to feel cheated that you can't actually have it all?

[ChocolateOrangeInASantaHat]

Many moons ago I was educated in a fantastically positive school, where as females we were taught that we could achieve anything a male could achieve and that if we worked hard enough and planned well enough, we could 'have it all' in life.

So now, with my collection of letters after my name, respectable job, 2 usually well-behaved children, lovely husband and a multitude of lists to keep life running smoothly, I'm slowly realising that it doesn't matter how hard I work or how meticulously I plan, unless I steal a bloody tardis I still can't have it all.

Feeling particularly bitter as was up all night with poorly child, who I then left with a relative to not miss work today (=feeling like rubbish mother) and then as I'd had no sleep I was not very productive at work (=also feeling like rubbish employee). Since others at my level are generally male and tend to have stay at home wives, this kind of feeling inadequate at both home and work doesn't tend to occur for them.

Honestly feeling like I should advise daughter to either:
a) marry rich man, get good prenup and focus on children/household or
b) be career driven and marry man who is happy to stay at home and focus on children/household.

AIBU to feel cheated that I can't 'have it all'? (NB in case lost in my sleep-deprivedness this is a --partially- tongue-in-cheek AIBU)

The fact is having a career and parenting and doing both well is time consuming and we're only human.They are both choices we choose to have though.You physically can't be in two places at once so you do your best with both.For some that will be putting the career into second gear and coming back to it,for others it be battling on with both.We're all different with what we can cope with,as are our families,kids,careers and relationships.

Dh and I collectively are in the interesting position of having seen benign neglect and it's fall out in action alongside parents giving up a successful career in previous generations. Neither are great to be frank and I know with cast iron assurance you can't have it all,you can only make the best of it.

I'm going to sound really pious now and I know plenty will think I need a virtual slap but having seen that thing on the British doctor in Syria and thinking what other families are coping with around the world not being able to have it all really isn't the worst thing that can happen.

And yes I do think posters like Greengrow make it worse.We can't all be lawyers.On pointing that out I rem once Greengrow et al listing other suitable jobs that would facilitate nannies,private education and joyous having it all family life.It was beyond hysterical and naive.

The fact is we're not crap if we want time with our kids,we're not crap if we're not lawyers or don't hold an Oxbridge degree,we're not crap if we're not top of the career tree,we're not crap if our families find juggling 2 working parents hard,we're not crap if we're in a family where 2 working parents doesn't work out.

There is increasing inference from certain posters that having it all is a given and that you,your parenting or your relationship are somehow lacking if you don't manage to pull it off.Frankly it sucks and just makes you feel even more crap.Feel I can't win.I was the lowest of the low when a sahp,now I'm no better when we struggle with 2 x full time wp at times.

Rant over.

No petit, you're right to feel pissed off.

Green grow presented a quite ridiculous image of harmony, balancing so much, so beautifully, that articles were written about her! Lecturing us about the importance of sleeping well, as though those of us having broken nights with young children are somehow bringing this situation on ourselves.

And then we discover her life wasn't half Waltons half Super career woman. In fact she obviously went through some serious shit, because no divorce doesn't involve at least a bit of a shitty time. And that would have been shitty for her children too. But she chose not to share that add, instead share this overblown image of career success and family harmony. Why? I think to be superior to others. Indeed she even says that is how children felt because they had two working parents. Just unbelievable really.

It was Greengrow herself who mentioned her acrimonious divorce. Either in her current or previous username. She has referenced it herself. The very specific, very unusual aspects of her posts and posting style, make her very very easy to identify, even when username was swapped! As others have pointed out before me.
She has in the past made some very controversial statements about sahms which are at odds with her currently quite mild, girl power persona. So forgive me for finding some of what she posts quite hypocritical and incredible.

Criticising and getting personal, as per the above few posts, does nobody any favours. Says more about the posters than their subject.

'Having it all' is not something I would aspire to or a phrase I would choose to use. But it's still nothing more than a perception or a state of mind. People have different aspirations; what makes one individual happy won't necessarily work for the next person.

We are lucky to live in a place of relative opportunity and choice. I think a good work/life balance is becoming more accessible for both sexes, if that's what people want.

Remember that Greengrow is in the minority here.

My friend's parents were both full time GPs when he was growing up. They were very well off but he always says that the house was a mess/dirty. He doesn't trust them the look after his children as he says that their minds are always on other things. His wife is a SAHM. In their minds they were successful. In his mind they weren't.

I agree entirely fascicle. What matters is for families to live their lives the way which provides fulfilment for each member as far as possible.
And I agree that relative to many parts of the world, and relative to previous generations, there is more choice and opportunity in the UK in 2014. Perhaps it doesn't feel like it if you're struggling to stay in work because of childcare costs, or conversely if you're struggling because you'd rather not work but have sky high bills. But the facts are plain: there is far greater entitlement to time off work for maternity and paternity, far greater protection of your job (eg you can take a whole year off and retain the right to equal pay and status at work) and rights for both parents to have the option of flexible working unless their company can provide business reasons not to allow it. None of these things were available until comparatively recently, and many aren't available in other parts of the world. If a couple want each partner to have a balance of time with babies and work, then the UK in 2014 is not a bad place to be. And if a couple decide that they prefer to take different roles with one WOH and one SAH then that's fine too.

It's not about 'having it all' which is a meaningless phrase. It's about finding what works for you as a family, not as an individual, and not obsessing over what other families might, or might not, do.

But having a Career AND kids is not "having it all", though it is for some.

Having a good relationship with your DC father is another factor , IMO.

People like Greengrow do not, to me, represent "having it all". They have a few things they really cherish, and may not care about other things, bug that does not equate having it all.

We all make compromises, men do too. I don't know a single person who "has it all", there is always a price to pay somewhere.

It's a bit like chasing happiness.

People seem to be ignoring the most important things I've said - that what causes happiness is in the head, the brain chemicals and the like and that those being out of line what tend to mean people feel fed up whether they are male or female. I've said what children want is contented happy parents and that parents tend to do better as parents and workers if they are pragmatists. I have never said everyone should be a lawyer. I have said far too many women pick low paid work and then moan about lack of money - either pick something high paid if you want a lot of money or be content with very little.

Most of all I have been saying be content with what you have - that leads to happiness as well as realising you do control your destiny. We are not Saudi or Yemeni wives who are in effect bought and sold and life happens to us. Instead we have charge of our own ship and if we don't like something we change it or accept it. That tends to lead to a happier life.

Wanting perfection as all the main religions and even atheists will tell you has never been a route to happiness. Indeed greed whether that be being greedy over time one to one with a child a husband lover or over cash makes you sad. Never covet that neighbour's ox.

Some women though do seem to end up as some kind of sacrificial lamb, the Martha in the bible who was put upon and did all the dross cleaning up and they accept that, never change it and moan about it. That is unfortunate and very sexist. Men can wield lavatory brushes as well as women. They have arms.

There endeth my lesson.... feeling pretty good as just got back from bikram yoga on my birthday.

Happy birthday Greengrow
I can't disagree with anything you've written there.... It's not about 'everyone should be a lawyer' any more than its about 'everyone should be a SAHP'... It's about taking control of your own life choices, whether its career, the partner you pick to have children with... And then getting on with it and not moaning!

Errr unfortunately the crap Greengrow has just spouted goes against most she has previously spouted.

The likening sahp to goalless amoebas slumped on a sofa who if they are happy are being selfish towards their hardworking partner is one frequent theme.

Ditto the refusal to except that being a wpx2 is hard for many,not relished and a world away to the island buying world she lives in.Most wp do work bloody hard and get peanuts.Not everybody can earn a decent wage by working hard.Many wp don't like the stress and pressure it puts on their families.They may not be happy but may well be utterly powerless to do anything about it.If they want to moan,all power to them frankly.

Something has and does have to give,as Greengrows experience clearly points out.

That's as maybe but the fact remains she does look hypocritical and foolish lecturing and telling us all how she has it all with a perfect life when actually she doesn't.

Her kids have gone through a divorce and had a nanny for a lot of their childhood.

Both would have devastated my dc.

They may not have been privately educated or have a high flying mum and holidays but they have parents in a secure relationship and a parent at home during their formative years.My career was dented as a result.I don't have it all but I am happy to except that when it is repeatedly rubbed into my and other posters faces by the likes of Greengrow et al.

I am also happy not to have it all,happy with my new career(albeit on a far lower rung) and really don't need lectures from some saying the important role I had was simply cake baking and some time against the sisterhood.

Crime

Happy birthday Greengrow. I agree with what you have said. The ones least likely to have it all are people who second guess themselves. The media makes some parents really neurotic as if everything is damaging to children and some people lap it up and feel guilty and stressed. It's crazy and I doubt it has ever happened at any other time in history.

Sorry but I think she does look incredibly hypocritical as do others.You don't.

Divorce blaming,perleeeease.

I think you can have it 'all', it just depends what your 'all' is. My 'all' means my DH is the main breadwinner (his choice, although he has always earned a lot more then me) and I work around the children and earn a small amount each month for luxuries. I do all childcare and all housework. This works for us, it may not for others, but this is me having it all

I'm with petit on this.

Green grow, I have to say I find your last post one of the most tedious on the thread. You're lawyer, and yet that was the most vague wish washy load of nonsense I have read in a long while.

Men are no more able to 'have it all' than women. We just have to make our choices and then own them, not stamp our feet because we can't get it all our own way.

I do think the posters salivating in glee over another persons divorce sound absolutely vile. One thing we can all have is basic decency.

Hypocrisy Is claiming to gave characteristics one doesn't actually hold.

Greengrow doesn't have it all and wasn't successful at everything as she claimed.

Fact

As she pointed out children living in a non stressful,non shouty environment is key?Divorce involves both(unless we're going to ignore the oodles of research on the matter) and often so does having 2x wp(but we'll gloss over that).

Quite frankly if one chooses to live by the sword one chooses to die by the sword.

Having been told frequently by Greengrow how damaging not having a wm as a role model is I don't think I'll lose any sleep over pointing out a few home truths as regards the picture she likes to paint.