Homework: AIBU to think a 5 year old should not be punished for not doing it?

[TheOriginalMerylStrop]

I have 3 primary aged kids.

I do not agree with young children doing homework for a plethora of reasons, not least that they are at school enough and there is a need for other sorts of learning (like play!) out of school time. My kids all work really hard at school, doing well, and the eldest is Head Boy (massive not stealth boast).

The school is generally understanding of my position and most of the teachers say things like "we only set it because so many parents ask for it" . If they decide they want to do a piece of the homework we find the time and space to support them to do it. If not, we don't do it. So far, no problem.

My youngest in Y1 has been set some moderately uninteresting tasks that range from the meaninglessly easy to the unrealistic without significant parental input. He has no interest in doing it. We went away camping last weekend and had no time in any case.

But last night he was in tears because he had been told he would get a "red card" (and therefore lose his playtime) if he did not bring in this work. I asked him again this morning and he very clearly recounted what was said. I am asking other parents to see if they can confirm or not.

I have kept him off today as he is very pale and tired and has a temperature, but AIBU to think this is totally out of order on the teacher's part? And what should I do about it?

i'm a fellow homework refuser, so i feel your pain.

I take the view that i ask the kids if they want to do it, if not, then it doesn't get done.

Some of my bias is because my older child has SEN and i am very strict about home time being his de-stress time. We don't get home until 4, i feed them at 5.30 so they get 1.5hrs to play, then they eat, then we start the bedtime wind down for 7pm in bed, its quiet time between 6-7.

They've already spent 7 hours of their day dealing with school, they can fuck off if they think i'm spending what little time we have of an evening doing homework!

They do get it sent home, if the kids want to do it over the weekend, its up to them, but if it gets to the point of they lose interest or get upset, it gets left.

I agree with the op. I've more or less ignored the homework (except for reading, and even that I didn't push too much)
My dc is now of junior school age and is much more receptive to doing the homework, and I am now enforcing it and we do it together. He reads well and is generally much more interested in formal learning than he was, so I think this approach has worked well in his case.
I don't agree with punishing 5 year olds because they're not in control of what they do. Homework should be optional at that age.

Only thing I would say ..is it worth doing it just to save these situations. ..it can't be that much? I agree with you...but maybe focus you energy on debating it with the school.

I really do not agree with punishments for undone homework aged 5. It is essentially punishing the child for the actions of the parent, not every 5 year old will be able to sort it out for themselves or even access a pencil to get it done.

YANBU

At that age he'll learn more through camping and playing than formal homework.

We don't 'have' to make time for things we don't want to do and find pointless. We balance up the long-term consequences of doing/not doing, and make a decision accordingly. As we get older a longer timeframe makes more sense to us - but I doubt 'working hard now will pay off in 20 years time' makes much sense to a 5-year-old.

When I Was Young last millennium we had 10 spellings to learn each week, and some reading. Strangely I seem to have managed to get an education, including a post-graduate degree - done through distance learning while working full time, so lack of homework at an early age doesn't seem to translate into a lifelong lack of self-motivation. Probably the opposite - I enjoy studying most of the time

If I had the choice I would have sent DD to a different school, but all the local ones set homework. Luckily, although they set homework, they don't punish for not doing it in the lower grades. Interestingly DD is now getting quite enthusiastic about doing homework (age 8) - I think before she simply wasn't ready for it to be tacked onto the end of a long day. Even now she is sometimes just too tired to concentrate.

I've given my dc the answers in the past to avoid him getting into trouble.

My position is that our children will not be doing homework whilst at primary school, unless they want to do the work that has been set. They have 6.5 hours a day of lessons. That is sufficient. We do other things together that are useful for their learning. Whilst it is received wisdom that homework is a good thing, IMO young children, most definitely do NOT "need to do homework": there are several studies that indicate it does not support enhanced achievement until much further on in their school career and can indeed be counterproductive.

I accept that they will have to do homework at secondary school. They will be supported to do so. At that stage they will be old enough to understand what is required of them, and to manage their time so that it can be done and done well.

The headteacher says that she does not herself believe that homework is necessary or useful for young children and is happy for my three not to do any. She has assured me that homework is optional at the school. It is the most relaxed and progressive of our local schools, IMO.

My child has not been put in a position of "defying" anybody and is every other way a model student. I have not had a chance to discuss this with his teacher yet, and I am still hoping that something has been lost in translation in some way. I do not agree that a child should be punished in school for something that happens - or not - outside school.

I felt similar feelings to you about homework when my dh came home with some at age 4/5. Then I grew up.

There are positives - you get to spend time understanding what your child is learning at school. You see their strengths and weaknesses and then you can help them. How can that be a bad thing?

Children need to learn discipline from a young age and sitting down in a home environment with their parents or guardians is a positive thing. You should regard it as spending quality time with them doing something that will help them further themselves.

Also, I'm sure every school is different but there is allotted time in my DH class where they sit down and mark their own homework. I'm sure you wouldn't want your child to be the one sitting there with nothing to mark. That may have a negative impact on his self esteem - children need to feel like their are doing well and progressing.

Ultimately, homework at 5 years old is for a maximum of 5 mins. Although those 5 mins often feel hard to find, in the grand scheme of things it can actually be done.

Yanbu, at that age it's not the kids doing the homework, it's me!! I've enough to do without doing their homework too.

Like others I ask if they want to do their homework and if they don't then they don't do it. I'm letting them figure out from an early age that not doing their homework can have consequences

It's a bad thing because it leads to arguments, tension and upset when they're at home. It's a bad thing because it's pointless.

"They have probably accepted your 'position' on homework to avoid you going on at them about it. They will still set it nonetheless. And you may look like one of 'those' parents."

I said I didn't agree with homework and they said fair enough. Have reiterated it with each class teacher at the start of each year - yep all say fair enough. My relationship with the school itself has always been great. It's nice. The kids turn up, on time, work hard, good work ethic, behave commendably, generally actively participate in the community of the school, no holidays in termtime etc and it's all fine. I'm not campaigning for the school to scrap it, or lobbying other parents.

That said I have zero issue with being seen as one of "those" parents, if need be. We just won't be doing homework.

To the poster who said DS wanted to do it and I didn't let him, I honestly don't think he knew he had any until he was told he might lose his playtime. And I don't think any teacher should be threatening 5 year olds with punishment for not doing something supposedly "optional"; and that doesn't happen on her watch, as it were.

YABvvvvvvvvvU. You sound like one of those busy body know it all parents that drives teachers up the wall. You are a parent, not a teacher. It is the teacher who decides whether to set homework or not, it most certainly is not up for you to decide.

If you don't agree with school policy and since you reckon you know more about education than the qualified teacher, then why don't you home school your children?

strop Why have you selected such an academic primary school for your DC?

I'm familiar with many Primaries, and none of them educate 5 year olds for 6.5 hours a day in "class". They play, have breaks, do group activities, maybe PE or a walk...... And usually, the "homework" set is linked to the topic or activity that parents have been introduced to at the beginning of term (and encouraged to further their DCs learning).

It seems unnecessarily confrontational for you to select a school that provides a strict, academic style of teaching to young DCs and then refuse to support your DCs to meet the expectations of the school.

Some parents are also teachers

Oh dear, coconut pie I've pushed your buttons haven't I?

I am seriously considering home ed actually, I think it might suit DS2 better. The two older children love the school - and as I say upthread doing very well indeed. School's policy is that homework is optional, so - technically - it's not up to the individual teacher.

Not really a busybody, or a know it all. But feel strongly about this.

coconut, because how does it benefit the child to make a hat? to draw a picture?

my DS can't even hold a fucking pencil (severe dyspraxia) so how much of his own homework do you think he can do? None, i have to do it because i have to scribe for him!

He cant draw a picture, he can't make a model, and considering he also has Autism and ADHD, he can't go around polling people for opinions. He's also got SPD and is a restricted eater, so no he's not going to bake cookies, taste some foreign fruits or make chocolate crispy cake.

Home work for him is pointless.

South American, it's actually not that academic, though the pupils get good results. I chose it because it is one of the more easy-going, progressive and creative ones in the area. Confidently so. I meant 6.5 hours a day in school apart from playtime, not sitting doing written work. It's more than enough directed learning/activity per day imo. For children 11 and under.

I can see both sides. It is hard with small kids but homework is important as they will need to do it later and the sooner they get used to it the easier it is to be in routine I think.

At my kids school homeworks start in reception with just reading and 1 small task per week like: write numbers 1 - 10, practise counting things at home, bring in a cereal box etc. Year 1 seems to be similar except it is 2 small tasks (1 maths based, 1 english based). Homework increases as school years do but is always 2 tasks (1 maths, 1 english) or 1 bigger project that is often given over 2-3 weeks (eg research X topic and make a model of X). Year 6 homework involves things like write a book review. They also have online maths which seems to take about 15 - 20 mins.

I think this is a good way of doing it as it means the time taken to do homework gradually increases. Year 6 homework though is still only around 1 hour a week max (plus reading). It is still going to be a HUGE shock to kids going to secondary school.

The policy here seems to be encouraged in infants then sanctions in juniors (although yrs 3&4 only sanction small and only if a couple of weeks missing, years 5&6 sanction is "do the work in your break time)

YABU - what you are doing is showing him he can opt out of anything he doesn't fancy or you dont fancy - not a great life skill to have. Life isnt like that, we all occasionally have to do stuff we don't like. I did get parents asking for homework from reception up. It was minor stuff and no-one felt it was OTT . Reception: bit of reading and flashcards, 8-9 : spelling, tables up to x5 & reading.

Though SA I know my first post was a bit confrontational in tone, I was feeling particularly cross. I'm not not at all arsey in person, quite amenable usually.

Whilst it is received wisdom that homework is a good thing

Not according to Hattie. Minimal effect size - particularly in primary schools and when it's not a) directly related to that day's learning in class, b) brief, and c) marked.

"My position is that our children will not be doing homework whilst at primary school, unless they want to do the work that has been set."
"To the poster who said DS wanted to do it and I didn't let him, I honestly don't think he knew he had any until he was told he might lose his playtime. "

How is your DS supposed to see if he wants to do his homework if you don't even show it to him?

I don't know about your DS but it sounds like Home Ed might suit you better.

God, the more I hear about these kinds of traffic light / red card punishments the more I worry about my soon to be 5 year old.
How are these kinds of things supposed to motivate a child.

Homework does benefit a child. Also it's pretty hard to go from absolutely zero homework in primary school to proper sit down homework at secondary school in many different subjects. I didn't do any in primary. Secondary school knocked me for six.

It needs to be a gradual process and that's why doing 5 mins when you are 5 years old seems like a sensible start. Christ, they take longer having a poo some days!

Guys seriously for those complaining about homework, don't you actually want to know what your children struggle with? My dh finds maths really hard and doesn't have the confidence in school to ask for help. Homework is an opportunity for me to spend one on one time with her to build her confidence. It's practise. I can't believe any parent would deny their kid that?

Yabu. Im abit shocked. What about spelling and reading homework? List of spellings on the fridge to learn for a certain time is part of childhood and important skill to learn. What position?