To dislike my teenage son

[Apple17]

I will probably be flamed for this but I'm at the end of my tether with him.
My son is 14 and completely unruly, he has no respect for anyone in our family, swears and is violent.
I love him so much but really dislike him, living with him is like living with a ticking bomb waiting for any minute when he's gonna explode into one of his rages.
His anger and violence is mainly aimed at his 10 year old sister, he is absolutely vile to her, calls her a fat bitch, wanker, c**t.. You name it he calls her it, she's a red head and he will also call her things like 'ginger prick'.. He hits her, pushes her, he's given her a fat lip before, she's no angel and I know at times she will probably wind him up as siblings do but he's reactions are extreme and it's got to the point where I don't want to leave them in the same room together, Its got to the point when I pick her up from school we both don't want to go home cos we know he will just be horrible, pick fights and be verbally abusive to us both so we will sit in costa for a couple of hours till DH comes home, I feel so sorry for her she has such a hard time and is always in tears by the way he's treated her or hurt her.
This morning has just pushed me over the edge, I was in the bedroom getting ready after a shower DD said she would feed the dog, 2 minutes later I hear world war 3 going off my DD run in the bedroom screaming holding her side, her brother had punched her and swore at her for apparently feeding the dog wrong! I go and speak with him and I get called a fat wanker and a face full of dog biscuits thrown at me... I just went to my room and broke down, I really have had enough of him. I'm also 5 months pregnant so feeling emotional as it is. I have tried to seek help for him for his anger problems, been to the doctors numerous times begging for help and I just get nowhere, the last doctors appointment resulted in a referral to camms?? (Not sure if that's what's it called) so will see how far we get with them although I'm not holding out much hope! Sorry it's so long I just wanted to explain the best I could.

Yes you don't need to be a professional to see he is picking on those who are weaker than him because he can get away with it.

OP, quite a few pages up you said you regularly go in his room to put his washing away, take him his dinner etc.

I may be being naive here but is this what most people do with teenagers? Take their meals to their room? I can't help but feel that to do this regularly if he's fit and well only serves to alienate him from the rest of the family. Why is he not eating with you at those times? Plus, won't it just confirm in his head that he is boss and master - I mean, his mother is bringing meals to him in his bedroom like some kind of servant.

I can understand parents doing this for their child when they are ill in bed, but as an outsider looking at this situation, I'm quite shocked. It's bad enough that some teenagers spend hours gaming on their own in their rooms without any family communication but meal times as well?

I agree tiggy, totally!

YANBU at all!

From what I've read this is WAY beyond standard household squabbles.
Some kind of professional help is needed - you sound like you're on the verge of loosing all control of him, fast forward a couple of years and he could do his sister some serious harm.
This is a problem for the professionals not a bunch of strangers on an Internet forum!

Sort it out... she deserves to feel safe in her own home.

No.. But I think this is a real situation where the OP has already sought help and said she will involve police next time, not a free for all for people to talk about how she is a disgrace and put all sorts of soapy spin on a situation which, in all honesty, they really know nothing about. It's not just words on a screen for entertainment as far as OP is concerned. OP can continue with CAMHS, call the police or call SS and say she can't go on. These things have been stated but the thread has become a bit OTT in all the pseudoanalysis of what's goimg on. Remember somewhere here there is a real family suffering and words can be like knives. Have some compassion and sense, some of you. It's all been said. I hate to see the sort of frenzy that can happen on threads like this. That ds is the OP's son... The dd is her daughter... It's extraordinarily difficult, and she is pregnant too. My heart goes out to her as she walks this hard, hard path.

I rang the police when my DS was 15 as he had hit myself and his DD hard more than once and we were scared of his temper. I also rang the police because I did not want my DS to hit someone and be jailed for murder. I got the police involved for his sake as well as ours. If he behaved like that on the street he could kill someone or get killed himself.

It was without a doubt the best thing I did. The police attended at our house and explained the potential consequences of his behaviour. They were extremely kind to him and treated him with respect.

He went on to assault a police officer a few months later and then hit someone in the face on another occasion when that person was trying to restrain him to keep him out of trouble. This all happened when he had been drinking vodka but he assaulted myself and DD when he was sober.

He spent two separate nights in a police cell and it affected him massively. Through it all the police were firm with him but extremely supportive. He didn't get charged because the police and the person he hit did not press charges largely because myself and his father attended both times and the police said this made a difference.

That was over 8 months ago and he has not been involved in any violent incidents since. I heard recently that he was out with friends and a lot of fights broke out and he advised his friends to walk away as they would be lifted by the police.

I am too scared to say the problem is over but things are certainly improving. I would do the same tomorrow if he ever hit anyone again. I don't want to see anyone killed and/or in jail for murder accidental or otherwise.

I meant to say that he hit me and his DS not DD!

How old was his DS?

She was 17. She is entitled to be a rude obnoxious teenager in her own home and not run the risk of getting assaulted by a very strong 15 year old boy.

It was getting to the stage where we were afraid of setting him off and to be frank I thought screw that, that is not happening in my home.

Oh no this sounds awful for everyone. Obviously they could be a number if reasons fuelling this behaviour a psychiatric issue, psychological or he could be on the spectrum. I think the first thing that would be useful is to keep a written record of everything that occurs. Write what happened leading up to the incident, what happened after and the consequence of this. Any professional be it a psychiatrist, or psychologist will find this particular information very useful. They might also see a pattern to it. You also need to get help for your daughter. Is there anyway she can go to a loving relatives for some respite?

I don't think some of you are being fair to call him a woman hater. It's his mum and his sister, yes both are women but both are also his family. Of anything he is a family hater. OP hasn't mentioned any other outbursts at female teachers or female classmates etc.

Also he is still a child, one who seems socially very immature. I've never heard of any 14 yr old that NEVER goes out with friends.

Not saying what he is doing is okay, it's quite disgusting, but some of you are talking about the OPs son as though he's an abusing husband.

A 14 year old boy I know never goes out with friends. He stays at home playing games.

OP's son is not a woman hater, he is a teenager who needs to be told that it is not acceptable to hit anyone for any reason.

This type of behaviour is becoming increasingly common. Calling the police worked for me. It was a last resort after lots of engagement with SS, school, doctor, counsellor, encouraging hobbies, community police. You name it I did it within the constraints of a very tight budget.

The only thing that scared him was staying in a cell overnight. By all accounts it was a very long night and he spent the night terrified by noises from the other cells and said that the food was awful. It was a tough lesson but as people told me being in a cell is not supposed to be fun!

Hi Apple, this is a very distressing situation for all of you. Good luck with camhs, what you have posted is similar to the situation we found ourselves in a couple of years ago after struggling with a child with social, emotional and behavioural difficulties associated with the diagnosis we were given. (Definitely not a label).

Our child took us to the very brink of destruction, but in the space of a few short years the future is looking good and our family life is making an excellent recovery.

Feel free to send me a PM.

I haven't read the full thread so I'm sorry if Im repeating anything but I mentioned on a thread yesterday that I was worried my ds2 has Oppositional Defiance Disorder (ODD) di you think this could be something your ds has? I've linked to symptoms...
www.m.webmd.com/a-to-z-guides/oppositional-defiant-disorder

Yes if behaviour is not dealt with professionally he will soon become a man with those issues, they don't just come out of nowhere.

hope you are ok OP.

good luck with the appointment today.

another source of support for you may be to talk to your ante natal hcps about the situation at home - that's another source of funding and support potentially and of safeguarding re: concern for the baby's safety when it comes.

op how are you so sure that things are OK for your boy at school? it seems odd that he sees none of them outside school
also with regard to the violence, how did this thick lip happen
lots of posters are assuming he punched her but o can t see anything that says that
was it a punch or a slap or a push?

Judge op has said he has given dd a fat lip, in her Op. It doesent just happened, he must have struck her to do that.

Sounds like you need to change the rules, OP. At the moment, the rules are he does as he chooses, and you all tiptoe around and it's been going on for years so he hasn't had to learn to control his temper. He obviously has a problem but he currently has no incentive to change. Get CAMHS involved, but also agree a joint set of rules with your DD, DH and school. No access to computer games until his behaviour improves, he may not refuse to attend school with your connivance (you phone truancy officer and ask them to come and get him) and if he physically assaults anyone you call the police and ask them to remove him.

No, you are not being unreasonable to dislike him, if he was mine I'd have lost it and decked him with something heavy by now.
Reclaim control in your home.

Dee I think my DD has ODD (she is being assessed for ADHD) - if she gets told off she fights back -even to her own detriment...
She cannot ever just do as she is asked. eg I told her to bring the crockery downstairs she deliberately left the cutlery upstairs.
I take her phone off her at night (or she stays up all night) she will put off giving it me back - say I've asked her several times and I say right this second - give me your phone - she will start wrapping the earphones round it etc - so she isn't directly doing as she is told...
She has always been like this. (DD2 isn't)
I think what sums it up was when she was about 5 we were going somewhere as a treat for her. She was pulling the bathroom light cord on and off I was trying to get ready - I told her to stop several times and then said 'if you touch that again you are not going on your treat'. She knew I meant it and stopped. She pulled the door slightly to - then I watched in the bathroom mirror as this hand came through the gap and just touched the cord.... (I pretended not to notice - spent a fortune on tickets, one of those threats you wished you hadn't made - reluctant to carry it through - so it gave me a get out -and she had stopped being annoying with the light)
Drives me insane but also amuses me sometimes and I call her on it ...
Anyway what I found really helps, stops everything becoming a conflict is not telling her what to do directly....so in the mornings I don't say 'Get up now' - I say 'You need to be getting up now' - exhausting to get into the habit but I found it really works.

Sorry to put a downer on everyone saying CAMHS will save the day, but in my area, we have found that if CAMHS believe the home environment is contributing to the problem, they will insist the parent engages with some form of therapy before they start any work with the subject of the referral. They may offer family therapy but their budgets have been slashed recently so that is by no means certain.

I work in a school and we had a child much younger than the OP's DS who had displayed violent and destructive behaviour for three years - CAMHS didn't take him on because they believed the problem was down to the parent and suggested she engage with therapy. She didn't, so he was discharged.

OP, please listen to PP who have had positive results from calling the police. Do it now - don't wait until he hurts your DD again before you act.

Gosh suburban, that is scarey, yes part of the problem, probably is within the family, and allowing this behaviour to continue, instead of hiding in coffee shops, and not calling the Police, op and her dh now have to be pro active. What about a referral to a child psychiatrist.

There should be strong consequences for his behaviour, which at the moment, there is very little in the op family.