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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to think children shouldn't choose if they have contact with NRP if no welfare concerns?

353 replies

HopeYoureHappy · 23/07/2014 13:46

DP has a contact order regarding his 7 and 9 year old children. Their mum has constantly breached it and uses the reason that it's the childrens choice - for example - DS doesn't want phone contact, he's busy on the iPad, DD has decided she'd rather go to her friends party and she wants me to take her, DS doesn't want to come because you don't have a paddling pool and he thinks he'll get too hot Confused

Sometimes it's both DC that don't come, sometimes just one. Last time DD 'didn't feel likeit' and when DS ddiscussed a planned and paid for day out next week, he asked if DD was coming and DP replied 'no idea, she'll be the one missing out if she chooses not to.' AIBU to think that this is the wrong attitude and that the DC shouldn't be able to choose whether they come for contact any more than they can choose whether or not to go to school? They are always happy here and there's no welfare concerns but they are very much manipulated by their mum who bribes them to stay ('we could've gone to Thorpe park, but you're going to your dad's...) and tells them she'll ne lonely without them.

DP seems resigned to this messing around but they are back in court for review next month and I think he should ask the judge to ensure that DSC mum must adhere to the order and not put the DC in the middle. What do you think?

OP posts:
SlicedAndDiced · 23/07/2014 14:35

Op is the only narrator we have in this case Fide.

If you don't trust any ops word for it, getting into any thread on men's quite pointless.

SlicedAndDiced · 23/07/2014 14:35

Ahem

Mn lol not men

EarthWindFire · 23/07/2014 14:36

I can't imagine a loving mother manipulating her kids into not knowing their dad if he was a decent loving father.

I can see what you are saying, however it does happen, especially where there has been an acrimonious split.

Not all fathers are angels of course not but neither are mothers and I don't like this view of it is always the NRPs fault and the RP never does anything wrong.

crazykat · 23/07/2014 14:36

The op has said its going back to court.

Op head over to the step parent boards, all you'll get in here is criticism.

It doesn't matter that you're not married to your DP, it is your business as it affects you, your dd, your coming twins and your relationship. It does sound like your DPs ex is interfering with contact, if she wants to take her DCs to theme parks etc. then she could do that on 'her' weekends. The way she's doing it on the weekends the children should be with you and your DP suggests its on purpose to stop them wanting to see him.

If your DP wasn't bothered about seeing his DCs he wouldn't be going to court over it.

Step parents and NRPs are damned if they do and damned if they don't. If you'd posted that your DP is taking his DCs to theme parks etc every access weekend he'd be shot down for being a Disney dad and told he should do normal thing like swimming and bike rides. Yet its perfectly fine for his ex to play Disney mum on his access weekends?

The step parenting board is much better for advice on issues like this as there are lots of people in similar circumstances.

TurboWithAKick · 23/07/2014 14:37

op so what do you propose happens now??

hoobypickypicky · 23/07/2014 14:37

I'm another who hates the term "bio mum" in this context. She isn't the DC's "bio mum" she's their mother, the only one they've got or ever will have.

Aeroflotgirl · 23/07/2014 14:37

From what op has said mum is manipulating the chikdren, as they do want to see their dad, that is unfair. I hope when your dp goes back to court they go heavy on her.

Pyjamaramadrama · 23/07/2014 14:37

If their mum is genuinely bribing and manipulating them so that they are losing out on a relationship with their dad then that is surely emotionally abusive on some level. So dad needs to step in.

brdgrl · 23/07/2014 14:38

I am a stepmum, but I have no dog in this particular race, as there is no ex and contact is irrelevant - the DSC live with us 100% of the time.

However, what that has made even more abundantly clear to me, frankly, is that children do not normally, and I think should not, have the option of refusing contact with a parent (in the absence of welfare concerns as presumed here). In an 'intact' family, relations between children and parents can go through awful periods, and I suspect many, many people (especially as teenagers) would happily refuse contact with a parent if they were allowed to do so.

My DSS, at this moment in time, would quite possibly refuse contact with his dad, at the moment, if he had somewhere else to go. Thankfully, he doesn't, and this will pass, and they will be back to a loving relationship once more - because regular, even sulky and resentful, contact between children and adults is essential for the relationship to progress.

Where a child is allowed to refuse contact, there is no opportunity for things to change, to grow, to resolve. Teens that don't get on with a parent may well, under conditions of regular contact, develop a very different relationship with the parent in the fullness of time. But those who are allowed to avoid contact are unnaturally separated and suspended in the relationship at its lowest point. How dreadful for those children, deprived of the opportunity to have a relationship that grows, changes, matures.

LadySybilLikesCake · 23/07/2014 14:38

My 15 year old hasn't seen his father for 4 years. His father used to see him for an hour or two every 18 months - 3 years. He was going to see him a few years ago, and ds asked me whether his father would give him any money. I replied, saying he should see someone because he wants to spend time with them, not because he may or may not get money, and ds decided not to (I expect his father didn't help himself by shouting and swearing in ds's face the time before and taking no interest in ds otherwise).

A parent should make them understand self worth, and to look past the material things. Children can be bought, sadly.

hoobypickypicky · 23/07/2014 14:39

The dad, yes, pyjama. Not the dad's girlfriend.

Aeroflotgirl · 23/07/2014 14:39

I even heard of a Mumsnetter having residency reversed if she prevented contact with her ds dad who abuses him physically and emotionally

catsmother · 23/07/2014 14:39

I don't see how the OP is interfering ... she's come on to an anonymous forum to voice her frustration about something that affects her whole family and actually, she's concerned for her stepchildren if she believes they're being manipulated .... I don't know how many times I have to say this but if any child is being made to feel it's "wrong" to see the other parent, e.g. because mummy will be lonely, then that's verging on emotional abuse. At the end of the day OP can't take her partner's ex to court, her voice won't be listened to in the public domain and I agree in that respect it's an issue between the parents but meanwhile she's perfectly entitled to seek support for herself and to discuss the issue with her partner. Why should she ignore what's going on ? ... how would that look to him if he has all these worries and is dead scared of "losing" his kids if she doesn't offer him some moral support ?

Yes - I agree that many kids have been brought up without fathers for a variety of reasons and have turned out fine so yes, if you're splitting hairs, a paternal relationship may not be essential. But where a dad is around, and hasn't disappeared, and wants to be involved with his own kids then where there are no welfare concerns that relationship should be encouraged and should be considered pretty damn important.

I can also appreciate why kids might not want to see their dad if they're emotionally abusive - obviously - but there's been no hint in anything the OP's written to suggest this is the case.

MyFairyKing · 23/07/2014 14:40

They say they want to come. Do they really?! Children from these sorts of families often say what they think people want to hear. I know I did as a child. I voted with my feet as soon as I was old enough.

brdgrl · 23/07/2014 14:40

I can't imagine a loving mother manipulating her kids into not knowing their dad if he was a decent loving father.

It is very hard to imagine. I am seeing it at the moment with a friend of my DD and her mother. I can't wrap my head around it, and it is heartbreaking...but it's there.

FidelineAndBombazine · 23/07/2014 14:40

I'm another who hates the term "bio mum" in this context. She isn't the DC's "bio mum" she's their mother, the only one they've got or ever will have.

Jeez. Who said 'bio mum'? What a twat.

Pyjama speaks a lot of sense.

Bonsoir · 23/07/2014 14:42

Yes, if there is a court order for contact neither the mother nor the children should be breaching it. The court order is there for a purpose.

Writerwannabe83 · 23/07/2014 14:42

FWIW op - I think you are getting a very hard time. The dad should not miss out on contact with his children because either their mother is manipulating them or because they "just don't feel like it".

I imagine kids don't feel like doing a lot of stuff but that doesn't mean they should have the final choice. Would people stop sending their children to school if one day the child decided they didn't feel like going?

I feel quite sorry for the dad and it totally is your business too seeing as you are in a committed relationship and part of the children's family.

As has been said, AIBU is probably not the best place to discuss your worries about this.

I hope things get sorted Thanks

FidelineAndBombazine · 23/07/2014 14:44

Op is the only narrator we have in this case Fide.

If you don't trust any ops word for it, getting into any thread on men's quite pointless.

Well Sliced some posters post in a straightforward way and some don't.

I am seeing little snide flourishes and tiny clues as to possible unreliability.

SlicedAndDiced · 23/07/2014 14:44

I did.

Relax it's just a term. To be honest it's out of date and I slip into it sometimes.

However that's just because I'm surrounded by an awful lot of complicated families, mothers that adopt etc.that term makes it easier to explain what I mean sometimes in some situations.

It's better than the endless questions of 'so do you mean their biological mum or their adoptive mum' when I've previously just said mum as an example.

I don't really care if you think I'm a twat Grin

ElephantsNeverForgive · 23/07/2014 14:45

It certainly isn't always the mum's fault.

DDs DF (Y6) used to have blazing rows with her mother at the school gate about going to her Dad's.

She loved her Dad, but it's really hard when your 11 and you've just been asked to a sleepover or party and you know it's Dad's weekend.

EarthWindFire · 23/07/2014 14:45

Yes, if there is a court order for contact neither the mother nor the children should be breaching it. The court order is there for a purpose.

This ^. I know if a few cases recently were RPs have been given stern warnings by judges for not following contact orders or agreeing a different day if not convenient for whatever reason.

Writerwannabe83 · 23/07/2014 14:45

Also, moms do bad mouth the dad's to he children, even if the dad's are great fathers.

I was bought up by my mom but saw my dad regularly. My mom never missed a chance to try and make underhanded and negative comments about my dad to me. I have no idea why but for some reason she wanted us (me and my sister) to think badly of him.

trufflehunterthebadger · 23/07/2014 14:46

Because I don't bully my kids into doing inessential things that the y don't want to do! Is that matter of fact enough for you?

So a relationship with their father is inessential for you then, hooby is it ? Nice

TestingTestingWonTooFree · 23/07/2014 14:46

I'm amazed at the level of hostility towards the OP from some posters on this thread. It's very sad that the children are getting caught in the middle of their parents. OP YANBU.