Mother of sons and feminism

[Adnerb95]

Germaine Greer's book The Female Eunuch was life-changing for me when I was at uni many years ago. I still consider myself a feminist, love to see equality of opportunity for women, hate misogyny, think we have a way to go still ... BUT I think some current branches of feminism are seriously messing with young men's heads! Any mention, for example, of a false rape allegation brings down the wrath of any number of online commentators, who immediately label you a rape apologist, as if you are making light of a hateful crime, with no excuse. Apparently, admitting that there are - not often, but occasionally - false allegations is something to be dismissed out of hand and treated as unimportant. A friend's son was recently accused of a rape following consensual sex because she was fearful of the repercussions from her (hitherto secret!) boyfriend. The hell of that family's experience which is now finally over - the police have decided on no further action and actually apologised to the young man - has been indescribable. But it was the online reactions to any mention of such an allegation possibly being untrue, that caused the most damage not just the this young man's thinking but to my sons and their friends as well. I have taught them to respect women, to be caring and thoughtful. Never to objectify women or use them in any way. But they find it difficult to deal with the attitudes which have ben revealed, which see all men as potential rapists, users and so on. Isn't it time for the feminist community to realise that one day they may have sons and they may find that their sons can also be used and abused? That sometimes their sons may have reason to fear the other sex, sad though that may be?

By the way my son was viciously bullied at secondary school to the extent that he had to be removed and has still not recovered a year later. AND it was the girls - not the boys. The boys couldn't be bothered with him. It was the girls who took his phone and his money and his trousers. It was the girls who range me up on his phone while he was crying and taunted me with his crying. It was the girls who set him up "Please Miss cricketsDS has stolen my pencil case/ called me a , " It was the girls who invented humiliating names for him and made sure that he was publicly shamed at every opportunity.

So EQUAL and FAIR treatment and RESPECT for all our kids - not just the girls.

I don't think I'm going to be able to keep up with this discussion, unfortunately!

In cross posting Vivacia, you have proved my point!

Where? How?

"I haven't said that I think what feminists want is detrimental to men.

I'm sorry- I must have misunderstood you. What did you mean when you said - "As both a female and the mother of sons, I can't get on board with feminism at all.

It's too much about promoting women while at the same time as being detrimental to men" ?

Women tend to get custody of children and have more rights over children - however good the father is and however bad the mother is.

Don't be silly. Women tend to do the bulk or childcare and housework (the lucky things!). Family courts maintain the status quo. If men are the primary carers of children before a split they tend to be afterwards to.

Relationship breakdowns hugely disadvantage women financially and in terms of the amount of childcare burden they shoulder. That one definitely isn't a "poor men" issue despite the amount of petulant not-fair foot stamping from some quarters.

So EQUAL and FAIR treatment and RESPECT for all our kids - not just the girls.

It'd be a nice start to ensure that girls had the same access to schooling as boys.

feminist community what is that exactly?

I do not know anyone who would dismiss false accusations as not being important of course they are but it is a different crime one is of serious violent crime one is about lying about a serious violent crime why is comparable because of one word

when a women has reported rape or sexually assaulted we hear the cry of well so many men are innocently accused or her behaviour is scrutinised is it any wonder why so many are getting frustrated. this is nothing new but we are more aware of it

maybe your sons need to do a little research of course they are upset about what their friend has been through but it is a separate issue to what thousands of women go through each year

and as for men all being potential rapists, many believe that all people can be potential murderers too does this bother me no I know myself I am not this person so why would it offend any man is beyond me

isn't liberalism the ideology of liberty and equality for all? Feminism is the advocacy of womens rights

I'm sorry your ds had a tough time. Nothing to do with feminism though.
The reason girls supposedly develop those skills you mention that are rewarded at primary school is because our sexist society oppresses them into being more obedient. That is a direct result of sexism in action everyday. The boys are having a great time doing what the hell they please and the girls are being silenced into sitting still and only speaking when spoken to.
Girls are by no means the winners in this scenario.

I work with a lawyer - we often act for fathers as well as mothers. The assumption that mothers are always disadvantaged is not true. Sometimes they are, sometimes they are not.

I find bringing a boy up in a world where he is automatically considered to be "useless" is depressing. ( Much as it used to be for girls).

We do ourselves no favours if we pre-judge either way

Sorry that was in response to cricket

i can honestly say my daughter has never been taught, by either me, or school to sit down shut up.

Vivacia, where you said this.

Because the overwhelming inequality has been in men's favour for hundreds of years everywhere.

Hak, I didn't mean that feminists are deliberately being detrimental to men, just that it can be an unintentional side effect.

Because feminism focuses on women's rights in relation to men's, it implies that most men out there are on a mission to deny them rights, when I don't think that's the case at all, and why equal rights would be better achieved by promoting equality rather than women's rights.

Thank you TychosNose - it was - and still is hard for my DS. And I agree it is nothing to do with feminism. What I was saying is that the prejudice that it is always the boys who are the bullies and the women who are victims is unhelpful. Look at the people in the situation not their gender.

Tychos, what sort of crazy primary schools have you been in? Your description is nothing like the primary schools I've worked in or sent my children to.

Here

Where do girls not have the same access to schooling as boys in this country?

By the way - my dd has also never been taught to sit down and shut up either. She is strong, bright, verbal, sporty, and doing very well.

she just has different skills - and so did her equally strong girlfriends at primary - while the boys generally didn't.

Vivacia, where you said this. Because the overwhelming inequality has been in men's favour for hundreds of years everywhere.

Don't you agree with that?

That doesn't depict what I am trying to say at all Hak, because it assumes in the first place that women are 'shorter' or somehow more needy than men, and I just don't think that's the case anymore.

It might have been appropriate 100 years ago, but not now.

Vivacia, yes of course I agree that that has happened, but I can't see how it's relevant to today's children or how it's helpful to future society to keep going on about it. All it does is create divide between the sexes instead of promoting equal rights for today's people.

This myth about boys being disadvantaged in the education system is bullshit by the way. Boys still take up more teacher time and physical space in schools, and loads of effort is put in to "engaging" boys, improving boy's writing etc.

Boys achieving better than girls in schools was considered absolutely fine and normal for generations. Girls start to outperform boys and it is a terrible problem.

I there are how many women in the cabinet, also the number who went to renowned boys schools

oh yes we are equal now

What would you see as equal rights?

I'm sorry I have to leave the discussion now but I'm not saying we're all explicitly silencing our daughters/female pupils, but that the society we live in contains lots of subliminal messages about expectations of behaviour, and many of these are oppressive to girls and women.
Well done if you've managed to protect your dds from any of society's sexist messages, I haven't even though I try every day.

I'm the mother of two white, male children growing up in a developed country. They're part of the most privileged group in not just this society but the world. Life is going to be comparatively very, very kind to them - I'm not lying awake at night worrying that they are going to be falsely accused of rape.