To think some children are just horrible?

[Wideeyedcarrrot]

And ds is one of those children.

I don't know what's gone wrong, it must be my fault but I've done my best. He's always been difficult. He wants smiley and cheery like other people's babies and toddlers. He was miserable and did nothing but scream. He never slept. He still doesn't eat very well as certain textures and smells make him sick. He's very demanding of my time. And now all he wants to do is fight. He's very aggressive and unpleasant, he has a superior attitude and always wants to be the best. He's unkind to other children, putting them down and being spiteful. We've been out with a friend today. Her children walked around the farm park enjoying themselves and looking at animals like normal children. Mine wanted to race, to spot the animals 'first' to crow that he'd seen something before them. He can't just be like other children. He doesn't appreciate anything, he's obnoxious and rude.
It ended in him (purposefully although he claims it was an accident) running over a toddler whilst he was on a pedal tractor. I don't think he meant to actually knock the child over but he was chasing after him whilst riding the tractor so it was bound to happen. I just couldn't quite get there in time to stop it even though I was shouting at ds to stop.
I took ds off the tractors, told him off, made him sit out and watch. He wasn't allowed anything from the gift shop (I'd originally said he could spend his pocket money) and there won't be any football tonight or tomorrow.
I can barely even look at him. Why would be behave like that to a little child? No one has ever been mean to him. That's how psychopaths start, by picking on those weaker than them. He constantly has to be pretending to fight, always got a stick in his hand pretending it's a gun. The behaviour disgusts me, I don't want him anywhere near me at the moment although I'm trying not to show it because I'm so annoyed about the tractor incident. I'm trying to calm down.
What has gone so badly wrong? Why is he such hard work? He can't relate to people properly. Well no actually he can. When he chooses to or when he wants something. He's very manipulative.

I wonder if it's because he's an only child but so am I and I never had trouble relating to other children. And I know other people with only children and their dc aren't like ds. He always wants more, he's never satisfied with anything. Never grateful for anything.

Is this something I've done or Aibu to think some children are just more difficult than others? My friend didnt once have to speak to her children about their behaviour. I'm constantly on edge with ds waiting for him to do something he shouldn't. Earlier in the day he'd been 'pushing' my friend's dd on the swing. Except actually he'd been thumping her in the back and trying to push her off and again I had to go and intervene. I just cannot understand why he does it, where is this nasty behaviour coming from?

I have worked in CAMHS and I do agree that some children are temperamentally more difficult than others and therefore very hard work.
I wouldn't use the term "horrible" though as there is a danger of getting into a very negative cycle.
There are two possible negative cycles to get into here.

1. An angry cycle-where you begin to think he is just a horrible child and over punish (eg 3 consequences foe one behaviour and not letting it drop).
2. A depressive cycle where you begin to feel you are failing as a parent and give up.

Try for a "coping" cycle where you just think that this is the child you have and it is your job to teach him.
I would advise reading "The Incredible Years" by Caroline Webster Stratton.
Try to find a parenting group based on behaviour management principles and try to get him assessed by CAMHS to outrule any diagnosable condition.

Well done for seeing the difficulty early.
It is not your fault and it isn't his fault.

As others have said this could be a normal developmental stage but it is expressed more strongly in some children because of their personality.
With careful handling it could be turned to his advantage.
Try not to catastrophise that he will turn into a sociopath.
Many kids who turn out okay are like this.

It is very hard work and people with easier kids can be judgmental

Yep, the sleep issue + problem with texture of foods + no friends si ringing bells with me too.

fwiw, dc2 is a delight at school. None of this teachers have ever quite believed me when I said he was herrendous at home (hitting and kicking at the drop if the hat, massibe meltdowns etc...). It's quite a normal things for children to behave in a different way at home and at school.

I would go back to see the tecaher and explain your issues, ask him to be referred to an ed psy if you can or try and find one privately. I really wish I had done that with dc2 when he was that age rather than trying to deal with it all by myself.

Oh one last word. he is still very very young. Don't attach to his behaviors words that we use for adults such as psychopath. You need to try and see him as a child that clearly is deeply unhappy** and needs support.

** for me a child is unhappy when they have to alwys be the first, are ready to push people away to get what they want, always want to be right etc... They are trying to make themselves feel better, to control their environment etc... all of which is a sign that something isn't quite right for them.

I really don't think this child needs 'treating' and nor does he need 'assessment' at this point. He needs cherishing and positive parenting coupled with an acceptance that he is growing and changing all the time. OP - you absolutely have to stop comparing him to other children. He isn't those other children so he won't behave like they do. By comparing him constantly you're running him down - so of course he sees them as a threat. They are in a way.

He has a different type of personality to your friends children.
he is a lively boisterous, competitive,excitement-seeking little boy.You need to find positive ways to channel and cherish that.
Plodding round watching farm animals clearly wasn't his thing!

Xpost with Northernlurker with whom I agree 100%

No - but then what is his thing? There were outdoor play areas and den building and go karts there today too. Not just farm animals. Plenty to amuse him. Loads of space to run off energy. And still we saw the behaviour described in the OP.

I only have to say something innocuous like 'that's a nice coat' to another child and ds will be all 'my coat's not nice, you don't like my coat.'
I honestly say things like the above without thinking! And I'm constantly praising ds as much as I can so it's not like he's short of praise.

He sounds a lot like my DD, except she isn't agressive. She does shout at other children though. She can also be rude, obnoxious, selfish, stubborn, grumpy, tantrumy, whingy etc and often completely ruins days out.

She has aspergers and sensory processing disorder, this wasn't picked up until she was 6.

Now I don't feel cross (well at least i try not too) when she acts up, I have sympathy because I can see that she's struggling and that's why she behaves that way.

I find the stricter I am with her, the worse she behaves. So I have to nice to her when she's been awkward which is a) difficult because my instinct is to tell her off b) makes me look like a slack parent.

My DD is a loner too, she does have a few friends at school but they are incredibly laid back - because everything is on my DD's terms.

My DS1 has some autistic traits.mI doubt he would ever be diagnosed, and his behaviour, in any case has normalised to some extent as he has got older.

What helped me is reading around ASd, and operating on the assumption that he is on the spectrum.

I second the idea of not catastrohising, of trying to find out what is behind this, and accepting.

It is all any of us can do for our children, each of whom is an individual.

I want to add to that good behaviour management programmes have a strong focus on making kids feel valued, building up a good relationship with them and promoting behaviour you do want to see as well as reducing difficult behaviour.

In what situations does he thrive and be happy and active and confident? That's his thing.

I know families with children who find complicated environments overwhelming who have very simple trips indeed to places that aren't overwhelming for them, like a familiar park or a walk in the woods or a quiet cafe. A big set piece farm visit place would be a place to go when there is an adult able to concentrate entirely on that child and on interacting with them and helping them navigate the thing successfully. And of course it's not what the other parents are doing, and it's not effing fair that that's what you have to do, and I promise your reward will come once your child learns to navigate the world successfully (but always in his own way) and oh my goodness then you have the most quirky, rewarding child in the world (somewhere around age 8) and the absolute best friends there could be, because they are the ones who stuck with you through the hard years.

I agree with Northernlurker about not comparing, too.

For me, the idea of assessment is because it may aid with the process pf acceptance. If we understand that children are doing the best they can, and can rely on us to change our behaviour in coping with them, then a diagnosis may help with that. It is not about labelling, it is about being clear sighted about the challenges our children may face

When he comments on your thats a nice coat etc.... what do u say to him?

I agree Yarp. It can help us see where they are having difficulty and clarify what we can do to help.

Sounds so similar to my DSS, OP. I recently read a guest post on Pathological Demand Avoidance (PDA) here on mumsnet - might be worth checking that out too, see if it rings any bells.

I really hope you feel better for getting some of this off your chest OP. It must be so tough for you. I totally agree a CAMHS referral and assessment would be a good thing, you would know then if if there is something specific that they can support with and if not, what other avenues you might explore. Assessment and treatment arent dirty words, seems in a couple of the posts above they are regarded as something negative but when necessary they can change the lives of children and their families. I wonder if you might want to ask about some support for yourself too? It sounds like you're doing an amazing job but I can imagine you must feel exhausted.

Of course he isn't a psychopath. No doctor would diagnose psychopathy in a 5-year-old. Even thinking that about a young child is unhelpful and setting you down a path of catastrophising.

He sounds like a little boy with very low self-esteem. It also sounds as though he has concluded (not consciously, of course) that any attention is good. He is used to negative attention so he seeks that out more than positive attention. It becomes a negative and destructive cycle.

He can't break out of this cycle. He needs you to do that. Love-bombing is a good first step. But most of all, I think you need to change the way you view him. You describe him in almost entirely negative terms. I understand that you are frustrated by his behaviour. But he is absorbing your negativity and it must be confusing and, frankly, devastating for him to know deep down that his mother thinks he is just horrible.

There are some excellent suggestions on this thread and you have lots to think about, OP.

However, I have to say that looking for opportunities to praise him is the one I'd start with. You sound really down on him... if someone was constantly watching me, waiting for me to slip up so they could tell me off, I might play up too.

I also agree with the comment that he has a different personality to your friends' kids - and probably to you, too. (E.g. You sound like you care a lot about being liked and he sounds like he doesn't. - neither is right or wrong, just different).

I found reading 'Nurture by Nature' very helpful. - maybe it might help you too before you ask for assessment for special needs.

It talks about different types of personalities in children

Ds2 was a like this, and still has very difficult times. What worked for us goes against how I like to discipline. For ds1 the naughty step and removal of privileges worked. For Ds2 , this did not work- he would either become completely hysterical or just laugh at me.

So, I tried something completely different.

When he broke a rule, I would do the usual warnings, but when they weren't heeded, I would take him to the naughty step but stay with him, cuddle him, tell him I understood how angry/cross/sad he felt and how ( whatever the issue was) must have made him feel XXXX. I normally hate this touchy feely nonsense, but it works with ds2 ! He calms down and gets to a state when I can actually talk to him about his behaviour. I started this when he was about 4/5 - he is now 7 and we have much less angry/ violent behaviour .

It may be worth a try.

I also worry that his competitive personality might cause him to gamble. I know that sounds mad but he's already obsessed with arcade machines even though he's never played on one. If we see one somewhere he'll go on and on about it.
There are the grabbing machine you can win a stuffed toy on in the local leisure centre and ds goes on and on about them. I let him have a go just to show him it was impossible and when he didn't win he had a massive massive meltdown but now he keeps asking to go back because he wants to 'beat the machine' and if I ask him what he'd like to do he always says 'go to the leisure centre.' At first I was pleased because I thought he wanted to swim but then I realised he doesn't give a damn about the swimming or the soft play there: it's the toy game that he wants to go for.

Read "we have to talk about Kevin" your son will seem like a ray of sunshine

You do need to get out of the negative cycle. Try and focus on his positive attributes. The punishment for what happened seems excessive. I'm sure he's not that bad, he's very young.

Also let him use his energy in other ways, eg running around kicking a ball with you etc

When he gets upset if I compliment another child I ignore it.
I used to try and talk him out of it or reason with him but it's completely futile. Ignore and distract is the only way forwards.

What did u do when he had a melt down? Did u comfort him? Or did u ignore his behaviour?

Hmm. A lot of the behaviour you are describing is entirely typical of my DSs (who are 3 and 5) and their friends.

They are all obsessed with Star Wars; manage to improvise a weapon in any scenario (eg sticks in the garden; pieces of toast bitten into gun shapes etc). My two DSs compete intensively with each other and race endlessly, often cranking each other up as they get more excited and crowing when they are victorious.

It sounds as though you really dislike this behaviour - but it is not abnormal. It is just how your DS and lots of other children are.

I can well imagine that your DS in the throes of a piece of boisterous role play would turn to you for attention to be met by disapproval. And that can't be good for his self esteem

Admittedly there are other characteristics that my DSs don't share with your DS. But I can't help but wonder that if you put aside the mindset that his boisterous behaviour is bad/abnormal; that his interests are indicative of psychopathy other shifts in his behaviour and your perception of it would follow.