The question of inheritance

[tiggerkid]

Hi all,

Not sure if this is really the right thread for this but can't think of any other to discuss the topic of inheritance.

Recently my sister-in-law and her husband announced that she is pregnant with her 3rd child and because they need a bigger house to accommodate, they will be moving into my MIL's house, who has a much larger property. Naturally, they understand that this move will raise the issue of inheritance, so they decided to sell their house and give us a small proportion of the value of their house on the grounds that they will still need money to look after MIL and renovate her house to their taste. The house is currently decorated to MIL's taste and, apart from the fact that it's cosmetically old fashioned, there is absolutely nothing wrong with it. MIL is certainly happy with it the way it is because she's been doing various work on and off in keeping with her own taste.

At present, MIL doesn't need any looking after. She is in excellent health and is of sound mind, so as far as we are concerned, they only want to move in to extend their living space so to speak. Because they live nearer MIL, they've had plenty of opportunity to talk her into this idea and convince her that it will be paradise on Earth once they all move in together.

While I completely understand and agree that the party looking after ageing parent absolutely needs a bigger share of any inheritance, am I being unreasonable believing that 1) it should be a discussion involving all parties affected by such a decision 2) any agreed value of our share of inheritance should be based on the value of MIL's property rather than the smaller house that my sister-in-law is seeking to move out of? and 3) the question of keeping large sums of money to redecorate the house to sister-in-law's taste should be out of the question because it has nothing to do with looking after ageing parents?

Sorry for the long message but I just find it so unfair that my sis-in-law just decided to move into a bigger house to improve her living conditions and keep 80% of the value of their own house to do whatever they want to do without ever discussing it with us or giving us any opportunity to speak about this. MIL has only mentioned it to us in passing and doesn't want to discuss this any further because she wants to avoid confrontation. The only thing she said was: well you, guys, are financially better off than they are anyway, which made me even more annoyed and upset. If there is a reason why we are financially better off, it is because my husband and I work our butts off while my sister-in-law sits on her backside playing on Facebook all day long. It feels like MIL believes that we need to be punished and penalised for our hard work while my sister-in-law needs to be rewarded for her Facebook efforts.

I know in the end it is MIL's decision and, unfortunately, one that appears to be driven by my sister-in-law exploiting MIL's fear of being left alone in her old age. Although I doubt that we can do much to change the situation, I am struggling to keep discussing this with my husband as I don't want to upset him but I do need some emotional support and understanding, hence this post. Thank you, all.

Accepting money would imply you have accepted the proposal...

No it doesn't but if mil is happy with the arrangement, you should keep out of it. Your dh can upset everyone by stating that he doesn't approve but where will it get him? Resentment and ill feeling is inevitable - you need to distance yourself from this. It will not end happily. These things never do. Equal doesn't necessarily mean fair only works if everyone involved is ok with it - not generally the case in rl! You cannot change other people's behaviour, you can only change how it affects you! Distance will make the whole scenario less stressful.

I agree - distance yourself from the situation and leave them all to it. Like others have said, stop contributing for holidays. Explain that now money from SIL and BIL's house is being released to care for MIL and renovate the home, you will assume that it will be used to fund all repairs/ maintenance etc and all holidays.

If you want to send small gifts, buy and post them yourself and leave SIL out of that loop.

I can see your hurt, but like others have said, they are all adults and free to do as they wish. It doesn't sound like a situation that will end happily for them. I would use the money you will save on paying for holidays and repairs to either pay off your own mortgage sooner or pay for holidays for your own family. In that way the situation is visibly helping you and your family financially and may help to lessen the hurt a bit.

MostWicked

It is a moral duty on a parent to not abrogate responsibility in circumstances such as this. MIL has absolutely no duty to leave anyone anything (beyond whatever we would all call moral), I am in no way saying she must do this or that with her money.

I AM saying she mustn't do nothing. Look what happens. I have seen this happen so, so many times. It's chickenshit behaviour on the part of the deceased and causes so many problems for more than just the immediately following generation. Very often, the end result is also the very opposite of what the deceased would have wanted themselves.

It seems that your MIL intends to disinherit your DH in favour of her other son. Most parents don't announce this sort of this quite so blatantly, for the good reason that it's likely to piss off one child and wreck your relationship with them. And that child's relationship with the preferred child.

MIL gets to decide who gets her money, sure, but it's not a decision made in a vacuum, and she needs to be prepared for the fallout.

DH should make his feelings very, very clear, and he should do it quickly. I don't think MIL has thought this one through. She's going to destroy her relationship with one son and could leave herself very vulnerable indeed in her future care.

Haven't read the entire thread and frankly I am not interested in the fairness of the inheritance, but I do worry about your MIL. What if she finds that living with her daughter and her family is uncongenial? Or the daughter decides that living with her mother is not for her?

SIL and MIL both sound as bad as each other and I would say you're well out of it OP, except that if it all goes pear shaped it could be you & your husband who are then asked to help out.

What happens if they fall out? Or SIL & husband divorce? Imagine if it didn't work out (for whatever reason), SIL's family stayed in the house & you and DH were required to stump up for a new home for MIL. Bugger that!

They need to draw up a contract setting out how to exit the arrangements and how various financial contributions will be recognised.It sounds like a recipe for disaster tbh.

I'm of the view that you can't expect an inheritance but I'd be very pissed off on my DH's behalf if this arrangement was carried out with no regard for him. He really needs to toughen up with them though.

OK this might all be a bit of a soap opera storyline, but what is to say that SILs plan isn't to move in, redecorate, convince MIL to put the house in her and her DH's names, then she divorces her DH, boots nowExDH and his mother out on the street and makes a claim for ownership and residency of the house since she'll be the one caring for three children?

It might be far fetched, but stranger things have happened.

Yanbu your legal right is to a proportion of you mils house not your sil .if when the time comes she dosent give the corrects estimated value from the house it is not entirly fair.you may instead wish to oen a part of the house as an asset.if you dont raise your issue you wont get anything.

Also if mil gives the house to your sil and dies within 7 years I think inheritance tax will have to be paid if the house is over the threshold.

I know two similiar examples of this.
One of the families got fed up with the Mum, made her feel completely surplus to requirements, madde her stay in her bedroom all day and eventually she managed to get sheltered accommodation.

The other family had a 65 year old Nan living with them for 20 years. She completely changed the dynamics of the family. She sort of made their lives uncomfortable in many ways.

We are about to do a similar thing as your SIL, OP.

My elderly mother signed over her house to me 10 years ago, we are about to buy a much larger property that we all can share. My mother does need physical, practical and emotional support , my sister has lived abroad for 40 years, and doesn't know the details of the arrangement.
A parent can gift a property to whoever she wishes. it is not an inheritance until someone dies.

OP I suggest you casually mention that you have been contributing to her holidays. If she seems surprised by this, you can question whether or not she wants to go into this arrangement with someone who has already lied about money to her.

Agree OP your DH's proportion of any gift at this stage should be based on 50% of MiL's house not a lesser percentage of BiL and SiL's lesser house.

If it were my situation I would ensure DH raises all the issues with everyone present, making explicit reference to being effectively disinherited (as well as to her potential issues down the road). Your MiL doesn't sound particularly sophisticated and BiL and SiL might have coaxed her into thinking their proposal was adequate compensation for your DH.
I wouldn't just walk away at this stage, get it all out so if you have to walk away, no-one will be in any doubt why.

combust22, if your mother is in need of physical, practical and emotional support, it's already not the same thing. My MIL isn't in need of any support at present. She is an independent woman in good health. The only people, who need support at this point, are my SIL and BIL, who require a larger house for themselves and 3 children as well as childcare that is more than likely to also be free if they move in. My MIL already cooks their meals (at her own expense by the way). She has adequate savings to provide for her own needs as well as small pension.

We also haven't been living abroad for 40 years and the question of inheritance would have never come up in our situation if MIL didn't bring it up as such.

Perhaps, I am missing something or misunderstand your post but it doesn't seem to be a similar situation.

Seen your updates, it looks like there is some preferences treatment going on between the 2 brothers. It also looks like your SIL us using it big way, your bil will see it as normal and your mil too.

I think your sj really needs to put things on the table. Not just the house thing but the overall attitude ie expecting him to pay for the hols, repairs on the house etc, expecting to be happy but a tiny portion of the 'inheritance' but to carry on contributing to the care if your mil (I am in no doubt that SIL and bil will come and ask for help if your mil needs any specialist help/care/care home).

Now your mil can do whatever she wants with her money. But she certainly isn't entitled. To regular help wo ever saying thank you. And not are your SIL and bil entitled to some financial help when the whole idea is for them to care for your mil in exchange if the house.

I would make the boundaries very clear on what you are prepare to accept or not, to them but to yourself too. Having seen that happening in my family, and tbh nit being clear about boundaries has led to a lot of resentment from everyone and the brothers and sisters not really talking to each other anymore. And to a lesser quality of care for my gran. No one won anything there.

combust doing that sort of arrangement wo talking to the other parties that could be involved is always leading to heartache.
So unless you already don't speak to your sister and bith your mum and you have decided she isn't a welcome member if the family, then what you have done isn't nice or fair.

Fwiw all my family lives abroad and they all have done that for years, prob as much as your sister has. It has never stopped anyone to stay in touch, not to be close not to be involved with the care if my gran. It's actually my parents who supported the most if the cost of her care even though they were the ones living the further away, for the longest time and had the less support from her over the years....

If your MIL has savings and a pension, why on earth are you paying towards house repairs and holidays for her??!! When she doesn't even regularly remember your ds's birthday? What an awful situation you're in OP. My PILs are a bit of a nightmare in numerous ways and DH is a bit 'whatever' over some of the things they've done.

It's been hugely frustrating over the years when he's refused to take them to task over various things which would have been far better coming from him as their son than me as their DIL. So I sympathise - it's your DH who ought to be tackling this situation.

If your MIL has savings and a pension, why on earth are you paying towards house repairs and holidays for her??!!

She is a very tight lady, who doesn't like spending money :)

OP, Get your dH to write a difficult letter now with bullet points spelling things out as they stand.

they may fall out, things may get shitty but they are going to get really shitty after her death arnt they ....

it will be even more bitter as mil will be dead.

all the sailient points, they live mort free then get full inheritance, have i done soemthing to offend you,

be open about the money spent on holidays from joint account,

put it nicely, factually and non emotionally.

ask her if this is what she really wants.

if she does fine, you konw where you stand and can start to adjust NOW....if she doesnt ....she can think on things...

you literally have nothng to loose

SweetSummerSweetPea I know this is starting to sound like a soap opera and I am in a bit of a disbelief myself sometimes bit MIL is an uneducated and illiterate woman, so any letters I write will need to be read to her by SIL, BIL or both. And she made it clear she doesn't want a conversation on the topic anymore!

omg combust

i have to say, i much prefer the attitude in, say, France, where you can't disinherit family

Is there a third party, you could ask to read out a letter to her through.

Cant you go round and say forcefully your going to sit and listen to this letter, its the least you can do?

how come she is illiterate?

how come she is illiterate? - no idea TBH. All she can do is sign her name. Can't read at all, which is another situation hugely convenient for SIL and BIL!