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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To tell DD she doesn't have to do the 11+

197 replies

Reluctantdiary · 14/09/2015 12:27

She is due to take it at the end of this month. We've had a tutor for the last six months for the usual reasons (test format, NVR etc). Tutor says she is fine and has a good chance of getting in.

However...I was just cleaning DD's room and found her diary open under her quilt. And yes I know I shouldn't have looked but I took a quick peek at the page it was open on. She really really REALLY does not want to do the 11+. Lots of stuff about being worried about the test, not passing, letting her dad down (he is the main protagonist behind the test). Also some other stuff about not having any friends there and a horrible bit about not feeling good enough and maybe lying about feeling sick on the day. Then a bit about failing on purpose with a sad face afterwards. She wants to go to the school where her mates are going, which is a good school, not amazing but certainly not a sink school.

So when she gets home i'm going to tell her we are binning the test and she can go to the local school instead. There is no need for her to be worrying and stressing about it at 10 years old when the alternative is fine.

AIBU or am I doing the wrong thing in not telling her to pursue it? I really felt that we had got across to her that it didn't matter either way and that we were proud of her but obviously we haven't.

Also part of me is thinking she left the diary where she knew I would find it?

OP posts:
BertrandRussell · 15/09/2015 13:27

I absolutely agree with giving things a shot and facing your fears and all that sort of thing too. But I'm not sure this includes things which are weighted towards failure. Or telling children that a single day in their lives is "pivotal"- even though they have, in the least competitive systems, at best, a 23% chance of success.

TheCountessofFitzdotterel · 15/09/2015 13:27

Am with Whoregasm on this one. And indeed, Winston Churchill: 'Success consists of going from failure to failure without loss of enthusiasm.'

BertrandRussell · 15/09/2015 13:29

And a system where the badge on your blazer for the next 5 years tells the world whether you have passed or failed........

multivac · 15/09/2015 13:30

Yes, yes, yes - learning from failure is an important lesson. To be honest, I'm considerably more concerned about my kids might have learnt from taking the 11+ and passing. It's quite hard fully to embrace a growth mindset when you are segregated by ability at 11.

multivac · 15/09/2015 13:30

about what my kids might have learnt...

SheGotAllDaMoves · 15/09/2015 13:33

bertrand many things in life worth having are weighted towards failure.

If I had not gone for the things in my life that had less than a 50% success rate, I'd be right back where I was at 16.

TBH the more likelihood of failure, the less sting when you fail; you're joining good company.

And whilst I wouldn't describe an 11 plus as pivotal to life outcomes (very little in life is pivotal. There's usually more than one way to skin a cat), I would consider passing it and going to a selective school as one of the moments when you make life outcomes a little smoother. Thus well worth a punt.

wigglesrock · 15/09/2015 13:35

I'm glad you talked to her about it - poor pet and have come to an agreement that she's happier with. I didn't post previously but I have a daughter the same age who'll be doing transfer tests in November (NI), it's been a difficult decision (for me Blush, not her) about whether or not to take them. I hope it all works out for her.

SheGotAllDaMoves · 15/09/2015 13:37

mullti I can't speak for every selective school, but for the majority of pupils there will, by inevitability of the numbers of bright children in situ, be a school career of challenges.

Challenges that might not be present in a mixed ability setting where you're comfortably at the top.

multivac · 15/09/2015 13:42

Of course there will be challenges for every young person at secondary school, shegotetc. and not all of them academic by any means.

Apologists for the selective system can't really make any positive argument in favour of grammar schools that doesn't equally apply to a good school with a comprehensive intake; the reverse, however, isn't true.

BertrandRussell · 15/09/2015 13:48

"bertrand many things in life worth having are weighted towards failure."

When you're 10?

SheGotAllDaMoves · 15/09/2015 13:58

Some things at 10, yes.

There dancers, gymnasts, swimmers, musicians all trying their hands for things at 10. All stuff where the odds are stacked against them. Tis the nature of the beast.

Providing they realise that there is always a plan B, then it's fine.

WhoreGasm · 15/09/2015 14:12

Many days in a child's life will be pivotal. The 11+ is just one of them. DD is a competitive gymnast. It is her passion. Well before the age of 10 she knew what is felt like to fail and lose (and win sometimes) at something which was central to her life

And not getting to wear a certain badge on your blazer does not mean you have failed at life, or failed as a person, or failed as a friend, or failed as a son or daughter.

multivac · 15/09/2015 14:17

Competitive gymnastics wasn't compulsory for all children to the age of 18, regardless of aptitude or appetite, last time I checked...

titchy · 15/09/2015 14:20

The 11+ isn't compulsory either multivac - hence the OP! The point being made is that some things a child does are more likely to lead to failure than success. But that doesn't necessarily mean the child should avoid those things, and that conversely trying them, and failing may actually be a good thing as it builds up resilience and develops a 'have-a-go' mindset.

multivac · 15/09/2015 14:25

You're missing the point - it's irrelevant talking about gymnastics, or football, or music in the context of the importance of 'having a go' and 'failure being ok' when what is actually being discussed is compulsory education.

I don't want my kids to settle for 'plan B' when it comes to compulsory education. I don't want any kids to settle for something they have been told by their parents, school and society to think of as 'plan B'.

SheGotAllDaMoves · 15/09/2015 14:26

Of course the 11+ isn't compulsory.

Where I live almost no one takes it because the grammar schools are a good way away. A child who gives it a shot knows that it's a. a long shot and b. if unsuccessful, there's no harm done.

SheGotAllDaMoves · 15/09/2015 14:28

Well that's up to you if that's how you'd prefer it multi.

But here in Casa SGADM, we always have plans A-D where possible. And yes sometimes we have to take them. We smart for a short while, lick our wounds and crack on.

WhoreGasm · 15/09/2015 14:29

Neither is the 11+ compulsory around here, either. The majority of girls who sat the 11+ for our grammar got a place.

The majority of parents only put their child in for it if they think they've got a real fighting chance.

multivac · 15/09/2015 14:30

I didn't say the 11+ is compulsory. I said that full-time education is compulsory.

BertrandRussell · 15/09/2015 14:32

All the old justifications trotted out by the "winners".

No, it's not the same as being a gymnast or a dancer. As you know perfectly well. And no, it doesn't make you a failure as person, or a friend etc. Novody is saying it does.

But hey ho. I do realise that in order to support the selective system you have a) to not care very much about any child but your own and b) to believe 3 impossible things before breakfast.

Have fun.

multivac · 15/09/2015 14:35

sigh

Yes, sgadm. We have back up plans, too. We are learning resilience. All that jolly good parenting stuff.

And at the same time - I will continue to express my opposition to segregation within compulsory education and work towards a society where every child has access to a good school, regardless of narrow academic ability, or his/her parents' finances regarding tutoring for the 11+, purchasing an expensive house, or simply paying for what's required.

Part of which is making it clear to my children that the comprehensive they will attend is plan A.

SheGotAllDaMoves · 15/09/2015 14:35

This thread wasn't about the selective system or Kent or anyone's child but the OP's!

Who has decided to go for it, which some of us think is the right thing, because the DD's fears were discussed and resolved.

SheGotAllDaMoves · 15/09/2015 14:36

Fine multi I'm sure the OP will find your views and activism terribly helpful in her situation.

WhoreGasm · 15/09/2015 14:36

Yes, grammar school parents are well known for despising all other children. We all flick v-signs at random children as we pass them in the street.

WhoreGasm · 15/09/2015 14:43

Multivac, children in comprehensives are segregated. Pupils in the top sets rarely share classroom space with lesser ability pupils. Perhaps a token PE session twice a week.

Do you really think the lesser ability pupils aren't perfectly aware that they are no where near as academically able as children in the top sets? Do you think that be merely sharing the same school entranceentrance and school roof lesser ability pupils assume they are as academically successful as the pupils in the top sets?

Comprehensive pupils are also segregated for sport. Most don't make the school teams. Most don't make the school orchestra, or debate team. Many can't afford the school ski trip etc. The list goes on.