k a year. DH has suggested selling one of the bikes but has not done so. I have suggested downsizing the garage or finding other storage.
Sorry for a v disjointed post but I'm trying to respond to people's queries and comments.
I recognise there's been some v dysfunctional communication between us. When I try to raise the matter it becomes v emotional and difficult to have a constructive conversation.
The pair of us sorting out our is a whole other topic but my posting here is around asking advice of how to engage with someone who doesn't seem to want to take up any suggestions.

Thank you for coming back and giving further info. I am staying firmly in the don't pay his debts camp!

Thanks for all your thoughts Thegoodenoughwife and to everyone else who has taken the time to follow and contribute - getting others' perspective is really useful - please do keep it coming.

I think you should agree a time to sit down to discuss your financial situation. Give him time to prepare and to get used to the realisation that, for you, the family's finances have reached crunch point.

Then, at that talk, I think you should suggest that a line in the sand be drawn. What's done is done. But together you can work out what the situation is today, what resources are available to you right now, and a plan of action to get yourselves straight again.

This plan should not include hinm working, because that is something that might happen but may be a while off yet, and certainly not to the earning potential his is hoping for.

And you should agree to be more honest and open with each other in the future. It is the healthiest way to maintain a relationship and will avoid the tension, mistrust and second-guessing that must be going on right now.

How to engage...

Well, as your husband he owes you the fundamental respect of meeting with you at your request to discuss these very important issues. It's too bad if he feels squeamish about them. If he doesn't want to engage with you he basically is saying he doesn't want to engage with the fundamental needs of the marriage and family.

Would it help to involve a third party such as a family member, family friend, mentor or some sort of financial advisor?

If your husband will not cooperate I would suggest engaging a reputable financial advisor yourself for advice on where you stand (perhaps your bank or employer has a low-cost option? Don't go to a commissioned person) AND that you pull credit reports on both of you ASAP so that you can see exactly what debts are out there. There could be more than you know.

As to the bikes, 20 percent is better than nothing and spending that amount on storage per year is absurd. Is he in a lease with the storage venue or can he stop abruptly? I'd have those bikes listed for sale ASAP.