AIBU re DS and rent

[Weathergames]

DS nearly 18. Against my wishes he has left college and got a full time job - fine.

I have told him he will have to pay his way as I will lose maintenance from his dad and child benefit. We have agreed a third of his wages. Today I told him he will have to put his mobile in his own name and pay it and yesterday I bought him a load of toiletries and to him that's the last lot I am buying.

Today he has asked to discuss money. His dad had agreed 1/3 was reasonable and has never wanted him living with him in his new wife's home as they have students and have never made DS feel particularly welcome - he does not get in with DSM as there are 1000s of rules and she's v controlling.

DS is now saying his dad has told him if I am going to "over charge" him then his dad has said he can go and live there for £25 a week - if this is true AIBU to be fucking furious?

Its not up to the OP's son to enable his DM to afford her home. She keeps reminding us he is an independent adult...

I also do not see why the father's maintenance contribution should not be halved. In fact his email sounds reasonable - without falling into the trap of hating all men and decrying him as evil. But if it didn't reduce, the OP would be making quite a lot of money out of her son, at a time when he needs to be saving to set up his own future.

Otherwise, she would have £300 maintenance and whatever 1/3 of the son's salary is. You can rent a room with bills included here for £250 a month and certainly for £300. And I wouldn't pay more for a room in a shared house with a family with 2 children - if it was a really nice spacious house in a very desirable area maybe a little more.

I'm honestly a little shocked at some of the things the OP has said, or the way she put them. I think I've probably got the wrong impression as I get that she is seriously concerned about money and that must be horrible.

elke it IS upto the son to pay his way in life though.

if he doesn't want to pay that much, he can find his own place to live.

Elke I think you're missing the point that if the OPs son had stayed at collage her maintenance would not be cut. It's getting cut as he DS is no longer in education and has a job.
OP you son is going through a very usual stage of becoming an adult - wanting all the freedoms without the responsibilities. It's normal. Stick to your guns. But don't be goaded. Anything he says - such as going to his Dad's gets a 'I love you, but that's your choice.'

I'm not missing that point at all Feck. The OP can't expect her son to stay in education so her maintenance doesn't get cut! If he isn't academic, he is far better served by getting a job.

How is he meant to save up to be independent if he has to pay 1/3 of a low salary in rent to his mother? Its going to take a long time.

Its not up to the OP's son to enable his DM to afford her home. She keeps reminding us he is an independent adult...

No, but it is his responsibility to contribute to her affording his home, especially considering he knew that this would be the case when he decided not to continue with college and enter the world of work. If he was at college and she was getting full maintenance - no problem. If he was independent and paying his way - no problem. If he wants the best of both worlds with an adult's independent income but no expenditure on his living arrangements, then that it a problem as it prevents his mother from either moving somewhere cheaper where she wouldn't be able to accommodate him, or renting out his room to someone paying the going rate. He knew the deal when he made his decision - why should he get to unilaterally decide that he wants to alter the terms now?

How is he meant to save up to be independent if he has to pay 1/3 of a low salary in rent to his mother? Its going to take a long time.

Why is he 'meant' to do that? The OP hasn't suggested that she is in any hurry for him to move out, and if he is keen to do so then he will have to go about it the way anyone does: by making savings where he can from the resources available to him whilst ensuring that he has prioritised the costs of living first and foremost.

I still feel envious and a bit sad of people like my flatmate, whose parents not only give them money to support them but time and effort.

I'm sure the OP is envious of people who are able to support their children without needing to ask for a contribution to their keep, but she is not lucky enough to be in that position, which he knew when he decided to leave college and get a job.

^Well, then he can go somewhere cheaper, can't he? I'm sure lots of people would be willing to sub him whilst he spends his money on himself, most of them appear to be on this thread.

YANBU OP What you are propopsing is a very suitable halfway house between childhood and full independence.

First off, he's not saving, he's spending on toys.

Second off, yes saving on a low wage job is difficult. It's not a secret and should have been part of his decision-making process.

he has 2/3 of his salary to save from. he will have to learn to budget.

also think his dad is stirring the pot.

You would not be doing him any favours by letting him live for free. he needs to learn that things cost money. if he spends on one thing, he can not spend on another.

There was me thinking that every parent wants to simply prepare their child for that day they move out and leave home and become a truly independent adult. To me, everything should be working towards that end goal, not based on short term decisions like losing child benefit and reducing maintenance. To be honest, that's going to happen anyway, the OP has had enough years to prepare for it.

Based on my calculations, the son will be paying about £325 per month on his quoted salary, after tax. Despite having just started and having insecure contract hours. Then add £150 from the maintenance, or take it out to cover the meals. So the OP is getting £475 a month, possibly more if she has taken the 1/3 off before tax because the son hasn't yet got his tax code sorted out or doesn't pay tax.

Who in their right mind would pay that per month, even including bills, for a room in a shared house with a family with young children? It doesn't sound as if it would be that easy to prepare your own food or get the privacy to do so, there doesn't even seem to be a shared lounge or the bonus of socialising with people at a similar stage in your life. I'd rather move out, pay slightly more but have privacy and a better experience. But at the age of 18, having just started my first job, I'd be pretty much trapped as I'd find it hard to save for the deposit and first month's rent. I might end up moving into somewhere pretty dodgy with dodgy people because it doesn't require a deposit. I wonder how the OP moved out for the first time and whether she got any help. You would hope your own family might make things slightly easier for you, just to help you out, but also I guess to compensate for the lack of privacy and having your own place. Its hardly equivalent to a house share on the rental market.

Wrt the OP asking for more from the son than she got from the father - presumably the response to that is that parents share the costs of bringing up a child, but an adult has to pay the whole of their own costs.

But if you don't make them face up to the fact that they need to pay their way, they may never move out as it is so much cheaper staying at home and being able to spend all their money on themselves and a good time (toys, clothes, going out, whatever) rather than facing up to adult responsibilities.

OP didn't object to her DS leaving education. But there are implications for HER and HER BUDGETING of her DS doing so. She can no longer afford to cover all the costs of feeding and housing him as much of the support to do so now ends.

The DS is now an adult. So he needs to take responsibility for his own choices. And if he doesn't like the reality of those choices, he is perfectly free to make other choices, to move out to rented room somewhere, or apparently has the potential option, even if not a likeable one, of moving in with his DF rather than his DM who has supported him to date and reared him.

Very helpful contribution from his father there...

And nobody yet seems to have realised that your offer of one third of his wages whatever his hours might well mean he pays less than £25 anyway, since his wage for his contracted hours only leaves him just under £70 a week. If the 37 hours aren't in his contract, he's not guaranteed them. Personally I think it's very decent of you to potentially be willing to feed and house him for very little when money is tight already. That's effectively you being willing to shoulder some of the financial uncertainty that's resulted from his choices. Hardly treating him as some kind of cash cow.

I'm really, really surprised at the people saying 1/3 is alot of rent to pay. Also it's not just for 'a room' is it? I'm sure he is able to use the whole house.

All my friends and everyone I know have always done the 1/3 rule. 1/3 for rent, 1/3 for savings and 1/3 to spend. Its a good way to set you up for life. Op has said she isn't in a rush for him to move out so therefore if he saves for instance 350 - 400 a month then in two years at age 20, when he is a bit more mature, he will have enough for a deposit to buy his own flat.

He is now an adult in a job working and earning not much less than his mother and should be contributing to the household bills as it will help him to do the same when he moves out.

OP didn't object to her DS leaving education. But there are implications for HER and HER BUDGETING of her DS doing so. She can no longer afford to cover all the costs of feeding and housing him as much of the support to do so now ends.

Well of course we would need to know exactly how much the OP pays in rent for her whole house and how much the son earns. All we know is how much the father pays in maintenance. I don't blame the OP for not sharing but I got the impression that the OP was very much aware of how many hours her son worked, what he was paid down to the pence and was not basing the figure on the minimum contract hours.

So I still think my figure of around £475 including maintenance or £325 without is likely to be reasonably accurate. I would say £225 or so would be fairer and still a decent contribution by the son. Maybe the OP has an expensive house, but some social housing can be rented for £600 per month for the whole house in the area. Maybe the OP does not rent or rents privately. But to expect the son to pay what could be half the rent for the OP's house for her own family, including partner and two other children, and then £150 maintenance on top seems quite generous to the OP.

If she charges her current partner likewise say on rent, she could statistically be getting £650 in rent for a house that actually costs less than that.

Where are you getting your figures from?!

The £150 in maintenance is for DD - who is 16 - and is irrelevant (the money not DD) and I own my house.

When I left Uni, got a job and moved back home I paid £180 and I got paid just under £800 per month. I always paid for my own phone, toiletries and clothes etc and I cooked a couple of times each week to help out. If I hadn't gone to uni I would of got a job and would of expected to pay rent.

YANBU
I have 2 teenage girls. I estimate the food bill alone for each of them is about £25. I was paying my Mum £50 a week bed and board almost 30 years ago.

I wouldn't be basing it on proportion of wages but rather a proportion of costs. That way it has a relation to the real cost of living albeit without the true cost of rent / council tax etc. Also in weeks he works extra he will have the reward of more money and when he works less he will have to have saved up. Not sure how your resolve in enforcing a variable rent set on variable wages is going to be.

If your terms don't suit he knows where the door is and it doesn't sound like his DH has actually offered to house him for £25. I would actually be more worried about him deciding not to bother working if he is paying away too much.

Where are you getting your figures from?!

From you OP. I read it as meaning the maintenance was all for your son. So your son's father has stopped paying maintenance for his son because he has a job and you will be taking money off him. Quite right too.

So the son will still be paying around £325 a month for a room in a family house. I honestly wouldn't pay that. I'd pay £200 or a little more but you can get a room fully catered in some university halls of residence for that £300 a month, and that gives you 3 meals a day, shared entertaining and leisure facilities and quite likely en suite.

I think the correct response to that statement is "Ok, off you trot. We agreed £25 a week when you decided to leave school so I will expect your first payment on Monday as agreed if you haven't moved out over the weekend".

He's probably trying it on... I'll bet there is no way his Dad agreed to have him for £25 a month.

I’m still agreeing with Elk here. OP is on c.£20,000 PA, her partner is in the forces and is probably on well in excess of that. Unless there’s issues with debt then I can’t see where attitude of “I need every penny” is coming from; totally different to a low income family. I don’t see how paying £370 (by my calculations anyway; based on 1/3 of 6.99 x 37 after tax) per month could be considered good value for living with your mum and two siblings. At least if he moved out to a house share he’d be getting a bit of peace and not have to answer to his parents. You say, “Oh he can use the whole house”, but I know when I lived at home I didn’t feel comfortable having friends round after 8pm and sort of confined myself to my room anyway. And I knew if I rolled in late after a night out I’d be getting the third degree the next day. It's not the same as living with peers (who you might become friends with) or on your own.

I don’t have a problem with paying keep, I did it myself. But my parents charged me a fair amount which allowed me to do other things like learn how to drive, buy a car (which allowed me to apply for the job I’m in now), save for a deposit and pay for professional exams. It’s bloody expensive being young and trying to do those things which might actually help you long-term. It’s one thing saying, “You need to treat them to be independent”, but if you can’t afford to be independent then you’ll never need to use these skills.

His behaviour is a different matter entirely and I can see why you might think, “well if you’re going to treat this place like a hotel and me like a skivvy then I’m going to charge you commercial rates”. But if that’s the case be honest about it; communicating to him that he’s lost you income from his Dad and that state and he has to make it up is just going to alienate him. In fact I'd let him go on to his Dad's.

Well then elke the son can fuck off out of the home can't he? Why should parents financially support adult offspring working full time?

At what point would you stop financially supporting your offspring?

craic it would matter if the OP was on £350k a year and had five porches and a pony. The son should still pay his own way in life. If he doens't like it, he needs to move out of home and be a man.