AIBU to not pay off DH's debt? (apols for long post)

[bookwormthatturned]

I'm trying to get some perspective on this so would appreciate your thoughts ....

My DH has largely not been employed for the last few years following losing his job at the same time as his father died. He has had a number of fresh starts which haven't worked out and has not had an easy time.
Discussing finances isn't something he is comfortable with so, after getting a vague response whenever I asked how he was financially I ended up leaving it to him to tell me. DH had an amount of cash reserves and was still contributing to the joint account.
It now transpires that he has a significant credit card debt. Talking about it DH had an expectation that I would pay this off (I received a legacy from a relative that would just about cover the debt).
I'm reluctant to do this. The same thing happened a few years ago and we put that amount onto our mortgage (DH had previously funded some improvements so we just 'refunded' an amount of this from the mortgage to cover the debt.)
I have offered to take out a joint 0% interest card and (I'm working so would have the credit rating to do this) transfer the debt onto this. I've also offered to cover the minimum payments while DH is job hunting but he doesn't want to do this. Instead his plan is to continue using the card and then pay it all off as soon as he gets a 'proper' job. I've been encouraging him to be flexible and look at any job to help the cash flow in the short term. He has now taken a Christmas casual job which is due to end shortly.

Sorry for a long post and all the background but I'm losing the plot here. Am I being an unsupportive cow not to just pay it off? My concern is that DH would just carry on using the card and things could escalate again.

TIA

Please don't give him money to pay off his debts (and no, you are not duty bound to as married) he needs to deal with this himself or he WILL just run the debt up again.

No no no, don't do it OP!!

He must show at least some sense of financial responsibility and willingness to pull his head out of the sand, before you even think about paying off his debts (not that I recommend you do). That means, at the very minimum, being able to have a proper conversation about what his plan is to manage the situation himself, and selling off those bikes.

Unless he faces up to his own responsibility for this mess he is in, he is just going to keep running up more debt.

,If they were to split it would be taken into account in any settlement by the the courts so in that way it is 'both' their debts.

That's not true in the UK. It is different in America but in the UK you are not responsible for anyone else's credit card debt. I wish people would stop spouting it on these threads because it makes people think they'll be in more financial difficulty post-split than they actually will be!

"You are not liable for any debts your spouse has run up in their sole name, even though you live at the same address. The only exception to this is utility bills. Even if the account is in their name, if you are living there, you could be held accountable for any overdue payments."

www.bainesandernst.co.uk/help-and-advice/personal-finance/responsible-marriage-debts/

I'm in two minds about this one. Yes, your dh sounds a bit flakey regarding finding a job and also for not being upfront about his finances. But, by the sounds of it he has been covering (half?) Household expenses when he has no income, where did you think he was getting the money from, over a couple of years that would have been a big reserve.

Op i think you sound pretty reasonable, Im a little surprised how much pp are slating your dh though - what happened to all money is family money mantra? If he had been upfront from the off, would youbhave covered all household costs? You need a discussion about budgets and what you (as a couple) can afford and take it from there with regard to garage rent etc.

I wouldn't use the legacy to pay the debt off, but I would help pay it off over a period of time if u can get the 0% deal..on the condition of course that the credit card goes!

Don't pay it off, you'll never see that money again if you do! Agree with everyone who said sell the bikes.

My XH was useless with money (still is but no it's no longer my problem). I was dumb enough not only to pay off his debts several times but also to 'lend' him money on multiple occasions. All in all he owes me around 30k, which I will never see again!

... and just to add insult to injury, he went after half my pension funds during our divorce proceedings. The judge saw this for the pisstake it was, thank goodness.

TBH his assumption that you would simply pay it off along with his refusal to discuss finances sounds as though he's taking the piss massively! How does his fragile male ego cope with being financially dependent on a woman. He might end up resenting you for paying (been there, too)!

The bikes have to go

Why are you worried about being confrontational or seen as controlling? If there was ever a time for it, now is it !!! Tell him your inheritance is staying where it is. Get rid of the rented garage and sell at least one bike.

Agree with everyone else. It's hard.

My Mum and beloved stepfather's marriage wasn't brilliant but it finally ended when he ran up debts after having been OK with money for quite a few years (she had bailed him out more than once at the start of their relationship). It was clear to Mum he felt safe borrowing from all and sundry because my Grandad had died and he knew Mum would be inheriting a decent amount and she would be able to sort it. Instead she booted him out and gave him a sum to cover his debts in return for taking his name off the deeds of the house (it was her house when they met and she had put his name on the deeds for aforementioned "male identity" reasons). He thought he would get his debts covered and carry on as before. Instead of which he did get them paid, but also lost his marriage and his share in the house. Still very fond of him, lovely chap, but I think my Mum did the right thing. She still feels bitter at the amount of my Grandad's money she had to lose when they could have enjoyed it together as a couple if he only hadn't done what he did.

I am wondering if he has kept up the pretence of being ok financially because he knows the bikes would need to go if he can't.

At the point he admits he can not longer contribute to the household income, he can't justify keeping the bikes. While he is still paying his half of the bills, he can.

Except his plan is now is to get the OP to pay it off so he can continue living like this.

As I said me and dh have separate money to a certain point but I know roughly how much he has and vice Versa. I do find it a bit odd that the op had no clue that he was living beyond his means.

If dh wasn't working and still paying half of the bills 2-3 years later, plus spending a fair amount of money on a hobby. I would be asking where the money is coming from. I know he couldn't maintain the bills for a long time from his personal savings. Even though I don't have an exact figure of what he has in savings.

Why does he need more than one bike?

There is nothing wrong with him being the SAHD or if he is unemployed if you are OK with that as a family unit. You need to have the uncomfortable long awaited talk about your joint finances though. I can't believe that you have no idea about how much income/savings he has when he is unemployed but still contributing the household bills. Separate finances will always come a cropper when the shit hits the fan and joint expenses are at risk. You do realise that going forwards - you have to take responsibility as well to help him manage the debt else how on earth can your marriage survive in the long term? Debt inevitably will colour your relationship since it impacts your day to day decisions like going on a day out. It would be extremely hard not to resent someone who is not prepared to make sacrifices (his bikes) or make an effort to graft at paid work instead of putting your heads in the sand. I would treat the debt as a family debt but the onus is on him to get paid work so that, as a family, you could pay it off faster. If there was a realistic choice, i wouldn't spend your inheritance on it in a lump sum. In your shoes, (if there is a choice), I would ring fence your inheritance and instead, divert whatever monthly disposable household income at the debt. Obviously, this means sacrificing savings and treats and unnecessary expenditure but this is how it goes. Good Luck with that.

You've bailed him out of personal debts once already. That's more than enough.

Don't spend your legacy OR make yourself responsible for this debt.

He hasn't worked in 3 years and is still maintaining multiple bikes and a garage he can't afford.

That is entirely his problem to sort.

What kind of "male pride" allows that level of sponging off your wife?

If he calls you "controlling" for not bailing him out repeatedly while he ignores the financial realities of his situation, then he is a male chauvinist who feels entitled to your money until he has bled you dry.

If he's been unemployed for 3 years he doesn't have any income to contribute to his own or family expenses. How is he even paying the minimum monthly payment? You need to sit down together and go through how much income you have coming in and the budget needed for you both to live. Essentials ear marked first, then bit towards debt or saving, then the fun stuff.

The bikes need to go, between you garage rental can't be covered and the bikes will pay off a chunk of the cc debt, bringing the monthly interest down. I wonder if he buries his head in the sand when he sees the statement and the interest amount.

I would take his willingless to openly go through finances and sell the bikes as an indication of how to deal with it.
He can't spend as if he's employed, build up debts and expect you to use inheritance paying it off. That money would be great lump some to invest and build up some savings.
He can sit down with you, openly go through it all and come up with a plan.

You offered to transfer the debt & he said no!

Pay it off his way-and you're worried about coming across as controlling!

I can understand a little how this has happened to him re keep "paying his way" when he no longer could & hoping I suppose that one of his "fresh starts" would work out or another would come along.

But now, there's not the money coming to pay off debt and house bikes.

So the solution is obvious!

So he isnt arsed about getting a long term job, still spends like he is earning good money, wont discuss finances until he absolutely has to and then only to tell you that he expects you to bail him out?

You have bigger problems here than his debt.

I see how he's got himself into this position, but he also needs to learn to get out of it or he will keep doing the same things over and over because it's easy. That's human nature...he won't step out of his comfort zone if he doesn't have to.
If he was truly in dire straits I'd help him out, but he isn't. If you aren't earning, you don't get luxuries. He either needs to get a job, any job, ASAP, or sell his motorbikes and give up his garage, and trim any other luxuries...then he can consider his next step.

Where did you think the money was coming from to fund his contribution to the joint account?

It's not that he doesn't like talking about money or his 'male pride' (he's quite happy for you to carry him financially), it's the accountability he doesn't like. He'd rather run up debt with the expectation for you to bail him out and surprise, surprise the pattern has repeated.

Draw up a family budget so you know what you can afford and so you can assess your priorities. It's time you both had a grown up conversation about finances and responsibilities.

He won't change, so don't bail him out bitter experience

Presumably she thought he was drawing on the cash reserves she mentions in the OP.

Since he doesn't like discussing finances, it's a bit rich to blame her for not imagining he was putting essentials on a credit card whilst maintaining multiple motorbikes in a garage.

What would he do if you hadn't received an inheritance. It suits him that you've lost someone, doesn't it?.

Do not use the legacy. Take his cards off him. Give him a tenner a week and a bus pass to the job centre and tell him to grow the fuck up and get a job. Anything that brings in money is fine. Doing nothing for another day never mind years is not acceptable.

Very convenient to say oh, but I don't feel like a real man if I have to live off you. Bollocks. Utter bollocks. A real man does anything he can to support and love his family.

The bikes have obviously got to go, and DH is very much in the wrong here for several reasons. I certainly wouldn't be remotely up for helping at all with the part of the debt relating to his upkeep of his bikes and garage during this period.

I do wonder, though, where you thought the money was coming from to cover whatever he was putting into the joint expenses. You mentioned he didn't like talking about it OP, did he lie? Did you assume, or did you have an inkling but leave him to it?

What a difficult situation op. He's being a knob though, you offered to transfer the debt and he said no. I'm sorry but he needs to sell the bikes to cover the debt. It's the sensible option. Time to put his big boy pants on. If he wants to be a sahp or whatever, that's fine if you can afford it and you're both happy. However, if you're not happy and he's refusing to take a job I would be looking at the relationship tbh. Someone who is happy to stay unemployed whilst accruing debt and expecting their spouse to pay it off clearly doesn't respect them very much at all.

He had an "expectation" that you would use your inheritance to pay off his debts? When he hasn't been working and has an expensive hobby, and has no real plan to avoid running up more debt in future?

Fuck. That. Shit.