to think a social worker is not needed here

[SoddingCupcakes]

Where to start!

A few months ago DH smoked cannabis. I never approved but he refused to quit. The compromise was that he only ever smoked it in the evenings once the kids were in bed and he always went outside to do so, never in the home. He stuck to this. I was still not happy, but at least it didn't effect the kids.

Or so I thought.

One morning I was woken by banging on the door. I got out of bed and answered - it was two police officers. They explained that they had received an anon phonecall saying someone from this flat smoked cannabis outside. I said it wasn't me. They asked if it was DH and I said I didn't know. They said they were going to leave it for now, but if there were any more reports they would have to do a search of the flat (we live in a massionatte). I said okay, no problem.

I was shuck up after their visit (I have a history of anxiety & depression but am doing well at the mo). I told DH he stops taking cannabis NOW or I am kicking him out. He was shuck up too and agreed, he would quit the cannabis.

Fast forward several months.

A random knock on the door. This time, an 'outreach worker' from the local children's centre. She said I had been referred from my health visitor (WTF?!) because of the cannabis and 'home conditions'. She had a look around, and I'm not going to lie, there was food on the table from breakfast (it was 12noon, I hadn't wiped it yet). She pointed it out, and I said I'd sort it. She then mentioned the cannabis and I broke into tears. I said, DH says he doesn't take cannabis any more. That he used to months ago. I even got her to speak to him on the phone. She seemed to accept this as she didn't mention it again. She asked if I needed help with cleaning, I said no, DH and I are going to blitz the place at the weekend (100% true and we did). She said okay, no further action, she'll just write her report and that'll be the end of it (her words).

One month later - today - I received a phone call - from a social worker, saying she is visiting in the morning. The outreached worker had made a referral, and apparently I knew about this (WTF?) I asked the social worker why she was visiting and she said home conditions and cannabis use.

My children are healthy and meeting their milestones.
The house is 'clean' (albeit we do have damp in the bathroom).
My daughter has 100% attendance at school.
Neither child has behavioural issues.
I am no longer depressed (have greatly reduced anti depressants with GP approval).
DH really did give up cannabis months ago as promised (mutual friends have confirmed this and there is no longer the 'stink' and he hasn't been stoned).

Yet up and down the country, children are being abused and social workers' case loads are heaving. Why are they wasting their time with this?

What do I need to do to end 'professional' involvement in my law-abiding life?

I know this is AIBU but please bare in mind my history of anxiety & depression and the fact that I literally had the social worker phonecall an hour ago and am still shaking.

Advice and support much appreciated.

They're not going to take the kids away on the facts you've told us, but butting out is unlikely as well.

Take yourself out of it and think about reading about a family where the mother has MH issues, the house is in need of a serious clean (and while there's no bright line between acceptable and needs referral on this, it doesn't help your case) and the father is a habitual cannabis user, smoking outside and annoying the neighbours. Maybe he's stopped, maybe he hasn't (I believe you but you'll need to prove it to the social workers.) but for however long the neighbours were complaining about it it meant the parents responsible for the kids were either stoned (your DH) or had mental health issues. And it sounds like this was the case for a while. They're not going to jut leave it to one spot check to see if you've tidied and that this time your DH isn't stoned. They'll have talked to your rightfully annoyed and worried neighbours and know how long this went on for. Also, bearing in mind that on first contact you said you didn't know who was smoking cannabis, but now admit you did, they have proof you won't be honest about it so you need to overcome that obstacle as well. Because these are people who've heard loads and loads and loads of people swear they'll stop whatever they're doing and lie over and over again.

But it doesn't have to be a nightmare. You can use it to keep your husband from smoking cannabis, and to be honest if they have a few follow ups and there's nothing really there they'll go away. But bear in mind that if there are further issues you'll be "known to social services" and thus they'll be back pretty quick. And it won't be just about the kids. You've got MH issues - they want to make sure you are well also.

The OPs past mental health has nothing to do with them coming though?

They are coming for 'cannabis and house stuff'. Many, many, MANY mothers suffer or have suffered with MH issues, it's hardly a SS issue unless she is lying in bed, not feeding her DC and they are missing school to care for her. She has already said the DC have 100% attendance. And I don't think the school can or will refer to SS without speaking with the family first.

of course they can, and do! You don't seem to know much about the process and you aren't helping OP by downplaying the seriousness here.

God some of the replays here are so bloody patronising. So what if "but for however long the neighbours were complaining about it it meant the parents responsible for the kids were either stoned (your DH) or had mental health issues"? Disregarding the 'stoned' parent lots of single mothers have mental health problems! The neighbours wouldn't know if they did and if the DC are safe and happy who's bloody business is it?

What is the threshold for cleanliness for SW involvement, anyone know?

I would imagine that varies very much from social worker to social worker. Although in my experience it would have to be pretty bad.

I was visited by a social worker recently following a completely unfounded referral. At the time my house was a complete tip, I acknowledge this myself. I am disabled and had a small baby and was severely sleep deprived with no support. You could write your name in the dust, the kitchen sink and counters were full of pots and you couldn't move in the hall for clutter.

The social worker had no concerns because DS's room where he plays was spotless, his clothes were all washed and dried (although in a giant heap waiting to be folded and put away), his bed was made and his bottles were all washed and sterilised. There was no rubbish anywhere, just stuff, and the kitchen mess was a day or two old so not ideal but not completely festering either.

Regarding the school informing SS before the parents, both primary and play schools of all my DC have always reiterated they talk to parents about concerns before escalating to other agencies.

Was going to say same as monkeyfacegrace

Hanselsdad I don't think you're helping by minimising cannabis use in a household where there have been MH issues and the house "needed a blitz". Taken together, those three factors would be a cause for concern.

At the same time social workers dont tend to get involved for cannabis use- as mentioned above it's relatively common and they simply wouldn't be able to deal with it as a CP issue.

I think there are 2 possibilities- there is far more to this you haven't grasped or there is some mistake/ malicious reporting. If there is nothing else I'm sure it could be resolved next visit.

I can't believe that breakfast dishes on the table is any of their business.

That's how I felt.

Why are you accepting your DH smoking cannabis, does it matter that it's outside??

Did you mean to word this in the present-tense? He doesn't smoke it now. I accepted it in the past because it was either that or leave him, and he is actually a very good hands-on father, a real co-parent. I made the decision. I figured the kids would be WORSE off losing their hands-on father than him smoking cannabis outside away from their awareness. Shoot me now.

Thanks for the advice BackInTheGame That's very useful. How likely are they to leave us alone if all is well when they visit?

They wouldn't be involved in your life if your dh didn't take illegal drugs

He doesn't. He stopped. How can we prove this?

Also, if their beef is with DH, why do they keep phoning ME?

It sounds as though someone nearby (a neighbour?) has been reporting your Dh for continued cannabis use.

Yes, it'll be a neighbour, but no idea which (we generally don't talk). It's horrible living so close to people and not knowing who did it.

Thank goodness Social Services are listening to concerns and taking some action.

And what 'action' would that be?

I have seen some shockingly dirty and untidy houses in my time

Can you describe the kinds of things you mean?

but those people were never referred to SS by their HV or anyone else, because everything else as it should be

So, do you think the combination of dirty table and cannabis-rumour has caused SW involvement? So one alone wouldn't have done so?

Are you sure your DH has knocked the cannabis completely on the head?

As sure as I can be. Can they do a random drugs test on him? I would like this, then with solid evidence, they can back off.

They aren't there to ruin people, they are there to protect children.

But while they are spending time inspecting my table, they could be out at an abused child's home.

Do not under any circumstances ring anyone complaining about being referred.

I was thinking of submitting a letter of complaint about not being informed of any referrals (outreach worker said she was referred by HV - I had no idea of this; then SW said she was referred by outreach worker - I had no idea of this either). Surely this warrents complaint?

You need to make sure the children have clean, dry beds with bedlinen on. Hoovered and mopped floors, no animal mess, left over food or dirty nappies. No work tools, carpet gripper rods exposed, dead flies, that sort of thing.
Make sure the kitchen is clean, dishes are washed, there is clean cups and cutlery.
Make sure the cupboards and fridge have food in.
Bleach the bath and toilet and sink, soap by the sink and a hand towel.

Thanks so much for that list. Everything on the list is already done. The list describes the current state of my home.

*OP, is there bags of rubbish around the house? Do the DC have clean warm beds? Toothbrushes? Clean clothes? Adaquete food? I'd the house warm and are there bathing facilities?

Mop floors before hand, make beds, clean toilets, kitchen sides.*

Yes, all that is currently the state of my home.

this visit is not going to be because of a referral a month ago

Why is it?I'm so confused. I asked the SW and she said cannabis use and home conditions.

Sw have strict deadlines to work to for an initial assessment so they can not leave a referral for a month before checking into things. It is entirely possible that someone else has reported you to social services for example one of your neighbours or even more than one. It is a fine line between who needs help and who is ok sometimes people don't realise how much improvement a little bit of help can bring for example putting you in touch with support for your dh to stay off cannabis, support for you in handling your mh better, support in getting any housing problems sorted. Go into the meeting with the attitude of asking what they can do for you too.

I don't think I am minimising anything. As mentioned a few times on this thread cannabis use is common and not generally concerning to SS. The mental health issues are a red herring, the outreach worker didn't know about them and SS aren't visiting because of them! I'd be interested to know what the OP says about the reality of her house..

OP, can you answer the above questions re your house?

And I agree with Altinkum that if you have a history of depression and your DH has a history of taking drugs and the various agencies are aware of these two facts, then it's right and that someone should follow this up and make sure everything is ok.

The outreach worker followed this up and now SW. Is this really necessary. That was my Q. Is being depressed a cause for SW? Damn. What a message to send to people (don't let anyone know you're depressed or SW could visit).

My ex smoked weed, he openly admitted it to SW (they turned up due to a referral from women's aid after I called them regarding ex) the SW told ex they view the use of cannabis much as they do the use of alcohol (depends on the circs and amounts being used i suppose) they really didn't seem to have an issue with it.

Maybe it's a postcode lottery?

OP, you will generally find a hysterical approach to cannabis use on MN (and no I don't smoke or allow anyone to smoke around my DC, I also don't think it should be legalised). People are unable to make a real world distinction between cannabis and other illegal drugs.

If you are telling the truth about your home (and I think you are) they invite SS in! You have nothing to hide, MH issues are very common so don't be ashamed or try to hide/lie about them.

No OP, being depressed in isolation would not be a cuase for SS unless it was impacting on your care of your children. However they are combining it with a complaint from neighbour(s) regarding cannabis use AND your house being a mess when an outreach worker came round.

If you can't see that may be a cause for concern for SS then I wonder if there is anything else you are not picking up on? - sorry, I know that sounds like I'm berating you, I don't mean to.

My own mother suffered from PND. She hid all the knives in the house as she had intrusive thoughts and was terrified she would hurt us. She had these thoughts and other similar ones about smothering etc for years. In the end she went to the GP and asked to be reported to SS! SS and her GP said it was so very common among mothers and they certainly do not remove DC because of depression/anxiety.

Try not to worry.

Give the house a good going over, and be very amiable to them when they come.

You're confused to their involvement, yo can tell them that.

Be open and honest and they will leave you alone.

Good luck!

Surely this warrents complaint?

I think the time to complain is after the situation has been resolved and social services have no further concerns. If you complain now-you may raise a concern that you could be obstructive/secretive/manipulative, all of which social services hate.

It is almost more important to be cooperative than it is to have your life on track. Because from their point of view- if your not cooperating how can they know things are OK.

What I did:

I turned up to meet the social worker, looking smart and acting relaxed, smiley, happy to help and answer questions.

I wrote letters enclosing all the information I had been asked for- and signed off by inviting them to contact me if they needed any other info

I was never anything other than pleasant and cooperative even though I was shitting it

The social worker closed the case.

After that had happened, I got the social worker to write a letter stating that there were no child protection concerns. I got that letter placed on my own and my DS's medical records...

Then I wrote to the hospital who had made the referral and made a complaint.

If you were wrongly charged with a crime- a solicitor would advise you to resolve the criminal case before pursuing a case against the police. Its very much the same here. You can't resolve anything else while child protection concerns are live. you must resolve these first.

About 12 years ago someone I knew (then h, now exhusband, ex partner) maliciously reported me to ss. The first thing I knew of it was when I got a phone call from ss saying they had just been to my dds primary school to have a discussion with her. I knew of nothing before this meeting.
Apparently it's so parents can't have a chance to 'coach' their kids.

Has anybody seen or spoken to your dcs?

For the record, as soon as they had spoken to my dd the case was closed and I've had no further involvement with ss as they could tell that everything was ok and the report made was certainly malicious.

It's incredibly scary dealing with these people but my advice would be to cooperate fully. If you've got nothing to hide then they won't be able to find anything. Ss do not expect people to live in show homes so just make sure that your house is clean and relatively tidy.

If kids were removed because their homes were a bit untidy mine would've been removed years ago, kids=mess!

Hanselsdad you are so missing the point. It doesn't matter what anyone thinks about pot: the referral has been made.

Um the baby in the oven...the dad was also drunk on a whole bottle of whiskey

The mum whose DD drunk the fertiliser was guilty of neglect. Cannabis fertiliser is normal garden fertiliser with another label. She was neglectful in leaving anything poisonous where a small child could get hold of it.

You are quoting situations where real harm has been done which have a tenuous link to cannabis. The dad wasn't driving, or putting his kid in the oven, or leaving poisonous substances around for the DC to get hold of. He was outside the home smoking. Outside! Away from his DC. The DC who's mother was inside caring for them.

I agree with the others who have said that you must cooperated and engage with them. The social worker who came round to mine pretty much said that my willingness to engage with him was reassurance to him that if I did need help I'd be the first one knocking on his door. Therefore he felt he could trust me when I said I didn't.

I also told him how angry I was at being referred, not at him as I knew he was duty bound to look into it, but at the person who had referred me. I was also quite tearful through our very brief meeting. The whole process is just so terrifying. Again he wasn't bothered by this, in fact when I apologised for being such a wreck he said he'd be more worried if I wasn't bothered.