To ask how you'd deal with this?

[turquoiseamethyst]

I'm really surprised as DS (8) has been in trouble today. This has never happened before. He was really rude to the TA and then stroppy with his teacher when she reprimanded him. He lost his play as a result and I am completely supportive of this.

DS is normally LOVELY (I know, biased much) but honestly he is the nicest boy as a rule and his teacher did say how out of character it was.

I recently told my husband to leave so it doesn't take a genius to work out it's obviously really upset DS but at the same time I don't want him to think it's acceptable to be rude or unpleasant to people.

Any advice?

Sorry to hear that. Would it help to go in and have a word with his teacher, so that you can share information and try and get some joint sense of how to go forward.

In Mumsnet there is sometimes a divide between the 'tough' bunch, who talk about sanctions and punishments - and the I don't know what to call them bunch who talk about love and affirmation.

He sounds distressed and angry, but without knowing much about who he is and who you are and how family life has been, it is hard to suggest any quick fixes. Perhaps just have faith that your child is still in there somewhere and will emerge again after this period of stress and confusion.

I don't think I'm tough :) but then I must be honest and say I've never had to be. He's always been so lovely and willing and compliant.

But there's a voice in me saying I can't ignore bad behaviour- don't know what the voice thinks I should do though!

If your exDH was the 'tough guy' then you haven't ever NEEDED to be tough, have you?

Talk to the school, and ask them if there is anything you can do to help back up the punishments/lessons they are trying to teach your DS.

If this continues, perhaps consider a carrot bribery system? Something as simple as a packet of stickers or cheap toy or after school snack of HIS choice rather than yours, could help. Particularly if the teachers are willing to involve you.

I haven't anyway with DS ... DH was always too hard on him.

Thanks :)

Too hard in what way? Verbally critical. Punitive? Excessively strict in terms of rules?

Just generally - really hard to give specific examples as DS has always been so good, but he was physical on occasion. Verbally critical, definitely; expected more from the children than their ages allowed for.

Reading your thread OP - it's like your ds has written you a letter saying "Mum. I am extremely upset and distressed by dad leaving and worrying about him and abut you. Please help me." I'd worry less about the telling offs and more about answering the message in that letter.

Thank you; I'm trying pica, but it's really difficult - that's why I posted - as he is insisting he is okay. Clearly he isn't, but I don't know how to break through that wall.

Just generally - really hard to give specific examples as DS has always been so good, but he was physical on occasion. Verbally critical, definitely; expected more from the children than their ages allowed for.
Maybe this is the problem. Your son is now thinking "I was good. I was punished. But I was not good enough. My dad left, so why should I be good. It doesn't matter if I am good - it's never enough so I might as well not bother."

His dad didn't leave per se. His dad was told to go and DS knows this.

There's a book called how to talk so kids will listen and listen so kids will talk- it's really really helpful. Good luck- you will work through this!

I would have thought it was quite scary for a child to know that a father had been 'told to go.' This isn't to say there might be some really good reasons why this was the case. Has you son been given some kind of age-appropriate explanation of the circumstances?

But, in those circumstances, a child - especially if their own behaviour had been criticised in the past - might think that they too, could also be 'told to go' at some point. I would agree that there is lot of testing of boundaries going on.

You don't seem to know quite where your boundaries are. It's clear that you value good manners and behaviour. On the other hand if your husband had done all the enforcement - for want of a better word - you don't seem to have a sense of yourself as somebody who sets boundaries.

So both you and your son are a bit lost right now.

It's not so much I don't know what the boundaries are, it is more that DS has never been deliberately naughty. He'd misunderstood things / been silly but not gone out of his way to be obnoxious, ever.

Marianne you do seem to want to make me feel bad ... Yes, DS has been given age-appropriate explanations.

I think I am just trying to explain why I think your son might feel bad.

I can appreciate it is a hard time for both of you, even though my sense is there is some kind of painful 'backstory' which you may quite understandably not wish to share.

His world has collapsed around him, he's signalling this loud and clear and you're thinking about punishments?
But there's a voice in me saying I can't ignore bad behaviour- don't know what the voice thinks I should do though!
Acknowledge that the bad behaviour is a plea for reassurance and reassure him.

I've said all the way through this thread I am NOT thinking about punishments.

I am seriously considering taking DH back fwiw ... but that would also be wrong. I can't win!

Do you think it could be that he always thought that you loved his dad, and when he was 'told to go' now he thinks anyone from a family can be told to go. Perhaps he is testing you to see how much you love him and will he be told to go? I think he needs reassurance rather than anything else. If it is so out of the ordinary then he obviously is very upset. A punishment from school is appropriate and a talking to from you also, but to keep going over it is probably not helping. Have you heard of love bombing?
Reassure him that his family as it is now, will stay, and you love him whatever and you all need to find a way to go forward as a nice family unit.

In the simplified mind of an 8-year-old did you tell his Dad to go because his Dad was bad/rude?

Has he been seeing much of his Dad since the split? Is he perhaps scared that people can be told to go for being bad and is testing where that line is?

Or simply trying to work out his own personality if Dad was harsh on him and didn't allow him freedom to be himself?

Don't take your DH back if you don't want him back and it will work. You are simply putting off the same issue another year or two years down the line if nothing has changed. Staying together/getting back together for the children doesn't work. It gives all of the same problems and adds a huge feeling of guilt to the child's shoulders when they realise that all of the hassle is "for them".

i doubt it, I obviously haven't explained things very well, I don't even know how to try. But anyway - the children are the only things that matter and if DS wants his father back I want to do that, I really do. But I'm scared too as well.

Social services and my grandparents removed me, and my siblings, from my parents. I wanted my parents back desperately.

I was 7. I didn't know that the emotional, and physical, abuse we were getting wasn't right. I just wanted the safe (ha!) life that I had always know.

I will be FOREVER grateful that the adults around me realised that being a child I simply didn't know what was best for me.

It took a long time and a lot of work, but eventually, when I realised that the home that I lived in was a safe place where I was never going to be bullied or belittled or hurt for making a mistake; and that my Gran shouting at me for playing by the river was because I was in the wrong and she was scared, was amazing. Honestly amazing.

Please, please do not take an abusive, bullying man back into your life because your 8 year old thinks that is what he wants.

He thinks he wants that because his Dad has made him, and possibly you, think that is normal. Your son needs re-educating and stability. He doesn't need a Dad who treated him, and you, so badly that you felt the need to tell him to leave in the first place.

There is no easy route to helping your son through a tough time. Taking his Dad back certainly isn't an easy route.

*always known.

My mum always told me that she went back to my (abusive) dad because I cried for him! I was one year old FFS, I didn't know about the abuse!
You know your ex was abusive. Your DS is sad and confused but it doesn't mean you should get back with your ex.
DS has to retest boundaries; it's hard to know what goes on in children's heads, but don't start worrying more about what others think of your parenting than how your DS is feeling. He will be fine with some hugs. Please don't worry or over analyze him.