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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Holidays and in laws!

180 replies

outofcontrol2014 · 20/10/2014 13:53

My MIL is being very clingy these days. Completely understandable because she lost GFIL at the start of the year, after a long illness. DH and I are trying to be supportive, speaking regularly on the phone, sending gifts, seeing her and FIL as often as we can (they live a 5 hour drive away, which means this has to be for a weekend, which we manage 4-5 times a year).

MIL and FIL have recently started to press extremely hard for a family holiday away. However, while I am comfortable to go for a weekend, I know that I cannot emotionally or practically be there for a whole week.

There are several aspects to this. Firstly, DH has a very responsible job and is often able to take less than 10 days' holiday a year. (Yes, he has a statutory entitlement to more, but feels that he has to be present more often to keep on top of things and look after the people he looks after). If we spent a week with PIL, it would be literally almost all of that time used up. We barely get time to ourselves! Selfishly, I would like us to be able to take a holiday alone.

Secondly, I am quite a private person, but PIL insist that the entire day from 9am to 11pm has to be filled with Activities, and all of those Activities have to be done as a group - meaning that there is literally no time for people to do their own thing. If you opt out, there is sulking! You even have to go together in the same car, which means there can be no escape. For someone as pathetically introverted as me, I find this a real challenge!

Thirdly, PIL are extremely loud and they talk without stopping from one end of the day to the next. If there is no-one in the room, they will talk to themselves. Naturally with so much talking there is very little space for them to listen to anyone else. I have health problems and sometimes I can't do the activities they want to do - and however clearly I try to express this (and I have been quite blunt about it) they simply bulldoze me and go ahead anyway. I find this very difficult to deal with, particularly as it often leads to embarrassment/pain or anxiety about embarrassment/pain on my part!

WIBU to say no to the whole week, but yes to a weekend as part of it? How should I go about dealing with this. I can't emphasize enough that PIL mean well and have had a rough time lately, but are just very used to having their own way.

OP posts:
pluCaChange · 24/10/2014 10:29

Big mistake to ring her, especially when tired. You thought you were pre-empting her and calling attention to your health, exhaustion, etc.; she thought you were initiating contact (you were!) and can't wait to see them!

DaMoves · 24/10/2014 10:31

I'm not going to feel guilty about bitching about my in-laws on here, I'm sure lots of people bitch about their dils on Gransnet,

CruCru · 24/10/2014 10:46

Dude - I actually think you handled that about as well as you could. Was the conclusion on her part (you think) that you would come for a week or for four days?

The trouble with people who only hear what they want to hear is that it's really really hard to get them to hear what you are saying.

CruCru · 24/10/2014 10:48

Now. Your GM is unwell. Why not book a weekend to go and see her? I know that you get very little time but having to see these awful people when my GM is ill would make me extremely resentful.

rumbleinthrjungle · 24/10/2014 10:51

Helping her feel loved and connected through a difficult time - you sound lovely btw - is one problem. Managing her railroading behaviour is a separate problem. You understand why she's doing it but letting her railroad isn't going to end in a nice happy ending for any of you including her as she's driving her family emotionally further away! It's rather like the utterly exhausted toddler sobbing that they really need to stay up another hour.

Maybe if you think of working on the two problems separately it might help? Things like extra cards, photos, short visit dates booked, emails, might help address the real root of problem one but without preventing you addressing problem two and preserving your sanity Brew

outofcontrol2014 · 24/10/2014 11:02

Rumble: That is a really helpful way of thinking of it! Thank you! The crazy thing is that I am SURE that if she were to get her own way, the week would be a disaster. It's not just me, BIL and his partner find them extraordinarily hard to deal with too, though they are less introverted than me and have a longer energy span. No-one would be able to cope, which (as BIL said) would be counterproductive.

Pluscachange: Unfortunately, the hospital visit was an appointment - she knew I was going and was ringing to ring out how I got on! I couldn't really duck out of speaking. My health problem is something ongoing and longstanding and to give her full credit, she has tried to be really supportive!

Crucru: You're right, it is leading to some resentment. I do have a weekend booked in, though. The conversation was left very much as it started. Impasse!

Dropdead: I thought of that! Apparently they used to go to see GFIL on FIL's side for a 5-6 days when he was a widower (which I think does change things a lot). When they were there, they would do their own thing as a family. DMIL's father they wouldn't see as much - I think there was always tension between him and FIL. I find it really, really odd that that they can't translate what they did as a family when younger to us and see that we might also need some space, but there you go!

OP posts:
girlywhirly · 24/10/2014 11:04

I think you need to be as blunt back to MIL as she is to you. Say that you can do 3-4 days, or none at all if she keeps forcing the issue of a week.

You do not need to justify or explain. Don't try to placate by offering more week-end stays to make up for the short stay. I stand by my recommendation that if you do holiday alone, you don't say where or when you are going.

I am wondering if they have any friends? Or have they fallen out with lots of them as you say they bully everyone? I can't see friends wanting to have much to do with them if that's the case, and if they have very few as well as losing GFIL it might explain why they are clinging so desperately to family and go over the top with activities when you visit.

CruCru · 24/10/2014 11:07

I think you may need to change your mindset before anything else happens. You will go for four days but no longer. If it MUST be for a week then you won't be there.

You need to believe this, not worry that you will be railroaded into something else.

Once you and DH believe this, it won't matter how much she repeats herself. Saying something more often and more loudly does not make it true.

outofcontrol2014 · 24/10/2014 11:16

Spot on, girly - they don't have many friends. I think it is because people find them overbearing and they lack the ability to listen to anyone else. People just recoil from them. Instead they do a lot of activities that you can't be turned away from (!) like various talks, visiting of stately homes, wine tastings etc. etc. etc. Grin

MIL is very obsessed with family right now. DH and I are off to the States for work soon (conference) and she was insisting last night that we cancel our return flights, stay longer, and spend my birthday going to a funeral in Canada of some very distant relation with some branch of the family who we have never met or had any contact with!! Even point-blank stating that we didn't want to and couldn't afford to change the flights at the last minute wasn't enough to make her stop!

OP posts:
outofcontrol2014 · 24/10/2014 11:18

Crucru - you are right, and very perceptive too if I may say so. The anxiety for me is that I can see DH buckling under the guilt they place on him. This morning he was talking about ways to do the week and make it 'lower intensity'. I think my look of absolute horror stopped him in his tracks. I explained that we have been here before and they simply will not allow us to do our own thing, and he relented.

They have bullied him his entire life and he can't stand up to them!! (And yes, I realise this is a DH-issue and not a PIL issue! But because of the counselling, breakdown etc. I am not sure how to handle it supportively)

OP posts:
Dropdeadfred2 · 24/10/2014 11:24

could they have a week where you and dh stay 3/4 days then bil and his wife stay the other 3/4 with a day overlapping where you are all there and can something together??

girlywhirly · 24/10/2014 11:36

Well if there was a chance of changing the flight with no loss of money, in your shoes I'd be spending a few days somewhere else, in secret, but not at the funeral of someone I didn't know!

MIL may be trying to be supportive of your chronic condition, but not so much that she won't give you the opportunity to rest when you say you're tired, or aren't up to doing what they've planned.

CruCru · 24/10/2014 11:40

Instead of concentrating on your inlaws and how to placate them and get out of a week, why not look into what you would like to do for a week? Where would you like to go, when, what would you like to do? Then book it. You can't do this week with them, you're already going for a week in Rome (say).

There seems a lot of focus on pleasing others and not on pleasing yourselves.

It is sad that your GFIL has died. But not too shocking, given that your MIL is in her 60s. I will be amazed if either of my parents survive until I am in my 60s.

pluCaChange · 24/10/2014 11:55

I'm sorry. I thought you had rung her. Apologies: you're not daft, as I seemed to imply! Smile

girlywhirly · 24/10/2014 12:03

Yes, as Cru says, put the PILS out of the picture for the moment and look at holidays for yourselves alone. Their lack of friends and interests isn't your problem to solve. If DH could view his holiday as his right, to have the way he wants with you, and not as his duty to his parents he would be a lot less stressed.

It really is not up to him to make everything all right for them at the expense of his health.

loopylou9 · 24/10/2014 12:07

There's nothing worse than being pushed in to something you don't want to do.
So don't do it! What about going away over Easter? I'm assuming you and DH will have the bank holidays off?
If you go you need to have separate accommodation so you can go and escape if you need to.
I'm really close to my Mum and DH gets on with her, she gives us space as a couple and a family and helps out with the kids etc, we went away for a week with her but I couldn't have done it if she wasn't so easy going and respectful of us as a couple and a family.

MIL has told DH that she's taking us and all the kids to Florida next year! As generous as this would be and I know she means well, I would prefer to be asked if I would like to go not just being told how I'm using my holiday entitlement. And there's no way on this Earth I am spending my valuable family time being told what I'm doing, where I'm going etc. I'd rather spend two weeks in a tent in England with my DH and DC than in a villa in Florida with PIL because I know they would drive me crazy and IMO being driven crazy is not my idea of a holiday!

outofcontrol2014 · 24/10/2014 12:18

girly/cru: Oh, I could dream for hours about the holiday time I'd like to have. It's almost as fun as actually going!! :) Don't worry - I have my eye on a couple of breaks. ;)

lou - oh no! Did your MIL just announce it to you like that?! You have my sympathies- it sounds really similar. The thing I find difficult is that there is an assumption here on their own part that the parents are the easiest people in the world to get one with, which kind of lacks any sort of self-awareness. I can't imagine ever thinking that someone would definitely want to spend a week with me to the point that I wouldn't ask them how they felt about it first! And if they said 'Oh gosh, it would be lovely to see you for a weekend but I can't do a week', I don't think I'd feel hurt - I'd be pleased to get the weekend!

I know that it's meant really, really well, but there is something a little bit weird about it. But I suspect this may be a long-standing quality in the older generation!! I am reading Nicholas Nickleby at the moment, and Mrs Nickleby has it in spades. This is the bit where she and her daughter Kate are nursing Madeline, who is unwell:

'My dear,' Mrs. Nickleby would say, coming into the room with an elaborate caution, calculated to discompose the nerves of an invalid rather more than the entry of a horse-soldier at full gallop; 'how do you find yourself tonight? I hope you are better.'

'Almost well, mama,' Kate would reply, laying down her work, and taking Madeline's hand in hers.

'Kate!' Mrs. Nickleby would say, reprovingly, 'don't talk so loud' (the worthy lady herself talking in a whisper that would have made the blood of the stoutest man run cold in his veins).

Kate would take this reproof very quietly, and Mrs. Nickleby, making every board creak and every thread rustle as she moved stealthily about, would add: 'My son Nicholas has just come home, and I have come, according to custom, my dear, to know, from your own lips, exactly how you are; for he won't take my account, and never will.'

'He is later than usual to-night,' perhaps Madeline would reply. 'Nearly half an hour.'

'Well, I never saw such people in all my life as you are, for time, up here!' Mrs. Nickleby would exclaim in great astonishment; 'I declare I never did! I had not the least idea that Nicholas was after his time, not the smallest. Mr. Nickleby used to say—your poor papa, I am speaking of, Kate my dear—used to say, that appetite was the best clock in the world, but you have no appetite, my dear Miss Bray, I wish you had, and upon my word I really think you ought to take something that would give you one. I am sure I don't know, but I have heard that two or three dozen native lobsters give an appetite, though that comes to the same thing after all, for I suppose you must have an appetite before you can take 'em. If I said lobsters, I meant oysters, but of course it's all the same, though really how you came to know about Nicholas—'

'We happened to be just talking about him, mama; that was it.'

'You never seem to me to be talking about anything else, Kate, and upon my word I am quite surprised at your being so very thoughtless. You can find subjects enough to talk about sometimes, and when you know how important it is to keep up Miss Bray's spirits, and interest her, and all that, it really is quite extraordinary to me what can induce you to keep on prose, prose, prose, din, din, din, everlastingly, upon the same theme. You are a very kind nurse, Kate, and a very good one, and I know you mean very well; but I will say this—that if it wasn't for me, I really don't know what would become of Miss Bray's spirits, and so I tell the doctor every day. He says he wonders how I sustain my own, and I am sure I very often wonder myself how I can contrive to keep up as I do. Of course it's an exertion, but still, when I know how much depends upon me in this house, I am obliged to make it. There's nothing praiseworthy in that, but it's necessary, and I do it.'

With that, Mrs. Nickleby would draw up a chair, and for some three-quarters of an hour run through a great variety of distracting topics in the most distracting manner possible; tearing herself away, at length, on the plea that she must now go and amuse Nicholas while he took his supper. After a preliminary raising of his spirits with the information that she considered the patient decidedly worse, she would further cheer him up by relating how dull, listless, and low-spirited Miss Bray was, because Kate foolishly talked about nothing else but him and family matters."

!!!!!!!!!

OP posts:
Suttonmum1 · 24/10/2014 12:29

Ever been camping? That's a holiday they won't be muscling in on. I'd be finding somewhere with that's offering extra low deposits and booking a European campsite for 10 days. Can be cancelled when you arrange something better and gets her off your back.

Come to that loads of European hotels offer cancellations up to the day before. Just book something, anything.

outofcontrol2014 · 24/10/2014 12:33

I like camping! Sadly, it's out of the question because of my gynae problems. Without totally grossing everyone out with TMI, it would be unmanageable right now. Maybe once I have my op!

OP posts:
cingolimama · 24/10/2014 12:48

OP, I've been reading this thread, gripped. FWIW I think you are handling this with grace and sensitivity - more than your IL's deserve.

Agree with everyone here. Do NOT relent. Go for a few days only. Given the family history of your DH and the stress/guilt/burden/possible mental health triggers, it may be up to YOU (rather than DH) to deal with this effectively - sorry but it sounds as if his parents have really done a number on him and know how to push his buttons.

One clever poster suggested writing to them - this has its advantages, in that you lay your cards on the table, and there would be no badgering, selective deafness, insisting from ILs.

However you decide to deal with them, we are all behind you. Good luck!

rookiemater · 24/10/2014 13:01

I would get DH to email them something like:

" Hello, hope you are both well. I know you have been talking to outofcontrol2014 about a family holiday. We'd certainly be up for a 4 night break

loopylou9 · 24/10/2014 13:08

outofcontrol I wasn't there when she announced it to DH, in fact I never am, she only ever discusses things with DH. Probably because she knows that DH will just go along with whatever she says but I have a mind of my own. MIL and I have never had an argument and we 'get on' but it's clear that I am in the way and she'd rather have her son and DGC to herself.
I think the conversation went something on the lines of: ''have you and loopylou thought about a beach wedding? Because I want to take us all to Florida next year and I thought a beach wedding would be nice''
We had already booked our wedding for this year at the time so not only was she planning our 2015 holiday but she was suggesting we change our wedding plans. I think DH's reply was something like ''oh yes that would be nice, I'll suggest it to her''.
Nothing else has been said about it since but I wouldn't be surprised if she just announces that she's booked it, she has done that several times before but it's been for smaller holidays in the past.

diddl · 24/10/2014 13:13

TBH, it all sounds so difficult that I would just say no!

2rebecca · 24/10/2014 13:14

I think she has to realise that you aren't all 1 big family, her children have grown up and formed their own family units and a family holiday for you would involve different people to your husband. She hasn't got a small nuclear family any more.
I suspect I'd have got stroppier than you with this and said "no "we" don't need a family holiday you want a holiday with your now adult children and their families but this isn't possible for us so if you want us to come you'll have to accept it will be for less than a week. I don't want to feel bullied by you about what we do with our holiday time"
I would be adamant about how long you will go for and stick to it. She will realise eventually bullying doesn't help. My son has only just left for uni but i wouldn't tell him how he now spends his holiday time.
She sounds very unpleasant and bullying. Not sure I'd want to spend any holiday time with someone with that attitude and I suspect I'd tell her that. If no-one tells bullies their behaviour is bullying they maybe don't think about the way their behaviour is perceived.

2rebecca · 24/10/2014 13:19

re loubylou I would tell MIL that you prefer to choose your own holidays and will all not be going if she tries interfering in your holiday arrangements and can she only book holidays for herself.
My holidays have to be arranged with colleagues so if anyone did book anything for me I'd just tell them I can't get the week off work.
I don't see anyone trying this more than once as they would waste alot of money.