To give in/not give in re 16

[Paddleslowly]

Ds likes playing games on the xbox and often plays online with others. He is very into minecraft which I don't mind as it's age appropriate for him as he is twelve. He is now sulking that it's not fair because the rest of his friends from school are either playing Call of Duty, Grand theft Auto and Battlefield. And he is left out from the group players online. Most of his minecraft friends are from year 5/6.
He knows that I disagree with the first two games totally inappropriate for his age as they are 18. However I looked into the content on a demo of Battlefield which is a 16 rating. It seems to be soldiers running around a field firing at each other in the army. maybe I should let him grow up a bit more and let him play with his mates on Battlefield! Apparently I've ruined his life!! Think he is entering the Kevin and Perry stage

Err johnquig you seem to have spectacularly missed the point that 3576's ADULT children no longer live at home, what with them being adults and all.

Waitingonasunnyday

Yes there are, higher up the thread there are people saying that they would kick out their adult children if they brought GTA into the house.

titchy

I am an adult. I live at home - due to saving up to move out and being the primary carer for my dad whilst my mum is at work. Does this make me less of an adult? Think before you speak.

There are posters saying that GTA is not allowed in their house. If someone living in my house wants to play GTA more than they want to live in my house, they can go and live elsewhere. That's not 'kicking out adult children'.

You are very young and naive and have an awful lot to learn. I suggest you think, lots and lots and lots, before you speak.

John I never commented on your status as an adult - I merely pointed out that a specific poster stating that she does not allow certain games in her house, is NOT dictating what her adult children can and can't do when those adult children do not live in her house.

Out of interest John do you think it's OK to let a 12 year old watch porn? (And I mean actively allow them to, I do recognise that a large proportion of 12 year olds will try and watch porn surreptitiously without their parents knowledge.)

titchy

It's completely different.

A game is not porn. Nothing as graphic as porn in any game I've ever played...

Oh, and by the way, I never said all 12 year olds should be allowed to play GTA. I said if you think they're mature enough, then fine.

Oh, and OP was on about a 16 year old, who really should be fine with GTA at that age (he can legally have sex, so why stop him from playing a game?!)

The principle is the same. Some things are not suitable for under 18s, however mature they maybe, that's why they have age ratings. GTA and porn are not suitable for 12 year olds.

OP's child is 12.

GTA is vastly more suitable for a 12 year old than porn. You can't even compare the two.

i agree with john i dont think you can compare GTA to porn.

JohnQuig

Well done for spending so many pages arguing and not actually getting the facts right.

The OP's son is 12, the 16 is the rating of the games she was talking about as an alternative suggestion to what he wants (battlefield).

I watch porn and I play GTA, I think you can compare both in the sense that both have content that a 12 year old may vaguely know about (sex, drugs, crime..whatever) but would not know about them in such graphic detail that the games depict. Yes sex in games isn't as graphic, just an example, but other things are.

They don't have to have the same content for it to be agreed that both things are not appropriate for a 12 yr old at any maturity.

So many black and white and immature responses from people who can't seem to see past their own lives.

For everyone asking I think I read JohnQuig is 21 and he lives with his parents. (I'm female, 27, live with my partner if this information is important in any way)

Oh I am not banning my ds from playing GTA. He can play it if that is what he really wants to do. He's 16.

However it will not be played in my house by anyone ever.

In my option it focuses far too much on casual sex and violence against women. And as such I choose not to have it around me. Which, as I am the actual adult, the person that goes to work to pay for the ps4, the electricity, the bloody bedroom that he has the ps4 in, I get to decide.

I also get to decide that my 16 year old son isn't out on the street at 3am like some of his friends. Which is another form of entertainment he may want to enjoy.

I try very hard to bring up all 3 of my children to be respectful but not to accept sexism, racism, any form of discrimination. I have tried and succeeded in teaching them that they should respect themselves and respect the opposite sex. To not feel entitled to sex and not to be pressured into sex.
I don't think playing GTA will turn my DS into a drug dealing, car stealing, prostitute killing gangster.
But it goes against everything I believe. Therefore it isn't coming into my house ever.

i dont think its a case of people not seeing past their own lives. it just means people have different ways.

my son is 12 i let him play 18 rated games. but i would not let him watch porn.

Yes, TheHermitCrab I am 21 and live with my parents. This information was only mentioned because someone asked me.

Yes, I had a brain fart and thought OP's son was 16 in one post!

TantrumsandBalloons

Can't you see how ridiculous you're being? Saying it won't be played by anyone in your house ever is disgusting and shows the contempt you must have for your husband/partner if he was inclined to play it. Don't we have free will anymore?

And - also - I don't know how many times I have to say this... GTA IS NOT JUST ABOUT SEX. You can play the game without ever visiting a hooker or a strip club! But you continue to get your facts wrong whilst clutching your pearls...

I think a huge majority of people on this thread don't have teens/pre teens and have never seen these games!

We gave in to dd age 13 on COD Ghosts after I actually watched it and it is just a shoot 'em up game, no more no less, no swearing, no bloody violence.

Most of her friends had it, we succumbed. Do I care? No because she's a good student, a lovely girl and reads lots of books etc.

GTA not keen on at all but agree that some people are pearl clutching without knowing the facts and just hearing or seeing snippets - I don't really know anything about it but am saying no as it's an 18.

We live in a new world, folks. But as long as we teach our kids the basics of decent behaviour, limit game time and make sure they are doing schoolwork and coversing with real people most the time all will be well!

I will confess to being an occasional pearl-clutcher...

My sons are 19 and 21. I was always careful to vet the content of videos, DVDs etc to ensure that they didn't have access to anything inappropriate for their ages. However, many of their friends were playing 18 rated games at 8 or 9 and some apparently even watched porn at a very young age. I was horrified, especially as my older son was shown porographic content (and was upset by it) at age 10.

However... whilst I think the parents' attitude was reprehensible in allowing young children access to such inappropriate material, the young people themselves seem to be refreshingly unaffected by it. I would say that they were perfectly well able to differentiate between the fantasy world and real life. They're well-adjusted young men - you couldn't tell any difference between those who regularly played violent or sexual games at an early age and my own sons.

So, pearl clutchers... I think you can probably stop worrying and allow other parents to make judgements for their own children even though you don't agree. It will all work out fine in the end

JohnQuig You really are very immature and argumentative.

Nobody is saying you can't choose not to have involvement in certain parts of a game. But a 12 year old child shouldn't really have to chose his own content throughout the game, they will not know what they should/shouldn't be censoring for themselves. And it is not just about the sex. I wouldn't want a 12 yr old of mine getting entertainment out of any of the main 3 characters of GTA, and I wouldn't expect them to understand a lot of what's going on either, and I wouldn't want their questions about certain subjects be based on a game.

I'd rather that my children were older, and well aware of the situations a certain game and film are portraying, before they go and experience them or play them for entertainment.

When you have you're own children you can do what you will with them and let them see whatever content you deem fit.

The OP asked if she was being unreasonable to not let him play certain 18 rated games that his other friends play, but maybe let him play some 16 games where she deems the content ok. She is not being unreasonable, she is sensible and looking into the content of each game individually.

You banging on about what you were allowed to look at and what you would let people look at and what you think of other people's parenting is just ridiculous. Yes your parents let you do what you want in that sense, so did mine, doesn't mean I will follow suite, I actually think my parents were quite naive in what they let me do, so I'll probably be a bit more strict and aware than they were.

"GTA IS NOT JUST ABOUT SEX"

We know. Stop mansplaining the game content to us. Quite a few of us have played these games, or some of them, and we quite capable of looking up the content for ourselves.

Or did you think we're just a load of fuddy duddy mummies who know nothing of the world?

For instance My OH is sat playing saints row next to me right now. It's tame in comparison to GTA but still an 18. Yes in GTA you don't HAVE to go into a strip club, you don't HAVE to do certain things.

(although for instance you could have a mission to have prostitutes and men meet in your car, or whatever, a 12yr old would not think "oh this bit isn't for me I'll skip it")

Either way, I digress. He's just walking down the street on saints row and this pops up (picture) Now if this was GTA, he could go inside.. and it would progress. Now you can't expect a 12 yr old to know not to bother with that part of the game.

And you can't sit there watching them play a game and say "don't go there, don't do that, don't listen to that"

Easier to let them play it when they have full access and the content is all something they can understand and interpret themselves.

SabrinaMulhollandJjones

Agree Sabrina. I've played all the games mentioned, would consider myself a "gamer" and I'm female, and I know I'm not rare breed!

It's daft to think because a parent wants to censor a game it immediately means they don't understand it and are uncool fuddy duddies trying to ruin fun.

My DH plays these games, he's 42 & I have to leave the room as I can't stand them.

The graphics are so gruesome, the woman are treated like scum, well, all the characters are scum. The sound effects are realistic & the general blood & guts are revolting.

I don't understand why he plays them (he's a bit of a nerd, but always loved computer games), he says its downtime from working hard, but he would NEVER allow our kids to play them & is extremely scathing of any parent that allows they underage child to indulge.

Being exposed to this kind of material is de-sensitising, particularly to young, impressionable minds.

I'm a little bemused here. I don't think JohnQuig is phrasing himself particularly well at times, but not sure why posters feel it acceptable to dig at him,insist he is being argumentative, he is immature, needs to think before he speaks and needs to quit mansplaining etc. Isn't the whole point of mumsnet threads to discuss things, often with people who hold a different opinion from you.

It was Target here in Australia that banned GtA5 after customer pressure. Not sure if this got reported, but there were many more people who were not happy with target banning it, than people who agreed with the ban. Part of the problem is that the people who wrote the petition are absolutely clueless about the game, and therefore lose a lot of credibility as they have told outright lies. I understand every parent can't play every game and need to rely on outside help to determine whether they think it's suitable for their child, so I think things like those petitions actually do a disservice. I would have had a lot more respect for them and what they were trying to do if they'd been knowledgable about what they were talking about.
I actually agree with some of JohnQuigs points - you know your child best so you know how mature they and therefore how ready they may be.

Sorry for any rogue exclamation marks, my iPad is inserting them rather than commas. Have tried to ensure as much as possible I edited them out.

DropYourSword we are not talking about banning games, petitions against games or how much people should know about a game.

The question was a 12 yr old wants to play an 18 game such as GTA, she doesn't think it's appropriate but may consider him being able to play a 16 game such as battlefield.

She asked if she is being unreasonable? No she is not.

The reason I think JohnQuig is being immature and argumentative is because he is picking out peoples sentences, exaggerating them, and responding to them with daft situations and comparisons that don't take in the whole picture (i.e him and his younger cousin wasn't arrested so it's clearly not a problem). While also being a 21 year old lad who lives at home with his parents thinking it is OK to outright slate other people's parenting and use of ratings while only having his own childhood as a comparison and seeing that as the only outcome from not following the ratings.

The sensible thing is to judge each game case for case, which the OP is clearly doing and not blanket banning anything.

john thankfully my DH has no desire to play GTA.
But thank you for feeling sorry for him.

It's not controlling to say I don't want sexist violent bullshit in my house

Regarding Target withdrawing the game from sale, I'm just a tiny bit cynical and note that they relented after the release period of both the original and the next-gen remake, after ~90% of the sales were made.

Also agree about the petition seeming to not know much at all about the game. The game is very adult and deliberately controversial so I'm not surprised that it offends people, but come on, at least know what you're railing against.

TheHermitCrab

I'm not mansplaining anything and nor am I immature, argumentative or daft (maybe you're calling me these things because I'm a man and we disagree?) but my point stands - if you know your child can handle it, why should the age rating matter? What makes someone aged 17yrs364days less mature than someone who is exactly 18?

I've never slated anyone's parenting (I wouldn't give my hypothetical child an 18 if he couldn't handle it) just the ones who are outright banning things based on spurious claims and downright lies (e.g. sexism and shagging hookers being integral to the game) and the ones who are banning their husbands and adult children from having certain games in the house because they don't like them.

As Stephen Fry said, "so fucking what if you're offended?" I'm presuming most of the women banning these games are joint owners of their homes with their husbands, so why don't they get a say in what comes into the house?

TantrumsandBalloons

I feel sorry for your husband living in a dictatorship. As said above, I presume he owns the house as well? Is he allowed to ban you from bringing Alfie Boe CDs into the house if he doesn't like them?

Oh and GTA isn't sexist bullshit, either. Please give me examples if you're going to try an argument.