To think that actually dsd should know the consequences of her decision?

[Cloudybutwarm]

Yes I'm braving aibu for a step related issue....

Dsd is 10.5.

On Saturday, as in 6 days time, we are due to be flying to Florida, her, me, Dh and our two boys, 4 and 1. This was booked and paid for months ago.

Yesterday we had a text from her mum to say that dsd has decided she doesn't want to come as she doesn't want to be away from her mum for so long. In the run up to the holiday she has said a few times she was going to really miss her mum, but she is spent far more time talking about how much she's looking forward to it. We have an ongoing thing with her not liking to be away from her mum so Dh had a few conversations with her about it before we booked and she was adamant she'd be fine.

We have taken her on holiday before, and yes she missed her mum and there was the odd tear but overall she was fine and loved the holiday.

So now with less than a week to go we are probably £1k down, have a heartbroken 4 year old who idolises his big sister and doesn't understand why she won't be coming any more and of course a completely gutted Dh.

There is obviously no point in insisting that she comes as that would probably end up making for a miserable holiday for everyone.

Her mum said to Dh please don't be angry with her, she's really upset. Dh is torn between being angry and feeling that he shouldn't be angry with her. I personally think that 10 is obviously a tricky age as she's still a child and yet not a young child.... And therefore I do think that while it's not like we need to be cross and shouty she does need to understand what she's done, that it's cost us a lot of money and that both her dad and brother are very upset. I think she is certainly old enough to be made to see there are consequences for makings decisions like this right at the last moment.

So as not to drip feed, it came to light last week that she's been experiencing some low level bullying at school which has obviously been upsetting her, I must admit that I struggle to see that she wouldn't then prefer to go to Disney for two weeks rather than be in school but there we go....

So basically aibu to think that in these circumstances actually it's ok to be a bit angry and to spell out to dsd the consequences of her actions?

clam it's not necessarily irrelevant to the OPs DSD - who may have been put under pressure at school due to her Dads decision - a teacher saying she'll have to work hard to catch up, or miss out on extras (and yes, I know teachers shouldn't do that, but some do).

Ooh sorry button my bad!

Pretty sure OP meant bobble, not you Button.

How are DSD's anxiety levels in general, OP? Is she generally an anxious child? because that might be part of the problem.

I think you're getting a lot of unnecessary stick here; you've tried to do the best for DSD and it hasn't worked out, possibly because your DSD has high anxiety (I don't know yet) - but I do think that she should be made aware that her decision is not without knock-on effects, not so much the money, but the disappointment her Dad and little brother will feel without her being there. Plus that she will not be asked on future holidays, to avoid putting this much stress on her, so she will miss out.

It's a fine line to draw between "you did this and these were the effects" and emotional blackmail, but I think you have to find a way.

It is not anyone's fault it is just one of those thingsthat happens with young kids.

There are two people who are being unreasonable here, and neither of them is your DSD.

Number ONE is your DH, who pushed this big holiday during term-time when he knew he had an anxious DC and an ex who facilitates that anxiety. He went ahead and booked it unilaterally, despite both your and ex's reservations. He could get certain dates off, so he went for it and if he's £1k down, quite frankly that's his fault.

Number TWO is DSD's DM. I was a step-child myself and holidays with our dad were non-negotiable. My sister and I never wanted to go, but there was no question of backing out. He was our dad. We went. End of story. And our DM, even though she missed us and we missed her and she knew our DSM would be a complete bitch to us for the length of the holiday, would never have pulled the emotionally blackmailing, needy tactics that your DSD's mum is pulling. Talk about pulling the poor girl in two directions - she's got a dad she doesn't want to disappoint and a DM who makes it almost impossible for her to go away with her dad without an avalanche of guilt and umpteen calls at all times of the day. AND she's being bullied at school!

Your DH and his ex need to get their communication sorted out and stop pulling your DSD between them. Your DH needs to respect school term-time and his DD's very difficult position, and her DM needs to stop being so bloody selfish and learn to wave her off with a cheery smile and understand that time spent with her dad is every bit as important as time spent with her.

OP, the point is, the adults continually put the little girl into the situation where she is expected to keep everyone happy, and there is no way of doing that, even if she forgets about herself.

She is perpetually in a no-win situation. She can't keep mum happy, dad happy, dsd happy, dsm happy, dsb happy, db happy all at once. She is the only one in the total middle of this. Whatever she does, she gets it wrong, and someone "punishes" her.

Things like Disney holidays don't make up for such fundamental emotional insecurity. At ages 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10 etc this will be a very scary situation for her, never mind things like being bullied at school into the mix (and the fact she is being pushed into being a people pleaser by her home situation won;t help that either).

It looks like basically the adults don;t want to take responsibility (or even recognise) the situation that they have contributed to, and want to leave all the coping to the little girl. Then they get angry/disappointed/manipulative if they don't get what they want, even though they weren't prepared to contribute to the work of finding a way that worked for everyone, and just left to up to a small child. She's one step up from a whipping boy- she has to carry the whole family's emotions.

In our situation, we just say "that's a shame, we were looking forward to it." Whilst this means that they aren't bring emotionally 'pulled in two' or made to feel guilty, it also means they never understand that their DH has feelings/is upset, or that making arrangements then cancelling is quite selfish behaviour. Neither of them would be in any way traumatised by going on holiday, they love their Dad and enjoy spending time with him, it's just they are made to feel very guilty about leaving their mum.

bobble seriously, what??

No one 'punished' her for Christmas. She got upset, she got taken home. No one told her she ruined Christmas.

She is not in any way being made to feel responsible for people's emotions on a day to day basis (can't speak for her mother, but certainly not from us) I'm not going to keep defending myself to you as you are clearly going to read what you want into what saying.

For those asking about her anxiety, well, she's always been very close to mum but not to an anxious degree. In fact she is normally a very happy and confident child who loves school, does loads of activities, has plenty of friends and is generally very positive and good natured.

I've been that kid. I think jacks11 strikes just the right balance.

A little diversion here:
BobbleCat's reaction is a little harsh, but I must say when my sister and I were little we would have given anything for some like her to "fight our corner." We really had no one paying much attention much less trying to see our point of view. We were pulled from pillar to post and had to attend to adult needs and feelings quite a bit. Now in our 40s, we are still working it all through. So I can't be cross with Bobble. I realise that she may have this particular situation wrong, I just don't know enough about the ins and outs of the OPs situation. However, I still think her strong voice for the child is useful on threads that hundreds of adults with blended families may be reading.

I wouldn't put up with this. She is 10 - she needs to understand about money sooner or later, and it's clear that she is being pandered too by her mother.

At her age I hated visiting my grandparents (Dad's side) once a month but my mother made me go because it was arranged and my grandparents would have been upset. You just get on with it and I don't think I have been scarred for life by it!

It's not your place to say anything - Your DH needs to speak to her mother.

A ten year old doesn't get to choose if they go on a family holiday. In a non step family a child could not just opt out. Your dsd has two parents , her being with her mum is not more important.

This a million times over afaic. Pandering to this is just gonna lead to bigger problems down the road.

Can't you see OP that your DSD is caught between a rock and a hard place?

On the one hand she sounds fairly happy to spend time with her dad, you and her two little half-DBs on your side, but on the other hand she's got a needy DM and a half-DB who is left out. Now this half-DB is no concern of yours or your DH's, but your DSD lives with him FT and if he's pissed off that she's getting lots of advantages that he isn't it could be having an impact on her that you're completely unaware of.

So this fancy holiday to Disney is during term-time (and while you clearly don't have an issue with this she may be worried about missing school work or other end-of-term Christmas activities), its two weeks (a long time for her to be away from her mum), its over her mum's birthday, AND her DM clearly has an issue with DSD having more stuff than her DS from previous relationship gets. Oh, and she's being bullied at school. This holiday was a disaster waiting to happen. Can't you see that?

Agree with pp's, lot's of warm, gentle coaxing, talk to her mum to see if she can do any more to encourage her and see if you can change her mind. Show her some photo's and video's of how amazing and fun it is, and reasure her she can talk/skype with her mum everyday if she wants/any chance she gets. Make it clear she might never get the chance to go again, unless her mum can take her. I wouldn't guilt her about the money (she'll feel guilty one day anyway, par for course) but make it clear to her this cost lot's of money. (I assume?) much more than santa (if she believes) is allowed to spend on christmas presents. At 10 she might not have a full grasp on just how much £1000 is. Maybe not that far removed from £100 in her head.

If she still won't go, I wouldn't invite her on any more holidays as this will probably happen again. And yes to not banning other dc from talking about it in front of her. That's her consequence, she made a choice to back out of a fairly expensive holiday, so she won't be invited next time. Takes the pressure off everyone next time if it's pre agreed she's defo not going.

juneau if you read my posts you will see I predicted this outcome from the start.

I've also said repeatedly that I disagree with the time off school.

Okay, so we're in agreement. But this isn't your DSD's fault. Its your DH and his ex's fault.

clam it isn't the usual mumsnet reaction to term time hols though.

It is 4 1/2 months off her SATS. Schools put a lot of pressure on yr 6 children It is apparently worse this year with the new curriculum.

I assume Dad will have spoken to school re catch up work and implications for SATS. But child could be worrying she will have to do extra classes at playtime or perhaps worrying she wont be entered for level 5/6 like her friends. She might even be worrying she will get separated from friends at secondary school if she gets bad results.

As an adult we know SATS are to measure the school but when you are 10 and your teacher has been saying how important they are things can look very different.

Also the fine thing, has anyone reassured her mum and dad are not going to prison. She will be aware you can't have time off school and all it takes is for some kid to have said ooh your mum will go to prison.

When I was 9 or 10 my Dad (who never went to Dr) had some Dr apts in the evening. My mum was very evasive about it. I thought he was dying. Years later I realised he was just having a vasectomy! My imagination had run wild.

OP - hope your DH manages to get something sorted with whoever you have booked with and you have a lovely holiday.

the adults continually put the little girl into the situation where she is expected to keep everyone happy, and there is no way of doing that, even if she forgets about herself.

That's the same of all DCs who are expected to compromise as part of a family though, isn't it?
I don't read anything you have described as unique to the OPs DSD, or even DCs with separated parents - most DCs are asked to choose between going shopping with mum or helping dad look after little sister, or expected to visit grandparents even if it's more fun to go to the playground?

Unless one parent literally 'disappears' from a DCs life when they separate, there will always be situations in which the DC is faced with conflicting emotions - it's up to the adults to help the DC work through them, not engineer the DCs life so that these conflicts don't exist.

The OPs DSD has natural feelings if anxiety around being away from her mum - feelings that have been reinforced and validated by her Dad returning her to her Mum last Xmas, and by her mum assuring her that she 'won't have to go on holiday' with her dad for several years.

School won't be as accommodating when the DC attends residentials - and if the parents approach those differently, then it does suggest that it's not the DCs feelings, but their own, which are taking priority.

The term-time holiday IS the most relevant thing about this whole story.

Op's dh needs to grow up and act like an adult. That includes sucking up the loss of money because he did an excessively irresponsible thing.

Who knows what conversations have been had between dsd and her mother, but if I was in the ex's position I would have blown a fucking gasket over the holiday anyway - maybe that's what ex did and now the child feels it's wrong to go/guilty about missing school/not wanting to leave her mum.

I really truly fail to see why op's family need any sympathy here.

I really truly fail to see why op's family need any sympathy here

I think the OP and her DP are, and always have been, on different pages regarding this issue. Her DP made decisions and took action that she disagreed with.
As the stepparent, the OP had very little influence - she had to sit back and watch it all go wrong. She's cross, upset and frustrated - I think she deserves some sympathy.

Let's be honest, stepmums get lambasted if they suggest that they go on holiday without their stepDCs - yet in this case, the OP would have been right!

And now you're also having a good wallow about the fact that your son loves DSD more than he loves you? And being very happy to push that negative feeling onto her

Bobble your post was quite nasty, it was plain to see OPs comment about her sons feelings for his step sister (loving her more) were a joke.

Regarding the term time holiday not everyone has issues with this OP, I dont. I know you said you disagreed with this to begin with but I agree with prettybrightfireflies and it must be difficult.

laguna I'm not totally anti term time holidays, I've agreed with Dh we'll do it one time for the boys so we can take them to Florida when it's not crazy busy.

I was very anti doing it for dsd because I know her mum doesn't approve and I did feel that Dh just went ahead regardless.

That makes sense Cloudy. I do feel sorry for you and also think you have been on the receiving end of a lot of unwarranted words here. Thats the problem with any mention of Step children on here sometimes.

If I had repeatedly asked a ten year old if they wanted to do something, paid out money and then they decided they didn't want to, you bet I'd be annoyed and would be telling them that the consequence might be expensive trips might not be forthcoming.

Or would people on this trip just happily book school trips abroad and then let their child stay at home if they changed their mind?!

Why is 'anxiety' always a diagnosed medical condition on this website instead of a bit of a nervous feeling that it's our job as parents to try and assuage?

Because I don't see any posts where the OP says the daughter has a diagnosis of anxiety.

I completely agree that the term-time holiday should be irrelevant, but I can assure you as a parent of a child who has just gone through year 6 and SATS that many schools are placing a huge amount of pressure and emphasis on working hard all the time on students. Even a normally not anxious child would feel pressured by it, or at least one of mine did.

It is not the wrongness of the term-time holiday that is up for debate here, it's the experience of being a child in the school system that makes you feel like taking a holiday is doing a very wrong thing indeed, to the point her dad is willing to risk fines. For a goody-goody like me, missing school against the advice of the teachers (who do tell them they have to work hard all the time) and risking getting a fine would have been exceptionally anxiety provoking.