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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Pool Changing Room.

187 replies

Roobix04 · 10/10/2014 11:54

Ok not sure if I even have an issue just wanted to see what other people think.
So yesterday me and my 17 yo dsis were at the pool with 6mo dd and a woman came into the changing room with her 2 sons. One was about 6 and the other was 10/11. They got changed in a cubicle but with the curtain open. I was across from them wearing just a towel trying to dry my hair and not flash anyone and my dsis was supposed to be getting out of her bikini while making sure my dd didn't roll off the table. The thing is the older boy was obviously reaching the stage where he's getting curious about women's bodies which is fine but it meant he kept looking at us. We both felt a little uncomfortable about exposing ourselves to him. I'm definitely not implying he was a pervert or anything but I think he's too young to be exposed to my slightly saggy body. I think at that age he's old enough to go into the men's on his own. So were we being unreasonable or was that a little weird?

OP posts:
saintlyjimjams · 12/10/2014 12:51

And I still reckon the '10/11 year old' in the OP was a lot younger as most boys wouldn't be seen dead in the ladies by age 11

Sallyingforth · 12/10/2014 13:00

Why are children being taught to be afraid or ashamed of seeing other peoples' bodies? Have the world have breasts and half have penises.

For all my childhood and adolescent years I changed for swimming amongst men and women of all ages, and often swam naked amongst them too. It hasn't done me or them any harm. And very few men or women are actually perverts.

I'll probably get flamed for this.

getherelucy · 12/10/2014 13:09

In a ladies changing room the needs of an 11-year-old girl trump the needs of a 9/10 year old boy.

KoalaDownUnder · 12/10/2014 13:15

Sallyingforth, people are not 'ashamed or afraid' of seeing other people's naked bodies. I'm not sure where you're getting that from.

Rightly or wrongly, people in our society are modest about their own naked bodies being seen. It's a cultural norm. People don't swim nude at the beach (except special nude beaches), they don't walk down the street with their breasts hanging out. They don't wander through the living room naked while guests are sitting there.

Of course people are shy about complete strangers seeing them naked. And that goes double for strangers of the opposite gender!

getherelucy · 12/10/2014 13:17

Sally what a fucking disgusting thing to say.

Of course it's normal to be uncomfortable changing in front of strangers of the opposite sex! Stop trying to turn this around to try and make people who wouldn't like it the weird ones.

You might be okay with it but I'm willing to bet that you're in the minority. Good for you if you don't have a problem with it. Other people do and there's nothing weird or wrong with that.

Can you honestly not think of one reason why people wouldn't want to change in front of people of the opposite sex? Not issues with abuse in the past, culture, religion...nothing like that crossed your mind?

getherelucy · 12/10/2014 13:20

There are many reasons why people may need to change with members of the opposite sex

Not in a ladies changing room, no. In a ladies (do I really need to keep emphasizing that word before it gets through?) changing room the needs of the women/girls trump the needs of any males.

Nonie241419 · 12/10/2014 13:28

My 9 year old DS gets changed on his own in the men's changing rooms and my almost 8 year old will be joining him soon, as per the leisure centre rules. I have talked both through the pants rules and told them to change in cubicles. I do think that, barring special circumstances, separate changing from the age of 8 is reasonable to ask.

strawberrypickle · 12/10/2014 13:41

Sallyingforth really?! Hmm

Sallyingforth · 12/10/2014 13:43

Yes I expected that.

The thing about 'modesty' Koala is that it is an artificial and variable concept that is taught, not inherent.
In Victorian times, modesty meant wearing a dress that covered the ankles. Now, modesty means wearing scraps of material artfully cut to cover the nipples and pudenda, often being designed to actually emphasise and accentuate the parts that have to be covered.

Having never been told that showing or seeing bodies was 'immodest', I can tell you that there is nothing less stimulating or exciting that being surrounded by unclothed bodies. Hence, no hangups or perversions. Bodies are boring!

gethelucy, I would have replied equally to you, but your swearing puts me off. It's not modest :(

KoalaDownUnder · 12/10/2014 13:53

The thing about 'modesty' Koala is that it is an artificial and variable concept that is taught, not inherent.

Yeah, no kidding. That's why I said 'In our society'. I don't need a sociology lesson; I've lived and worked in cultures where a bare midriff is considering far more titillating and immodest than bare breasts.

It's wonderful that you have 'no hangups or perversions', but the average 13-year-old girl living in our society is not comfortable being seen naked by boys her age. I didn't create it, I just live in it.

getherelucy · 12/10/2014 13:57

So what about people who have been abused or raped who might have problems been seen undressed in front of strangers of the opposite sex? Do you think they should just get over it?

What about religion or culture which might make people be unhappy getting changed in front of people of the opposite sex?

Should my sister just "get over" the things that trigger her memories of her rape (including changing in front of males)? Because obviously it's just that easy to get over something like that overnight because someone points out how silly you're being...

moaningminnie2 · 12/10/2014 13:57

'How do we know the child was 10/11? I knew a child at 8 who was taller than my then 11 year old.'

..because an 11 yr old looks different in the face to an 8 yr old usually

SauvignonBlanche · 12/10/2014 14:03

It hasn't done me any harm

I do despise this narrow-minded attitude. Sad It's awful that people can't see out out of their own personal experience.

FelixTitling · 12/10/2014 15:01

moaning. My ds looks like an 11 yr old 'in the face' (I get what you mean, his adult teeth have come through early), but acts like a 5 yr old.

People haven't got a value how old he is.

FelixTitling · 12/10/2014 15:02

Value = clue

Andrewofgg · 12/10/2014 15:36

This thread reminds me of an incident now forty years ago when I was at law college near Chester. Between intensive classroom work in the morning and intensive swotting in the afternoon I liked to go into town for a swim. There was a training pool and an adult pool, but only one male and female changing area; the men’s was bench-and-locker and I assume the women’s was the same. If there was a class or half-class of boys when I was changing I just stayed as far from them as I could.

So there I was one morning vigorously towelling my back when a female teacher sailed in calling Come on, you boys, hurry up until I yelled Madam, get out! when she turned round and ran for it.

The little buggers charming lads loved it, of course, and told me I should complain, and gave me her name, and the name of the school, and the number of the class, and they were third-year junior, I don’t know what that that is in new money but they were ten, rising eleven.

And one of them, a bit quieter than the others, said It’s not just you, Sir, she has no business coming in when we are changing, we are too old and quite apart from liking the Sir I agreed with him.

I would have complained but she met me in the hall outside and apologised. Said she had no idea that anyone was using the adult pool at that time, and boys needed chivvying or they would take for ever. I accepted her apology but said she could count on me being there any day until the end of the school year (in fact I was on a six month course but I saw no reason to tell her that) and she and any other female teacher at her school would have to stay out. If the boys were slow that was her problem.

I saw her and her class many more times – but she never did it again!

Sallyingforth · 12/10/2014 15:40

koala
I've lived and worked in cultures where a bare midriff is considering far more titillating and immodest than bare breasts.
Yes, that's exactly my point. There is nothing special about the particular body parts that we currently think should be hidden.

but the average 13-year-old girl living in our society is not comfortable being seen naked by boys her age.
Because she has been taught to be embarrassed about parts of her body. If she had been shown from birth that it was wrong to bare her hands in public, your 13-year-old would want a private cubicle to change her gloves.

I didn't create it, I just live in it.
You didn't create a world where homophobia and racism are common, but you don't have to accept them.

lucy
Should my sister just "get over" the things that trigger her memories of her rape
Why did you put "get over" in quotes? I didn't use those words, neither did I talk about rape. Please stick to what I said, if you want to criticise.

If someone has suffered abuse they deserve every consideration, and hopefully there will always be somewhere private for anyone with a special need like that. But that is an entirely separate issue and doesn't justify teaching every child to be embarrassed over what the current generation defines as immodest.

Lagoonablue · 12/10/2014 15:42

Think 10/11 too old for womens changing room personally.

Lagoonablue · 12/10/2014 15:46

Btw why wouldn't you let a 10year old get changed in the male changing rooms? I went swimming alone at 10!

getherelucy · 12/10/2014 15:52

If someone has suffered abuse they deserve every consideration

Exactly and that's why having single sex changing rooms is so important.

getherelucy · 12/10/2014 15:54

Why did you put "get over" in quotes? I didn't use those words, neither did I talk about rape. Please stick to what I said, if you want to criticise.

Well you've missed the point completely there.

ProudAS · 12/10/2014 16:13

At the pool today two boys used the communal female changing room with their mum (if one of them was under 8 then he was extremely tall for his age). I don't think it was a case of her wanting to keep an eye on them since she then went in the sauna and left the boys to run amock (chasing each other on the poolside, playing with safety equipment etc).

saintlyjimjams · 12/10/2014 16:21

Ds2 at 11 looked like an 8 year old in the face. If you lined him & the 8 year old up together then most would have said the 8 year old was older. It's impossible to tell how old a child is IMO unless they're toddlers or entering puberty. My 12 year old was cast as a 6 year old this year because he still looks very boyish.

I still reckon no 11 year old would be seen dead in the ladies (SN excepted) & so the child was you get than the OP has guessed.

Sparrow8 · 12/10/2014 16:28

YANBU. Here in Australia WA, most children have to get changed in their sex changing rooms from the age of 6. Children go swimming with school from age 5 and boys go to the men's changing rooms, girls to the ladies and must be able to get changed alone. My Ds would not want to come into the ladies anyway!

HermioneWeasley · 12/10/2014 16:34

Why didn't you close the curtain the their cubicle?