To not be sure if a 17 year old boy can be in the right headspace to train as a midwife?

[Boysclothes]

I know a few male midwives, all older guys who are nurse converted and are all great. No problem with it at all.

However a friends son wants to be in a caring profession and she has asked me to have a chat with him about becoming a midwife, direct entry so training from next September. She knows a bit about it and thinks the autonomy/quicker progression/pay etc makes it more desirable than being a nurse.

So, I'm just musing here as I know the admissions tutors will make the decision they see fit, but I'm not sure if a just turned 18 year old lad could cope with or make sense of midwifery. It's just so very female isn't it? And if he hasn't got much experience of women, it just seems a bit... I dunno.... Inappropriate, possibly?

I'm going to tell him about the realities of the job but what are your thoughts?

To clarify, I'm not going to tell him it's not appropriate or anything else, I'll just tell him about the job and answer questions. I trust the admissions tutor and my colleagues to admit him to the course or not and pass or fail him as appropriate. I'm just musing here.

I want women. Wise old women, who've birthed and have world experience

Is that a serious comment?

I'm with Sidge. This thread is incredible is saddening and ignores the varied experiences of all medical students.

Get a grip ladies... by the time he is assisting in childbirth he will be trained... and if it is only his gender that is bothering you SHAME ON YOU!

it depnds on him, his way and his nature. a good, caring male midwife would be fine for me

and lets face it when things get hairy its a load of men coming in!!! at least for me. I did not even care

epidural, male
ventouse, male
emergency when heartbeat went down, about 10 men!!!

I don't fine the answers here sad boysclothes

I consider my fanny to be exempt from the Equality Act- and quite understandably so do plenty of other women. Noone's right to do any job trumps my right to say who gets to touch me intimately.

It's the age that's a problem for me, rather than the sex of the midwife.
Bit like talking to a counsellor about mental health issues, I just wouldn't have the confidence in them that I required.

It's the case in the two trusts I work across parallax, students from SG and UCL. None start patient contact until 4th year and obstetrics is in 5th year.

What are the qualities that make a good midwife? Are they specific to women?

I consider my fanny to be exempt from the Equality Act- and quite understandably so do plenty of other women. Noone's right to do any job trumps my right to say who gets to touch me intimately.

Well said.

We had med students that were straight out of high school in one unit I was in. Far too young.

And what if he is excellent? But does not fall into your pattern of what the genders should do?

You do realise that medical students start at 17 sometimes? Surely his training will route out any problems, just as with female entrants.

Maybe you think male doctors should not be allowed to treat gynological problems and deliver babies as well?

Give him a chance to prove himself first before condemning him!

aparallel - Medical students see patients in routine appointments before they are 21. I have had them sit in on some of mine. Totally different to have a student sit in a clinical room while a Dr explains the procedure you are going to have next week, to have a student there when you are giving birth. The two are not comparable.

yes it was a serious comment. I dont think they should train midwives straight from school.

So Saucyjack- if you were undergoing a colonoscopy you'd insist on a female nurse/doctor?

Beetlemilk - Some women do and that is their right to do so.

Nomama, I'm not disagreeing with your viewpoint but just to say he will be hands on immediately. Once he's witnessed five births he will be assisting and may be performing VEs and breastfeeding support prior to that. By Christmas he'll be delivering probably. You're thrown in quite quickly!

However, I'm not so concerned about the physical stuff. It's more his state of mind. Will he be able to provide the support etc? Will he giggle? Etc etc.f course teenage girls could be exactly the same.

If we want an equal society for women then it has to work both ways. Women can't say they want the same opportunities in life as men while trying to deny men the same thing.

Of course this lad should be given the opportunity to do midwifery if that's what he wants to do, just as a woman should be able to be a urologist if that's what she wants to do.

It's fine to not want students present while your pregnancy or labour is being dealt with by professionals, but I don't think the NHS should be under any obligation to provide a female midwife just because someone doesn't want a fully trained, qualified and competent male. If you want to specify the sex of your healthcare professional, then pay privately for one.

I first witnessed a birth aged 12.

It was take your daughter to work day and being a midwife, my mum took me to the labour ward. The mother in question was in full possession of the facts and gave permission. Do you know what i did? I stood back out of the way and watched in shocked silence at what i was seeing. And came to the conclusion i definitely didnt want to be a midwife.

I reckon any immature teen (male or female) would learn pretty quickly whether they did actuay want to be at the business end of childbirth. They would either decide nope, not for them or they would realise it's a pretty serious deal and if they are really keen they'll have to mature pretty sharp like and shape up. Amongst the midwives i know, silly teen immaturity would not be tolerated.

So men can insist on a male doctor I suppose?

Interesting. dh has undergone years of his arse being prodded and poked due to a serious illness, but I don't think this would ever have occurred to him. He was just glad to be having treatment.

Excellent point Dua. You realise pretty quickly that this shit is real. Although I have had students who still think it's all a huge joke in second year. I'm known as a total bitch mentor amongst some of the cohort btw.

yes it was a serious comment. I dont think they should train midwives straight from school.

Not straight from school is very different from what you said. You said only old women who have given birth and have world experience (whatever that means). So midwives need to have given birth, gone through menopause and travelled the world?

Sorry Boys that just isn't the case.

In fact, George's explicitly mentions early patient contact in their prospectus eg

www.sgul.ac.uk/courses/undergraduate/mbbs5

UCL also have a 'patient contact course' within Years 1 & 2, as do Imperial & Barts.

Granted these are not full time clinical placements, and are mainly likely to involve talking rather than examination etc but the GMC have pretty much forced the introduction of early patient contact.

So Saucyjack- if you were undergoing a colonoscopy you'd insist on a female nurse/doctor?

Yes, of course. Next question?

Of course women and men should have the right to see a same sex Dr if they wish. Equal opportunities does not mean to hell with what patients want.

Ok, I hadn't realised. When we get them on the ward they tell us they start clinical in year 4.