OH loves to walk...but worries mums might think he's a paedo

[Dowser]

I can't or don't always want to go with him.

So, he's been on his morning constitutional avoiding schools and parks ( probably crossing over the road if he sees a woman on her own approaching him).

He came in wearing some new shorts. I said they look like baggy shorts, have you lost weight.

No, he said, these are my walking shorts. They look like I'm out for a walk and I'm not a paedo.

I'm sniggering here at his logic. I wouldn't even say it was short wearing weather but I feel quite sad for him.

He's misses not having dogs any more. He had dogs for 30 years , and he felt a dog gave him a legitimate reason to walk and not look like a paedo in the park.

Anyone else got a male walk loving OH and how do they overcome this problem.

I think to be fair OH feels more sensitive about it since Jimmy Savile.

Derek, nobody's said men do this on a regular basis, have they?

It's about statistics, not all men.

Derek - I am very sorry for what happened to you. And I agree that the fear that any man you meet may be a rapist is no way to run a society. But until twats and rapists come with their own handy label, I'm going to go ahead and reserve the right to be as wary as I feel I have to be to ensure my own safety. And if I hurt someone's feelings in the process - I'm sure a really compassionate human being would understand that my need to feel safe takes precedence than his need to be accepted with open arms by every woman he meets.

Look, there was one bloke I remember in Newman Street, W1, at 1:30 in the morning. He was walking a bit faster than me, on my side of the street. There was no-one else around and, just to be extra safe, I crossed over well before he caught me up. From the opposite pavement, he took offence at this. I then had to explain a short version of this thread, taking care not to offend him even more. It felt tricky.

He was in the wrong, Derek. I wasn't.

How's the job?

"I don't see all men as potential attackers as that would mean the men I love in RL would also be on that 'list' just for being a man"

I don't think the men I love are potential attackers- but I quite see why other women might see them that way. Why wouldn't they? And I say to my son, who I love very dearly, that because some men are bastards he has to go the extra mile to show that he isn't. And his dad and his sister and I show him how not to be. It's shit that he has to. But it is the fault of other men, not of women.

"It might be a good idea if men stopped harassing and making women uncomfortable in public on a regular basis, then

Someone did actually "

Ye, it was me. And they do. It's a crock. But they do. Look at #everydaysexism.

Ah, Galrick, thank you, that is exactly what I was thinking!

I disagree with your last remark. I'm delighted to see that more men are standing up against men who're behaving aggressively to women. Currently, it's usually a woman that intervenes if anyone does. Aggressively 'entitled' men are a lot more likely to listen to men than women, so this change is extremely welcome and I hope to see a lot more of it.

And this isn't about "men", it's about patriarchy and what some men take from it. XY chromosomes don't make people more aggressive, but patriarchy tells people with XY it's OK to be aggressive. [namalt]

Pleased to hear you're official!

"Last remark" was about men and change.

Aggressively 'entitled' men are a lot more likely to listen to men than women

Not in my experience; you're more likely to get a punch in the face.
I'm a big scary looking fucker if I've got my grumpy face on. I always cross the road if I think it will make a woman feel more secure, it's something I've always done automatically. If I hear footsteps behind me when I'm walking it's likely to make me feel unsettled, and I'm not particularly vulnerable.

Derek - I don't see anyone calling all men rapists here on this thread. But again, until we can get the tiny minority who are rapists to, I don't know, blow a rape whistle whenever they're around women, I have no way of telling who is just drunk or distracted and who actively wishes me harm (I don't actually check for a penis whenever a stranger comes up behind me on a dark road, so it's not really a question of all men being tarred with the same rush). And I don't think it's too much to ask of anyone to not walk very closely behind me when I'm walking alone or to leap out at me out of nowhere because you have an urgent question at 2 am on a deserted road. Surely it's common courtesy, if nothing else, to not scare the living daylights out of random strangers?
Nothing to do with the OP's partner of course, he's behaving perfectly normally. Except for the shorts. The shorts sound a bit OTT.

It's not blaming men for the actions of others.

It's what Hak said: "I say to my son, who I love very dearly, that because some men are bastards he has to go the extra mile to show that he isn't. ... It's shit that he has to. But it is the fault of other men, not of women."

And, yes, I think the fact that too many men are aggressively 'entitled' is a problem for everyone else - men and women - therefore it's everyone's responsibility to call it out.

Preventing rape doesn't always mean being there when it happens. It includes things like calling out rape jokes, putting down the bloke who makes objectifying remarks, reporting the office creep, and not spouting off at some woman because her crossing the road offended your sense of righteousness.

Nothing to do with the OP's partner of course, he's behaving perfectly normally. Except for the shorts. The shorts sound a bit OTT.

Are women going to make them stop?

Who are the problematic men more likely to listen to, women whom they clearly have no respect for, or other men?

We know their attitude hasn't sprung up in a vacuum and we know we didn't cause it any more than we want to be raped or fondled on crowded trains or groped while we are sitting between a man and the window on the bus or hear a man shouting something about our boobs as we jog. This is something men constructed, a narrative about what being a man entails, and it is up to men to examine it closely, see it for the rubbish that it is, and dismantle it.

Until that happens it behoves us to hold men in suspicion, not just of being potential aggressors but on suspicion of condoning the intimidation and the attitude behind it that women face daily.

On this issue you are either with us or against us. Silence enables the aggression.

If he misses having a dog, has he thought about signing up with Borrow My Doggy?

I know how he feels; I feel like a right old spare part walking by myself, but as a woman, feel more vulnerable than anything.

Calling out a rape joke wouldn't stop a rapist.

Most rapists don't think of themselves as rapists. They think that what they do is normal. (Not all, but most - like Dean in Stenders.)
Best estimate is that 1 in 17 men is a rapist.
In a group of 17 men, nobody knows if one is a rapist.
But, each time a rapey joke gets a laugh or an objectifying remark gets a slap on the back, the one who is a rapist takes it as affirmation.
To the other 16 it's just noise; to him it confirms that all men are like him.

If the others show disapproval, he'll question that assumption.
Which is why this matters.

OK, so a couple of years ago I was walking through an unfamiliar city at night and passed a group of (presumably drunk) men standing at a bus stop and one of them thought it would be fun to jump out at me. So I told him to leave me alone and kept going. He took offence at this and hit me over the head with a bottle. From behind. So I went down. I wasn't afraid of being raped, I was afraid of being killed. I got up and tried to talk him out of hitting me again. With the bottle. At that point, one of his mates stepped in and told him to let me go. That man wasn't necessarily a hero, not in my book. He could have stepped in way before that. But he is probably the reason I am still alive and not seriously injured. So, yes, men can stop this and they should. I'm not asking anyone to rsik life and limb in my defense, but all men can stop being bystanders, they can stop normalising violence, they can stop silently condoning sexism and rape culture. Very few women think that all men are rapists. But studies have shown that rapists do: www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/ss6308a1.htm?s_cid=ss6308a1_e=ss6308a1_e
And it's up to men to prove them wrong.

Bloody hell, Swan. You've just reminded me of quite a few nasty situations when other men stopped a pal of theirs hurting me - not with a bottle to the head, though!

Very few women think that all men are rapists. But rapists do.
Exactly. The other men can demonstrate decent attitudes.

your poor dh does not have yo plan his route to avoid schools and parks, or cross roads because a woman is coming. I am sick and tired of the mumsnet manbashing