Irish abortion laws

[crumpet]

In all the publicity about the gay marriage referendum Aibu to wonder why there hasn't been mention of the abortion laws? Have I missed discussion on this?

Is contraception unavailable in Ireland - or did I dream that?

OF course you dreamt that, we're not in the fucking dark ages. Christ.

gonk, what an ignorant comment.
What Lumpy said, it can fail, pregnancy could be harmful/ lethal to the woman and/or feotus, etc etc.

It is a seperate issue but it pains me that a country who've made a great stride in the right direction can be so backward in other ways.

It may pain you but it would have been more painful the hopes of abortion campaigners if the marriage referendum had been defeated.

Today's result is good news for everyone.

I just started a thread on this very subject- I didn't realise there was one already. I quoted a tweet from Rebecca Watson "Good job on same sex marriage, Ireland. Shame you'd still rather see a woman kill herself than abort a zygote."

I deliberately didn't put my thread in "feminism chat" because I suspect most feminists would agree with me.

Of course most feminists agree, most Irish people agree. Have you ever tried to change a constitution, and bring in new legislation? Its hard fuckign work.

Easy for you to fucking whine about it though.

I'm delighted that it was a yes vote. But the coverage of Irish citizens returning to vote actually really upset me as I can't imagine most of those people also travelling to vote in an abortion referendum. Some of them would no doubt. But would most of those right on liberal dudes travel halfway around the world so women don't continue to die in Ireland? Would they fuck.

All that energy and money that has been channeled into this result - what will happen to it now? Will women now see any of it?

Kitty

Nearly every Irish woman I know agrees Bertrand, this isn't new information to us. But the fact that Irish people are celebrating today's result doesn't mean they don't also dream of a similar victory for abortion rights for Irish women.

So, just to be clear. How long do we have to leave it before before we can mention the "a" word?

It upset you?

You were upset at the sight of young gay Irish people making the trek back to Ireland to vote on this issue?

Petulance doesn't suit you Bertrand.

I'm not one bit religious but would not want abortion available in Ireland to the same extent that it is in the UK.

I think there should be abortion as a necessity if there is something seriously wrong with the baby or in cases of rape -etc.

I don't like either the Yes or the No side when it comes to the abortion debate as they tend to attract two extreme views that can't seem to see any value in the other side's argument.

I think a lot of people are in between the two sides.

A woman having autonomy over her body is an extreme viewpoint?

I'm hiding this as you're making want to punch someone, but please don't pretend you're any kind of wondrous society that is somehow far in advance of the rest of us.
And sitting there criticising those of us who have to work hard for change when you've never done a single thing to change anything makes you just look like a twat.
If you can't support us in our fight, fuck off.

You're the one whose coming across as a right twat.

It certainly seems that gay marriage are the lesser of the 2 evils, so it may have made it easier to discuss. Abortion is an issue that a lot of our politicians feel uncomfortable debating and I guess that it is why there is a lack of discourse about the issue. It could be said that it is a taboo subject to discuss.

It is an issue that women should decide on because it is their wombs that are being used and they have the right to say whether they want that to happen. Unfortunately women in this predicament can only have an abortion if there is a significant risk to the woman's mental or physical health. I think religious beliefs play a big part in the restrictions in access to abortions in this country.

As should be clear from my post Mitzy I'm upset by the contrast. I'm upset that the abortion campaign can't harness the same kind of popular support and energy when the stakes are literally life and death for women.

This thread perfectly illustrates the fact that women are expected to go to the back of the queue every single fucking time when there is any other issue floating around.

They're too separate issues and campaigns.

Celebrating a huge victory doesn't mean the other issue isn't in people's minds or next on the agenda.

But celebrate we should.

Since 2013 abortion is legal in Ireland under certain conditions. Basically if the life of the mother is at risk, including by suicide a termination can be performed.

FFS, MN is depressing at times. I thought it was brilliant that I had MN to inform me that there was a referendum going on in Ireland, because the media has done a an incredibly shit job of it. But then after Ireland has done a brilliant thing, instead of celebration on MN we have posters pissing all over Ireland's chips. It's sad.

You do realise that marriage equality is a women's issue too don't you? Maybe you wouldn't be 'so upset' if you took a moment to think about those men and women who travelled to Ireland yesterday to vote. Few of them would have been old enough to vote in the last abortion referendums of 1992 and 2002. So it isn't fair to assume they don't care.

I was moved by all those who travelled home to vote and find it a bit tiresome that they're being criticised for this. I like to hope that they're part of a new liberal Irish generation who will be equally supportive of a woman's right to bodily autonomy.

mistbecomingrain So if abortion was only legal if a woman was raped, how do you propose that would work? Could the woman present herself at a clinic and say she was raped or would you have to wait for an arrest or conviction, which could take so long that the woman would have given birth by then? If you are pro life then you should have the courage of your convictions and be pro life on all cases...those who say a woman needs to be raped to have an abortion wind me up no end. It is like saying women who fall pregnant through consensual sex don't deserve autonomy and should continue with a pregnancy as punishment. It makes me so angry.

As for Ireland, I am pro gay marriage and think it's great, but the first thing I thought was 'but abortion is still illegal'

My apologies absolute, I misread or misinterpreted what you said.

"It isn't the day for it. Many of us working on this campaign are also working in the abortion one, but could you maybe let us celebrate the amazing win we just got before telling us how we're not doing well enough at everything else?"

Abso-fucking-lutely.

I have been going on demos etc. for reproductive rights for Irish women since 19fucking89, nobody under the age of 65 actually voted for the bloody 8th amendment and we have had no opportunity to actually remove it since then, a lot of women (and men) have been trying to get successive governments to get up off their arses and #RepealThe8th for AGES. Honestly, you'd think from some of the commentary that everyone here is all OH YAY WE HAVE GAY MARRIAGE BUT WE HADN'T EVEN THOUGHT ABOUT THE ABORTION THING BECAUSE WE ARE ALL PRIEST-RIDDEN AND HAVE 18 CHILDREN AND NEED THE FOREIGNERS TO POINT OUT HOW DREADFUL AND HYPOCRITICAL WE ARE.

I was really happy today until I went on here, now between the "the young people only came home to vote because they thought it was all COOL and TRENDY and RIGHT ON and wanted to be ON TWITTER, they don't actually care" on the MarRef thread and this pissing on my chips shite I'm starting to get cranky again.

Luckily I am off to my sister and BIL's who were at the count for pizza and celebrating later. Nobody is going to piss on anything (except perhaps the baby).

A-bloody-men leedy.