to not punish DD for hitting her dad?

[livvielunch]

DD is 4 and undergoing assessment for autism. She has a multitude of sensory processing issues and hates physical contact of any sort, particularly affection. She will actually scream and cry if she thinks anyone (I.e. approaching grandparents) may try and hug her. Despite this, DP insists on trying to kiss and hug her. This morning she was playing and he said goodbye to her as he was going out. She blanked him, as is usual. He said can I have a kiss, she flinched and shook her hear violently, turned away from him and continued playing. He leaned round with his lips puckered inches from her face and she slapped him in it. He was angry and stomped off mumbling 'love you too' and later said I should've stepped in and punished DD for her aggression. I said I think he should respect her wishes not to be hounded for affection and that he deserved it, really. Aibu?

Brioche, ds2 can't bear to be touched on the neck or head, he says it feels like someone's going to rip his head off.
A hug and kiss feels awful to him, and will often frighten him.

When you've got fucked up sensory processing a peck on the cheek or light touch can feel like a punch.

But what will happen when a child touches her at school? - she has to know in no uncertain terms that she cannot slap them!!

But it's easier said than done Brioche.
I imagine all parents with a dc with ASD is striving to teach these basic social skills, but because they have ASD it's far more difficult.
I'm relatively lucky as my ds holds it in at school, but he comes home and melts down and is violent because he can't handle the stress of a day at school. many families have to deal with multiple exclusions and epic battles to get the right support for their dc, and on top of that, there's often the other dc taunting and prodding to see what reaction they'll get, with limited input from teachers because they see the child with ASD as naughty rather than someone who needs support.

Ds2(13) has asc, he is high functioning and he does know that lashing out is wrong. He has made huge progress in the last year or so in not lashing out but he still has issues with impulse control and if someone really pushes his buttons he may lash out. Generally it's if someone has physically hurt him first, been in his face etc.

He has a plan at school to avoid him getting to this stage and it seems to be working but it has and is taking a lot of work.

Interestingly although we have support from paeds, camhs etc they have all said that actually impulse control is one of the last parts of brain development to mature fully so although it's stressful, worrying etc they don't see it as a big deal it's developmentally within the normal range.

Op I agree With those saying not to punish your dd. Her father needs to learn about her asd and her needs and regardless of asd her bodily autonomy needs to be respected. She should absolutely be able to no to any kind of physical affection and that must be respected. What kind of lesson would we be teaching her if we said she had to comply?!!

You shouldn't punish her, but it would be a good time to talk about appropriate responses.

You also need to have another talk with your DP about boundaries and respecting her space.

I'm staggered that people are still saying punish. She has expressly stated unequivocally and repeatedly that she does not wish to be kissed or touched but he continually ignores her. What is left for her to do except just submit to his wishes?

What is interesting about this is that I thought it was universally accepted that men who force unwanted kisses on women get slapped. It's common knowledge.
I mean, I have always been of the opinion that women shouldn't have to resort to slapping, but that men just shouldn't do it in the first place, but I thought the conservatives acknowledged a woman's right to slap.

And this child is 4 years old and slapped a grown man, who took advantage of the fact that she's a little child.

If a woman slapped a little boy for attempting to hug her leg, then I would see why people think a slap is an inappropriate response, but really - what damage can a slap by a 4 year old do?
Most adults don't even see a need to punish a baby or young toddler who hit them unprovoked, just becaue he thought it's funny.

You shouldn't punish her, but it would be a good time to talk about appropriate responses.

What do you think is the appropriate response to an assault by a person who is three times her weight and height?

Okay, running away might be a smarter reaction, but ethically, there's nothing wrong with hitting someone who is so much bigger than you.

Or do you think telling someone the very same thing he ignored before AFTER allowing him to assault you would be of any use?

OP, your DP is 100% in the wrong here. Every child and every adult has the right to not accept unwanted physical displays of affection. And a big fat for the poster comparing what the OP's P is doing to any form of essential medical or safety intervention.

Vestal

I mean exactly what I posted, to expand

talk about what is appropriate to different situations.

It seems to me to be a good time to start having these conversations.

"Or do you think telling someone the very same thing he ignored before AFTER allowing him to assault you would be of any use?"

I don't think that at all.

He has to be taught not to treat her this way. It's manipulative, he knows it will provoke a negative response. It's bordering on emotional abuse.

I know I'd rather raise a child who hits out at unwanted physical affection than one who has been trained to passively accept it, whatever her own feelings. Ask him which version of teenage daughter he wants...

Well Brioche what will likely happen at school is she will either learn to ruthlessly suppress her responses in that highly structured environment and all the stresses will build up to intolerable levels which she will then let out at home onto her trusted adults or hopefully the structure will actually help her to manage more easily so that her sensory issues aren't quite so intense. Worse case scenario though will be that she won't be able to control herself at school either, so will struggle constantly with being labelled "naughty""violent" and "disruptive", her school career will be a nightmare from the moment it starts with all the other parents whispering and judging about that "nasty child and why doesn't Someone Do Something?!" The latter happened to my child and family btw and now I have no choice but to home educate him. So loads of appealing options there

@boney: So you think she should tell her daughter that slapping her father was completely justified, but that running away would have been smarter? Good to know.

@SpecialistSnowflake:
Ask him which version of teenage daughter he wants...

I fear he might not be so concerned about his daughters' wellbeing and more about being bros with her boyfriends ... but maybe that's me being pessimistic.

To anyone saying the dd should be reprimanded for slapping (and there are certainly a few who feel this way, surprisingly!) What would you say she should have done?! She ALREADY said no! Her father ignored her. So then what? If a grown man tried to in any way touch my daughter in a way she didn't want, I'd be thrilled if she slapped them. Better than submitting against her will. And thinking that she can't say no to a man trying to touch her, even if she doesn't like it...

This in no way has parallels with playground behaviour, or dealing with her peers at school. That is a different thing and for staff and support to help with. This is about her father, who should be her safe place at all times, not a source of stress.

Vestal

Its interesting that you have intentionally misinterpreted my response and mixed it in with your post.

What response are you after? because you seem quite happy to make stuff up and twist things to meet your PoV.

No, Brioche, I never hug or kiss her. I offer to kiss her better if she's hurt and offer cuddles, she physically recoils and looks as if I've just asked if she wants dog poo for tea. Occasionally she'll lean into me while I read to her or hold my hand briefly as we walk but that's the only time she'll touch me. Yes, it's hard but I couldn't enjoy affection knowing it's uncomfortable for her. DPs parents behave similarly to him so I worry she'll lash out at them (particularly as they don't believe in her having autism.) At the moment they chase for kisses then call her whiney when she complains. I've explained she can and should say no if it's physical contact she doesn't want and she does do that repeatedly. AFAIC, DP should've listened and deserved what he got. DD always asks to give her sibling a kiss goodnight. I ask if she'd like one from me, she always says no and I leave it there.

I don't think a peck on the cheek from her dad is an extremely intimate act

OP said he was pursing his lips for a kiss on the lips.

I feel that my post before was misunderstood and I resent Springsoon saying it was very bad advice and also NeedsASockAmnesty saying it was a heap of crap.

Re Nickifury and brioche, yes I think this is a problem. The child attends school, is forced to suppress. Generally. Often lashing out.

Ds1 lashed out last week and was put in isolation. Whilst I am cross with the school, I need to teach ds that this is not ok. Because re school and getting a job, he will have to confirm, so I see it as in his best interests trying to help him to do so.

CONFORM

At school she may have to hold hands with a partner, have people brush against her- she should slap them?

What should happen at school is that reasonable adjustments should be made for her disability. Therefore she should never be made to hold hands with anyone, arrangements should be made so that she doesn't have to go into crowded areas (e.g. leaving lessons slightly early or late) and she should have a TA with her able to ensure so far as possible that no-one brushes against her.

And yes, I know the likelihood is that that won't happen, but it doesn't mean it shouldn't, or that she should be punished for others' failures.