To think some children are just horrible?

[Wideeyedcarrrot]

And ds is one of those children.

I don't know what's gone wrong, it must be my fault but I've done my best. He's always been difficult. He wants smiley and cheery like other people's babies and toddlers. He was miserable and did nothing but scream. He never slept. He still doesn't eat very well as certain textures and smells make him sick. He's very demanding of my time. And now all he wants to do is fight. He's very aggressive and unpleasant, he has a superior attitude and always wants to be the best. He's unkind to other children, putting them down and being spiteful. We've been out with a friend today. Her children walked around the farm park enjoying themselves and looking at animals like normal children. Mine wanted to race, to spot the animals 'first' to crow that he'd seen something before them. He can't just be like other children. He doesn't appreciate anything, he's obnoxious and rude.
It ended in him (purposefully although he claims it was an accident) running over a toddler whilst he was on a pedal tractor. I don't think he meant to actually knock the child over but he was chasing after him whilst riding the tractor so it was bound to happen. I just couldn't quite get there in time to stop it even though I was shouting at ds to stop.
I took ds off the tractors, told him off, made him sit out and watch. He wasn't allowed anything from the gift shop (I'd originally said he could spend his pocket money) and there won't be any football tonight or tomorrow.
I can barely even look at him. Why would be behave like that to a little child? No one has ever been mean to him. That's how psychopaths start, by picking on those weaker than them. He constantly has to be pretending to fight, always got a stick in his hand pretending it's a gun. The behaviour disgusts me, I don't want him anywhere near me at the moment although I'm trying not to show it because I'm so annoyed about the tractor incident. I'm trying to calm down.
What has gone so badly wrong? Why is he such hard work? He can't relate to people properly. Well no actually he can. When he chooses to or when he wants something. He's very manipulative.

I wonder if it's because he's an only child but so am I and I never had trouble relating to other children. And I know other people with only children and their dc aren't like ds. He always wants more, he's never satisfied with anything. Never grateful for anything.

Is this something I've done or Aibu to think some children are just more difficult than others? My friend didnt once have to speak to her children about their behaviour. I'm constantly on edge with ds waiting for him to do something he shouldn't. Earlier in the day he'd been 'pushing' my friend's dd on the swing. Except actually he'd been thumping her in the back and trying to push her off and again I had to go and intervene. I just cannot understand why he does it, where is this nasty behaviour coming from?

I agree with Nicki - I have a friend whose DD has relatively HFA, she is lovely at school, puts all her efforts into behaving well and doing well - and is an absolute beast at home to her mum and 3 older brothers, because she's used up all her energies being "good" at school and needs to release all the pent-up frustrations and anxieties when she gets somewhere "safe".

Luckily, she was diagnosed before she started school, otherwise the school might not think she had any problems either.

The OP has had a lot to take in in the few hours this thread has been going on and I think she's doing really well under the circumstances. She has lots to try and find here way around and it will take time for her to go though posts and perhaps read up on whats being said and understand the terminology.

'I find it really sad that people are more prepared to accept that a child is 'just horrible' or has entrenched & serious SEN rather than be prepared to consider that there is scope to think carefully (with a professional, as a starting point) about what's going on in a wider way. Children at 5 have much much scope for change for the better under all circumstances. '

Completely agree with this post. Also agree with Nicki that the OP needs to work as a priority on her negativity towards the child as that is certainly not going to be assisting his situation. I'm not buying in to the 'see where she is a year thing'. She needs to be supported to make immediate change and that support is available to her but she has to see it's needed, and tbh I think a lot of this thread is about the problems she sees in him rather than what she wants to change in herself.

Sometimes things can be so bad that you cant see the wood for the trees and there just isnt a positive thought left in a person. This is maybe where the OP now is and now that people are mentioning things to her it will help the OP find a starting point as to what she can do next.

God op your ds sounds exactly like my friends dd

I have no answers but it's good that you actually notice his behaviour as my friend doesn't

I haven't read whole thread so this has probably been suggested but maybe speak to school and health visitor?

No body has suggested she sees where she is in a year.

I suggested just because she hasn't given us a step by step list of where she'll go from here doesn't mean she isn't taking this on board and making immediate plans for change.

She has said she'll read recommended books - so once she had read them I'm sure she can out that information into practice.

It's very quite common for children to be different at school and home. Some children with asd type behaviours find school easier because it's more formal and structured. It's when the social pressures increase the behaviours tend to show or become more obvious in the school environment.

I do think you are getting twi things mixed up when you say ge was difficult/awkward from birth.

Babies don't fo things to annoy anyone. Sensory issues are not domething a child "does" for attention. My oldest DS screamed and cried a lot due to reflux, then had food texture issues for years, and could never bear scratchy labels or "the wrong socks" and me forcing the issue made him irate, we had massive meltdowns until he was about 7/8. He also had socialsnd emotional issues at school.

For us it really helped to:

• get dad, grannies and other adults to look after him too
• be very very patient (fake it)
• accept the issues such as food textures, scratchy clothes as sensory issues which are much worse for him than for you, help him where you can without showing irritation.
• be realistic in your expectations. Lots of boys like playfighting, pretend shooting, saying "bang! You are dead" without having any psychpath tendencies. It is quite normal
• i found a really fixed routine works, with"not too much fun", sounds awful but at that age my DS could not cope very well with ANY kind if sensory overload, and days out/parties/softplay were HELL. To him and me.

My DS is now 12, and a very nice caring gentle boy. His sensory issues are not as prominent, he is sociable and friendly.

On occasion I feel massive guilt about being so exasperated and negative when he was younger. I wish I had known the real him (lovely boy) a bit sooner, but things were cloudedby the crying snd the screaming and it all being so difficult. Hope this may be of any help to you. Try to focus a bit more on the positives, just a bit.

If he has sensory issues, and everything she's written points that way, a year is a long time to miserable, for both of them.

Have just read the whole thread and I must admit I was feeling a bit like Nicki about the OP's continuing negativity. I was thinking that the OP has had a lot of fantastic, compassionate and constructive advice on this thread and yet doesn't seem to be processing it or addressing the positive steps she can take to improve the situation.

Then I looked at the date of her OP and realised that she only posted this thread yesterday afternoon/evening! I can see now that it's she's got a massive amount of info and suggestions to take in here, amongst a couple of hundred posts, and that the thread is moving very quickly.

OP it sounds like you are totally ground down by this and are locked into a cycle of negativity with your boy. It also sounds to me like a lot of his behaviours could be coming from a deep insecurity about whether you love him/he is 'worthy' of your love - the negativity about himself and his abilities/achievements, the jealousy of you showing attention to other children, the negative attention-seeking.

I recognise a lot of what you describe in my DD, who is 12 and has Asperger's. She was (and still sometimes is) very jealous and disliked me paying attention or compliments to other children. I recently got a bollocking for calling her friends 'darling' and other generic endearments which avoid me having to remember their name because she thinks only she should be my 'darling'. The sensory stuff all rings big bells as well. DD's behaviour on days out was often challenging because she was overstimulated by the noise/sights/scents/social signals/expectations of her. She couldn't recognise when she was getting overstimulated and needed to calm down, so her behaviour wold deteriorate. I too have been locked into negative cycles with DD at some points where my perception of her and her behaviour just spiralled down. Getting her AS diagnosis (and recently mine) has helped enormously in understanding her and why she is how she is.

You've had some brilliant advice on this thread, and I'm not adding anything new here, but I'm asking the following questions because they are what jumped out at me as particularly pertinent points that I wished you'd adress.

When you praise him, do you give a fairly generic 'that's really good' or do you find something specific, like 'that tree you've drawn looks very realistic'?
As a pp said, commenting shows that you are paying attention but isn't as overwhelming as 'great job!' sort of praise.

Why are you going out with other children/families so much if he doesn't seem to enjoy it? He's interacting with other kids at school, maybe he needs time off from that at home?

Are there any situations with other children where his behaviour is better? One-on-one, structured activities, going for a walk etc?

Do you acknowledge that your negative perception of him (whilst totally understandable) is likely to be a self-fulfilling prophecy as he will be picking up on your feelings about him and subconsciously reacting to that?

How does he behave with his dad? With other family members?

Have you tried him in a sports/structured activity club? How is the competetiveness and tantrums at not winning then?

Have you considered a martial arts club for him? Channel the competitiveness and aggression, reassuring rules and structure, learning in a formalised way how to interact with others, often male sensei experienced with this (common) behaviour in kids this age.

Hi Op, I just wanted to tell you that I'be spent the past couple of days trying to support my best friend whose son sounds similar to yours. In addition he has frequent and prolonged meltdowns which are aggressive and frightening to watch. He can be sweet, bright and funny but much of the time he is defiant, terrified of everything, controlling to the point where all family life has begun revolving round him and he says the most horrible things to his parents and sister (who he also punches regularly). My friend and her husband are the most loving, caring, lovely people you can imagine and they are at their wits end. Because he manages at school they have received very little support. I have taught many children with ASD and his behaviour reminds me of theirs.

I'm telling you this so that you realise you are not alone and that it's not you. I only need to spend 24 hours at their house and I feel like a nervous wreck. I don't have any answers, I just wanted you to know you are not alone. It's a hard and upsetting situation for you and your son.

Your descriptions of your boy scream special needs. Please get him referred for proper assessments. Definitely sensory issues (google sensory processing disorder), maybe also oppositional defiance disorder. Many of these things go hand in hand.

BUT there is a lot of help out there. Please don't give up or write him off as horrible. Heis just a little boy and he needs you to fight for him.

Sorry though because his behaviour sounds very challenging and you must feel very worn down.

In my experience some children are just that, horrible - just as some adults are horrible people too. I understand some children have SN but some don't. A 7 year old boy punched my 3 year old daughter at soft play a few weeks ago in the head because she had a red ball and he wanted it. The mother did nothing but told me 'sorry Frank* has ADHD he cant help it'. The same boy then pushed over and kicked a 5 year old and nothing was done. In my opinion some children are just horrible and many are mis diagnosed having SN.

I don't know what to advise apart from you could make an appointment with your doctor to see if he has SN and how you can help him... I'm sorry you are having a tough time OP.

"Many are mis diagnosed as having SN"

What is your evidence for this?

Sierraspider chew on my soggy .

What should the mother have done, Sierraspider? Presumably something that you could witness? Your post is very ignorant and offensive.

I'm just relieved that you were at soft play on that particular day with that particular child in order to provide us all with definitive conclusions regarding the mis diagnosis of SN in many children. Phew!

I still find it unbelievableshocking eventhat so many people here are prepared to accept that a 5 year old (A 5 YEAR OLD!!) is a 'horrible person' and that's that.

I agree still. And just think, they probably don't have any kind of SN to explain their unpleasant attitudes and behaviour.......

I'm finding it shocking that people are content to use SN as an excuse for bad behaviour. Yes it's an explanation for it but the child still needs parenting and running up to someone whose child has been lamped by yours saying 'they can't help it they have SN' is piss poor parenting Imo

Often when children are good as gold at school and difficult at home, it is because they respond really well to the consistent predictable structure of school. Unstructured free time at home can be stressful. Could that be the case here?

Well yes should but I can't see anyone excusing the child's behaviour it is surely obvious that it's poor parenting of a child with SN that is being described? And not that this child was just a horrible child, which is what the previous poster was saying.

Went back to check on this post and wow its turned angry and judgemental. Let's not jump to conclusions or suggest anything not helpful to the OP I think she posted wanting support OP maybe you could make him create a feeling box so you can go through it together so you know exactly what's running through his head?

As an alternative to the special needs/asd suggestions, it might be that he has suffered what would be considered by psychologist as trauma, as the displayed behaviours are similar. I watched a lecture by a psychiatrist not long ago who was saying that he thought many people who had been diagnosed with borderline personality disorder many years ago had been misdiagnosed, also.

The distinction is important because the therapy is completely different.

What makes me wonder about this for you son is because of the crying and unhappiness in the early years - during a period when the brain was developing apace (from 20 percent at birth to 80 percent at age 3) and at a time when he wasn't able to communicate his needs to you. I read somewhere that a child who is suffering pain at this time can go on to display similar behaviours, ie the pain not being dealt and the nonstop crying causing trauma to the child. Something to do with the frontal lobe cortex having been damaged or not having been developed properly - affects the child's judgement, ability to assess danger and fear and emotions, sense of self (and also bonding issues with mother)

The therapy is to do with finding ways to re-connect the neural pathways.

This is all I know about it though - it might be that other posters recognise a bit of what I say and give more info, and sorry if someone else has also posted on this, I haven't read every post.

Children are not horrible : )

I have a friend who had similar difficulties with her son. He was not ASD but was v difficult. She used an amazing play therapist- she was totally focussed on positive praise but really overthetop praise for every tiny 'good' thing the boy did, eg that's amaxing waiting (if he waited a few minutes for dinner), you are doing lovely walking. It sounds OTT but it really works, then he gets tons of good attention for good stuff rather than bad stuff.

Hmm. He's your only child and is yet desperately screaming out for attention. He's getting it - by doing negative stuff.

You need to find every small thing and praise praise praise. Get out of this downward spiral.

How much time do you actually spend with him? Just him? Listening to him? Playing alongside him? Talking to him?

I once taught a child who I thought was delightful. He was also good as gold in school. Quite a loner too actually thinking about it. However, according to his mum, a right little &£ at home. I was honestly quite shocked! When I asked him why he wound his mum up so much, he gave me a sly look (first time I'd ever seen him do that) and said, 'Because I can'. I was honestly horrified, and told him so. Also said, you don't do it here. And he replied, "No, because I wouldn't dare"

We were by no means scary/strict in our class (teacher and TA's) but we had boundaries. However, we obviously spent a lot of time each day building relationships with the children. Just talking to them. Getting to know them. Enjoying them as people in their own right.

I feel for you though. Must be tremendously hard. On the plus side, he does know how to behave, or else he wouldn't be doing it at school. I would definitely be seeking more information from the teacher about his personality and how he is at school.