Homework: AIBU to think a 5 year old should not be punished for not doing it?

[TheOriginalMerylStrop]

I have 3 primary aged kids.

I do not agree with young children doing homework for a plethora of reasons, not least that they are at school enough and there is a need for other sorts of learning (like play!) out of school time. My kids all work really hard at school, doing well, and the eldest is Head Boy (massive not stealth boast).

The school is generally understanding of my position and most of the teachers say things like "we only set it because so many parents ask for it" . If they decide they want to do a piece of the homework we find the time and space to support them to do it. If not, we don't do it. So far, no problem.

My youngest in Y1 has been set some moderately uninteresting tasks that range from the meaninglessly easy to the unrealistic without significant parental input. He has no interest in doing it. We went away camping last weekend and had no time in any case.

But last night he was in tears because he had been told he would get a "red card" (and therefore lose his playtime) if he did not bring in this work. I asked him again this morning and he very clearly recounted what was said. I am asking other parents to see if they can confirm or not.

I have kept him off today as he is very pale and tired and has a temperature, but AIBU to think this is totally out of order on the teacher's part? And what should I do about it?

Yanbu. I loathe homework it ruins evenings and holidays and weekends and the kids need a break.

I disagree strongly with homework and there is no evidence it helps.

What homework was it OP?

I think you need to clarify the school policy.

Head says all homework is optional
Teacher gives a 'red card' for not doing it

You need to make sure the policy is aligned.

If it is clear it is optional, I think you are fine to keep your position. When they go to secondary, it won't be optional anymore and you can enforce it.

School isn't the workplace, DisappointedOne. A teacher isn't a child's boss. That's a really negative and confrontational analogy to present to a child.

(This seems really obvious...but it obviously needs to be stated).

Homework is a miserable invention. I believe there are statistics to suggest is a waste of time in primary school

Yes there are, I think research shows primary school homework has no bearing on academic success later on. I'm afraid I don't know any more, can anyone find anything about this?

We had this attitude at our primary school - giving homework 'because parents wanted it'. I wish schools would stop bowing down to what parents want all the time and just make sensible informed choices. There's nothing to stop parents doing extra work with their children, it doesn't need to be set by the school.

My SIL gave me this link. Read it
here if you want to look at it like work/your job

You arrive at work and start meeting your new co-workers, who are just as excited and nervous as you. You notice that some of them seem to be VERY good at nearly everything, and others seem to struggle with even more things than you, but altogether they are a nice enough group and you feel like you will be a good team. You start to make some work friends. It feels good.

Then, at some point – maybe right away, maybe after a few days or weeks or months, your boss sits you ALL down together and explains a new performance management system. On the wall of your communal work area, Boss has posted a list of all the employees, by name. Next to each name is a rainbow of colour-coded cards. Boss explains that every employee will start each day on the same colour, but depending on your performance, your name can be moved up the rainbow, or down the rainbow. People who move up the rainbow will get special extras: a small bonus, or an extra long lunch, or a half-day off. People who move down the rainbow will face consequences: a shorter break, a docked paycheck, a note in their file.

The next day starts out badly before you even get to work. Your alarm doesn’t go off, there’s no hot water left for your shower, you’re out of coffee, your cat has peed on your favourite shoes AND it’s raining. You get to work, and within an hour, your name has been moved down to yellow. You get a warning from your boss. Then, your favourite work friend doesn’t want to work next to you because you just got in trouble and she doesn’t want to get in trouble by association. Your hurt feelings make you distracted, and you make a few careless errors in your tasks. Your name gets moved to orange and now you only get 20 minutes for lunch, which is really upsetting because the sun is finally shining and you had been confident that a nice walk in the fresh air with your buddies would help turn your day around.

On your abbreviated lunch break, you try to get online to order some new shoes. Impatient and frustrated, you curse out loud when the site won’t load properly. In front of everyone, your boss moves your name to red. There goes 50 bucks off your pay. Apparently you won’t be buying new shoes, after all. You approach your boss privately, trying to explain and apologise. Boss tells you, kindly-but-firmly, that “No cussing” is an ironclad rule, and that because everyone heard you cuss, she has to give you the same consequence she would give anyone else. Later, you are short-tempered with a customer, and your name gets moved off the rainbow altogether. A note is placed in your file, documenting a reprimand for inappropriate language in the workplace.

The end of the day approaches. A few of your colleagues get to leave 30 minutes early because their names got moved “up” to blue. This leaves you with extra work that has to be done before you can leave. Among these colleagues, one of them had his name moved up to purple, so he is buying a round of drinks for everyone… Everyone who can leave early, that is. It’s always the same people who can leave early, and really, they’ve become quite clique-y. You convince yourself you wouldn’t really WANT to have drinks with them, anyway. You really fit in better with the red and orange card crowd.

Really homework is bonkers?? I grew up doing homework as I am sure many other children did, it was part of the normal routine as soon as I got it done I could watch telly etc.

We don't know it was a punishment or what the homework was. If it was "you must complete this by Friday as we will be using it in class" then it kind of needs to be done. And not sure why even a 5 year old would HAVE had no say in doing the homework. My 2 were pretty aware at that age of what was expected and were, for example always moaning at me to complete reading diaries.

Cote
"He brought it home, we didn't do it directly as he had something more important he wanted to do involving cardboard boxes and sticky tape. Thereafter he forgot about it."

This is not the same thing as what you initially said, which was: "I honestly don't think he knew he had any until he was told he might lose his playtime"

Not explaining myself especially well. We saw the homework I expect - last Thursday. Didn't do it then. Went away Fri - Sun. He forgot about it completely, as he would, he's very young and lots of stuff happened in between. Neither he nor I thought about it again until he was told children would get a red card for not bringing in homework (which is big deal and something he'd be horrified by, being diligent and well behaved at all times) yesterday. To all intents and purposes he didn't know he had any.

Anyway I have written a brief but polite note in the homework book asking if we can have a quick conversation one day at pick up.

This is a genuine question to all those who ask their children if they want to do the homework. do you think a 5 year old is capable of understanding why it is set and why it needs to be done? do you ask your 5 year old for other opinions like whether or not they want to wear school uniform or do the chores/

I can understand asking older kids this but tbh I think this is the parent imprinting their views and opinions on the child at an early age rather than a childs own genuine view.

can you not see how this is storing up trouble for when they are a teen? sure they don't have to do their homework but if they fail to achieve their potential how are you going to deal with this?

I don't agree with punishments for the under 11 yr olds but I also don't agree in asking a 5 year old their opinion on schooling. do the homework. if you cant because they have been busy doing something else fair enough. but the teacher is the expert here. they set homework for a reason. kids don't wake up one day knowing how to manage their time. they learn it and that starts with a few minutes when young and builds up. really interesting to see now my kids are nearing the end of their school careers what has happened to the ones who were asked at 5 or 6 do you want to do this homework or whose parents thought it wasn't necessary or important. I thought they would grow up as empowered free thinkers. they haven't.

As a mother to two now grown up sons I was always keen to encourage homework when they were very young. It is like everything else in life, if you start with little and often it becomes a habit. Those small amounts of time that were spent, without negotiation on their part, doing tasks ad worksheets that were really quite fun created a very easy life for me once they reach teenage year. They both had loads of homework when they got to grammar school and I never, ever, once had to prompt, nag or ask for it to be done. It made life easier for me, and easier for them as they were never behind or stressed about the amount they had to do.

I see your point and agree with you up to a point, especially about the "red card" - ridiculous at that age.

But I went to an infants' school with no homework, and then it was slowly introduced at junior school (separate schools back then) - I didn't take kindly to it and because it wasn't enforced properly, I didn't learn that it was a required part of learning. This held me back somewhat in senior school, I have to say! I struggled with it the whole time and I do partly think it's because it wasn't instilled in me from the beginning; but also because my parents took no interest in ensuring that I'd done it.

DS1 has had homework from the off, but in his first year (kindy here) it was only 10 mins of reading a night, not enforced, but encouraged with progressive certificates through the year. Since then, it has progressed to work sheets that need completing over a whole week, so not too onerous (he's year 2 now) but occasionally some of it really does need a fair bit of input from me as well and I don't think it should at this stage. Homework should be going over and consolidating what they've learnt in class, not new stuff (which it has been sometimes).

I do make sure he does his homework regularly because I was so bad at it and I don't want that for him, I want it to be habit for him.

A 2006 meta analysis by Cooper, Robinson and Patall of studies on the effectiveness of homework conducted between 1987 and 2003 suggests there is a positive correlation between homework and academic achievement as measured in class tests. Students who were set homework did better than those who were not. This is more marked from ages 7-8, less evident before that.

YABU. The kids finish school early afternoon, they have plenty time to do their homework. It's up to us parents to present them in a positive way, so they don't get allergic to them. I find it terrible when parents are so negative that kids see homework as torture!

So if your boss suddenly started giving you stuff to do at home outside of work you'd be cool with that, would you?
well, I am not a child anymore, so I handle my own workload and have spent many evenings or weekend busy on a project because the work needs to be done. That's what I am paid for!

Your five year may be, redskybynight, but my five year is pretty oblivious. A that age their learning and development still varies massively.

Regardless of the OP's 'position' on homework generally, the U issue is cut and dried, surely?

The school's policy is that homework is optional.

The OP is therefore, clearly, not BU to think that a child shouldn't be punished for not doing it.

OP - the fact that the homework wasn't done on this occasions says as much about your time management skills as anything else. we used to write things on the board so we knew when stuff needed to be done by and was due in. my soon to leave home eldest DC wants to take a board with her to Uni because it works so well as a system.

I assume this is your eldest child?

God this thread is depressing. What a lot of unthinking obedience to rules with no thought at all about the best interests of the child

No primary school homework is not really set for a reason other than some parents ask for homework. Our school was quite clear on that.

And not forcing my young children to do homework meant they continued to have a love of school and learning, so when they needed to do homework as they got older they could understand why and were motivated to do it and do it well.

I think it depends on what the homework is - if it is connected with what they are going to be doing in a lesson - eg bring in a photo of a family member and find out 3 facts about them (they then do a piece of work on this in class) then I think they should be doing it. If it is make a castle out of old drinks bottles then I think that should be optional.

I don't know if I've missed it, what was the homework?

I'd tell him if he doesn't want to do it he swallows the punishment. You may not agree with it but if He doesn't like the consequences then he needs to start doing the homework.

My older kids are really thriving on the no homework routine, all three are very diligent, constantly being told they "give it 100%" etc, getting good marks. Not teens yet, though, granted.

The eldest is studying for superselective grammar entrance (out of borough so no prep at our school) because he wants to give it a go and is motivated by the challenge. We are totally supporting him in that. They love learning, they are always setting up little projects for themselves and I spend time doing that with them.

I think DS will be the same, without killing his interest by forcing too much, too young, on tasks that are set purely, it seems, for the sake of it.

OP - the fact that the homework wasn't done on this occasions says as much about your time management skills as anything else.
No it simply wasn't a priority for any of us.

we used to write things on the board so we knew when stuff needed to be done by and was due in. my soon to leave home eldest DC wants to take a board with her to Uni because it works so well as a system.
No issue with how you manage your time.

I assume this is your eldest child?
No, my youngest. RTFT

What was the homework?

God this thread is depressing. What a lot of unthinking obedience to rules with no thought at all about the best interests of the child

precisely

even teachers don't talk or teach solidly for more than a few mins as guess what, the kids attentions spans and ability to take it all in are that short at 5.

so if teachers realise this why do parents insist on trying to sit teir lids down for longer than the teachers attempt to.

it's not the teachers it's you sodding lot requesting it and those higher up who set the rules.