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Original poster

Attempted rape at university (sensitive)

191 replies

CanadianPacific · 03/12/2014 20:31

Due to the very sensitive nature of this post I have name-changed (sorry) but I really need to chat this through. I'm not sure whether AIBU is actually the right place for this either but I am hoping for traffic.

My daughter is in her first year at a London University. She is in uni accommodation with 100's of others (all split between several buildings on same campus).

On her floor there are approx. 18 students with a male/female split.

They all seem like a very friendly and sociable bunch with no real issues until recently.

One of the male students has become more and more aggressive towards the female students and there have been a lot of misogynistic comments etc. A few of the female students have said that they feel very uncomfortable around him and some of the male students have approached him about his behaviour.

Over the past few weeks however, things have escalated. He accompanied one girl back to her room and attempted to rape her. She managed to defend herself and get him off and he left.

Other girls have reported that he would try to escort them back to their rooms and he seemed to pick out those that had been drinking heavily.

When challenged, he became very aggressive.

This has now been reported to the college and they seem to have acted very quickly. All of the students involved were asked to provide written statements (including my DD and several male students who have witnessed some of his behaviour).

He has been spoken to by the staff and tomorrow he will be moved out of this accommodation into a nearby block (on the same campus).

The girl who he attempted to rape has received a lot of support but has been told by the college that if she reports the attempted rape to the police and he is subsequently found 'not guilty' (which is likely as it's her word against his) then she could find herself expelled from the university.

So she has decided not to report it Sad

I'm sure that the college have/are doing all they can but I feel so uneasy about this.

I think it's appalling that she is being threatened with expulsion.

He is now going to be moved into a new accommodation block with female students who no doubt, will be unaware of his reputation.

My DD and the other female students do not feel safe Sad

I'm not really sure what I am asking here, I just feel very uncomfortable with the outcome but genuinely don't know what else the college can do.

Given the number of people who have reported his behaviour, don't they have enough to expel him and deport him back to his home country?

Your calm and reasoned thoughts please x

OP posts:
Original poster
CanadianPacific · 04/12/2014 18:13

Hi AllMims

I agree, I can't believe that this is the official stance of the University. I had originally thought that it had been dealt with by student services but it seems that it has just been handled by the director or manager of the accommodation team.

In which case they seem to have been careful to keep this under wraps?

Next step is definitely student services and my husband and I will be contacting them tomorrow.

Thank you so much everyone for your help x

OP posts:
Wibblypiglikesbananas · 04/12/2014 18:16

The girl who has been attacked needs to go to the police. Bollocks to the idiots who told her not to. Whilst it may be on university property, if a crime has occurred/been attempted, then you go to the police. All this involving the university, who really don't appear equipped to deal with it anyway, has wasted time and possibly meant that evidence has been damaged/lost.

Poor girl - what a hideous thing to happen. Police first and then deal with the university staff's errors later. I hope her family support her when she goes home.

Cherriesandapples · 04/12/2014 18:52

is the OP's reluctance to ring the police any different to those who heard about Jimmy Saville or the abuse of those girls in Rochdale? Sexual predators work on the basis that most victims are too scared / frightened to go to the Police and culturally bystanders are reluctant to get involved. If this was my daughter I would ring the Police but then I have met sex offenders in real life. There is a web of knowledge about the offender that is only broken when one brave victim comes forward or is found dead. The police need to know about this man now not in 2,3,5 or ten years time. You could stop this OP.

RoastitBubblyJocks · 04/12/2014 19:07

Good luck tomorrow OP. Thinking of you all. This absolutely cannot be allowed to happen.

Appalling.

KateeGee · 04/12/2014 21:17

Cherries it is not right or fair for that kind of pressure to be on the OP, and ccomparing it to Jimmy Savile is not helpful, it's a different set of circumstances. She has the trust of the victim and her daughter, who are both adults. While encouraging them to report both the incident and the appalling advice is what she needs to do, it is important to not damage that trust and support them in the road they decide to take.

Op i hope it goes ok

Bluestocking · 04/12/2014 21:21

Good luck tomorrow, Canadian.

CuntCourtIsInSession · 04/12/2014 21:25

"The accomodation team" are definitely NOT "the university" (likely to be even just subcontracters) and the students need to take it further with in the university itself. My university would take this extremely seriously and I can assure you at no point would anyone be encouraged not to report, in fact we would be happy to support a student in dealing with the police if they did not feel comfortable about telling parents, etc. A good starting point would be to take a two pronged approach, with Student Services/Living Support, and with the Head of School so that she is aware of what's happening. Good luck!

KateeGee · 04/12/2014 21:28

This is a university managed hall so the staff will be employed by the university. This is a good thing as it should be easier for someone sensible to hopefully boot them out

alicemalice · 04/12/2014 21:35

If your daughter's friend, isnt ready to talk to the police she can talk to one if the Havens instead. These are police funded centres that can support a victim who isnt ready to report and talk through-any implications of reporting

TheChandler · 04/12/2014 21:37

This should have been reported to the police asap, so they can gather evidence while its at its freshest. It still needs to be reported asap. The police are the ones who should make a decision whether a crime has been committed or not, not a university accommodation team.

Are these advisors in the accommodation team total idiots?

I know that private landlords here are responsible in law for the things their tenants do in the rented accommodation and the immediate vicinity of the university...

CheddarGorgeous · 04/12/2014 21:39

I just hope this is a case of it being very badly handled by a poorly informed/trained warden. They absolutely need to go to the appropriate people in the University. I am willing to bet that warden has not followed any official guidance.

RandomFriend · 04/12/2014 22:39

Whether the friend of OP's daughter goes to the police or not, the university authorities should be hearing about this case sooner rather than later. This young man has probably done similar things before and will certainly do them again if he isn't stopped. With very serious consequences for the lives of the women he harms.

I think the university was identified in an earlier post.

JJXM · 05/12/2014 10:11

I have been in this situation when I was a lecturer. One of my students accused another student of raping her. She insisted that he be removed from her tutor group and he did not to be removed because he claimed that they had had consensual sex. We did move him from her group but we had to be very careful as an institution because the rape was an allegation and not proven. However, we offered support to both the young woman and man. Universities are not the police and cannot act as the police.

On the other hand I have been in this position personally as an undergraduate over the summer holidays when the campus was deserted. I met an international student and we got talking and he kissed me. He then tried to walk me back to my room and I refused as I didn't want him to know where I lived. But he followed me and spent all evening posting notes through my door. I told him to go away. The next morning I woke up and he was stroking my hair and sitting on the bed next to me and the room was covered in gifts. He had somehow got into my flat using a master key. I called campus security and they went and spoke to him and told me not to worry as he was leaving the country the next day.

So I have been on both sides and my advice would be to call the police and contact someone in the student support team.

Wishtoremainunknown · 06/12/2014 17:42

How did it go with the uni OP ?

gita7007 · 07/12/2014 09:20

I havent read all the posts so for apologies for repetition.
But I would say that it might not be true the college have threatened expulsion if she goes to the police - because that would be quite outrageous- something might have been misreported there.

I recommend she DOES go to the police.
I also recommend someone inform the girls in his new accommodation - not a hate campaign but get one of the male peers to have a quiet word with some of the girls so they can look out for each other.

AllOutOfNaiceHam · 07/12/2014 09:55

I've just read the whole thread and am Shock at the way this has been handled by the wardens. This needs to be taken higher up within the university to clarify the university's stance on what would happen if he did come after your DD's friend with a harrassment complaint, and to hopefully reassure her.
He has committed a crime. And the wardens are trying to sweep it under the rug?

weaselwords · 07/12/2014 11:02

I am so sorry that this has happened to your daughter and her friend OP. You must be so upset too.

I am also very, very concerned for the women in the block he is transferring to. Will they know about these assaults, so that they can decide if they want to live in the same block as him?

minklundy · 07/12/2014 18:15

Pretty sure the university is leaving themselves open to all kinds of legal issues. Not least they have a responsibility as an equal opportunities educator to ensure female students are not discriminated against by being made to feel unsafe on campus.

And whilst he could potentially make a complaint of harassment, the university would have to uphold it for her to get expelled. And it seems like they are not very interested in harassmentHmm

DejaVuAllOverAgain · 10/12/2014 15:13

Can't add to the advice given but hope your dd and her friend will be okay.

Mammanat222 · 10/12/2014 15:23

Was wondering if there was any updates?

X

Ohfourfoxache · 10/12/2014 15:36

Jesus wept Sad

This is just horrific. Makes me wonder how the university would have reacted if he had been "successful" in attacking Sad

I don't know what makes me feel sicker - that there are men like that out here, or that there are people who brush things like this under the carpet. Why the fuck was he not identified as high risk if something similar has happened before? Surely the university have a duty of care towards other students and he shouldn't have been placed in mixed accommodation?

I hope your dd, her friend and everyone else unfortunate enough to have been placed with him are ok, op Thanks

Iliveinalighthousewiththeghost · 10/12/2014 16:29

What!!!!!!!!.She'll get expdlled if she reports and he is found not guilty. This needs a public uproar.

Iliveinalighthousewiththeghost · 10/12/2014 16:30

Sorry posted too quick. The university needs to be named and shamed.

RandomFriend · 11/12/2014 00:11

Perhaps mumsnetters should write anonomously to the rector?

Actually I think this needs a concerted campaign to raise awareness. The man in question has clearly done this before in another hall of residence and may well have done it in his own country before coming to the UK. If he is not stopped, he will most likely do it again, and may, on another occasion, succeed.

A campaign within universities would be useful. Some universities run compulsory consent classes. In this case, it sounds as though something more direct is required, but the fact that universities do this sort of class would be a useful starting point for a discussion on what can be done in this case.

AllMimsyWereTheBorogoves · 11/12/2014 08:26

There are several issues here which are being conflated.

  1. Yes, there should be a high profile campaign to educate all young people (not just students) about consent.
  1. Yes, if this man has committed a sexual offence, of course he should be reported to the police, regardless of what is done within the university. He shouldn't be moved to another hall while this is pending.

BUT:

  1. No, the university in this particular case should definitely not be named and shamed. What we have here is third hand. The OP's daughter listened to a member of staff talking in a meeting, reported to her mother what she recalled of what was said and her mother has reported what she recalls of her daughter's account to us. I mean no offence to the OP if I say that we have no idea how accurate the account is. We all know how easy it is for conversations to get mangled when they're reported to others.

We also have no idea what the university has done in the week since the OP last posted.

The time for outrage is if a university simply fails to act appropriately at all in a case like this, not at a very early stage when it looks as if a junior employee has given advice which is (at best) misleading but on the face of it looks just plain wrong - against the university's own policies, probably, and definitely not in accord with the law of the land.