to think a lot of parents seem to let their kids have rather too much say in things

[SEmyarse]

Is it just the people that i'm surrounded by? Or am I out of step and these examples are normal and acceptable? Of course, people can do what they like with their own kids, but this all seems crazy to me.

1. A lady I occasionally work with at a care agency was moaning about how many shifts she's doing at the moment. I was sympathising that money was tight, and then she revealed that although they're struggling to pay the bills, she is prioritising buying her daughter the princess cabin bed she'd demanded. The daughter is 3. She says she's exhausted with all the demands but since she's asked for it, then she must find a way to get it. She just wishes her daughter wasn't so demanding!

2. A lad in dd1's year started at a secondary school right out of area in September requiring 3 bus journeys to get there. She said he'd chosen it. I said she was fantastic facilitating this, but it wasn't for me and dd1 would be going locally. I've bumped into her again now, and she was bemoaning the fact that they're struggling to sell the house because her son has said he's fed up with the buses and wants to live locally to the school. She doesn't want to move.

3. We lift share with dd2's friend for brownies. She hadn't been at school for 2 days so I assumed she would be too ill to go and prepared to take dd2 myself. But then they appeared. I said I thought she was ill, and her mum said she'd complained of a pain in her nose and didn't want to go to school. She also asked to see a doctor, and although her mum didn't think it necessary she took her. She then decided that she WAS well enough for brownies, which seems mad to me if she was deemed too ill for school.

Is it just me that wouldn't put up with this stuff? I've got some time for the negotiation school of parenting, but in all these cases I would be telling the child what's what.

I think we have got caught up thinking we are on different sides of the argument when in fact we all agree.

Choices are good for children and teach responsibility but only if you teach them how to make good choices

That doesn't mean letting them make every decision regardless of the consequences and then trying to fit other things round about them.

Example 1 in the original post s exactly what I mean, struggling to pay for the basics of life which are needed to give the child a safe and secure home but prioritising buying them a nonessential big ticket item.

As I already said I know people buying iPads but having the bailiff at their door because they haven't paid their council tax. Because the child wanted one.

andsmile Sun 11-May-14 12:21:42
*May I ask here...+

Have any of you pointed out how 'better off' your children are in a sensitive way to help them to value what they have?

I sometimes feel a little frustrated as he has a hell of a lot more than DH and I did growing up - holidays, a car, activities, nice house (but too small apparently!)

My children are aware because it is obvious. Most if their friends come from very average homes, a few come from homes where there is quite acute poverty.

They also have regular contact with our families, both my DH and I have relatives that have never worked or are in low paid work.

One of my children works regularly in a homeless shelter. Our stepson had a year out in which he travelled doing voluntary work in parts of the developing world.

I do sometimes worry that our children have it too easy. Both my husband and I come from very poor rather unpleasant backgrounds from which we were desperate to escape. That have us a huge incentive to work hard. I think our children lack the grit that we have, that may not be a bad thing.

We have told our older children that they will inherit nothing, that isn't true but I don't want them labb

I don't want them planning their life assuming that they have a chunk of money coming their way or that we will bail them out if they make irresponsible choices.

andsmile all of our children were given a free choice with regards to the grammar. They all chose to reject it for different reasons. They are quite competitive so dd1 actually took the test because she wanted to know if she could get in.

I think they have been influenced by the fact that I teach in the local comp/ secondary modern. Our stepson went to the comp/ secondary modern and is now at a top university. One of ours is very politically aware and thought grammar schools were wrong, so chose not to go. She is also very creative and could see that the comp offered better facilities Our stepson is sporty and wanted the sports facilities that the comp offered . He also knew a lot of unhappy children at the grammar. dd2 was probably borderline grammar. She felt that she did not fit in with the grammar crowd and she is a bit more wayward so definitely benefits from a stronger pastoral environment and having me to keep an eye on her. She also wanted to be close to home do she could get home for the horses and have time with them in the morning,

There is nowt posh about our home, it is big but certainly not posh.

They describe a house up the road as posh because they have live in staff, I agree with them there! Dd2 thought another house was posh because they don't have any televisions - we must have about 10 TVs!

The grammar/comp thing is interesting to me because we don't have that here in Scotland.

It's either the local secondary, the roman catholic school or a private school.

Grammar schools are not that common in England.

Although reading MN you would think they were.

LaQueen I suspect your children might think my house is posh , I have a built in TV in my bathroom.

lechers thanks for taking the time to post such a detailed reply. I have to admit we live in the catchment area of an oustanding comp. He is in the nearest feeder school which it has good relations with not just in yr6 for transition. On paper the school is fine but i used to work there and have issues about him going there. can you or anyone tell me AIBU? the thought me going there for parents evening gives me the shudders. I feel so conflicted about this. DS seems to be quite academic, not into sports. Bit geeky tbh, in a nice way. I have asked him if he thinks getting ready for 'that test' is a good thing or not and he said yes because it gives us more choice. I asked how he would feel if he passed but didnt get a place...I genuinely want to make sure I am not pushing even if i have that conflict.

laqueen I get asked about playrooms and trampolines - apparently these are posh in his mind. He thinks the big houses down the road are posh because of their size (but they are 1 to 3million! and way bigger than ours)

I read that about the books too, its not about the amount of how/if they are even read it is an association of the household 'valuing education'. I agree it would be negligible. I would supplement with tutoring if needed.

Add message | Report | Message poster LaQueenOfTheMay Mon 12-May-14 09:18:27
and I would really encourage your DS to take the 11+ - because, like he says, it then gives him choices which won't ever come his way again.

I think that really does depend. Our stepson went to the comp/ secondary modern. He left with straight A and A* grades , went on school trips to China, Africa, Spain, France, Belgium and Iceland. He is an accomplished sailor and rugby player . He took a year out to travel and is now at Cambridge. I cannot see what the grammar school could have given him in addition to this. My eldest son ended up at the grammar school and has done well academically - but that would have happened anywhere. He struggled in English and the grammar school could not care less, to the extent that my son was getting help from my colleagues at the comp/ secondary modern. He has had very few of the opportunities that my stepson had. He also has SEN and we have ended up paying for private provision because the school's provision was so dismal. I am currently in a legal battle with the school so this does not happen again. My eldest daughter is having a similar rich experience at the secondary modern/ comp. She is probably not Oxbridge material but will go to a top university or a school of performing arts. She is going to Africa the year after next, New York this year, she regularly goes to The theatre in London and is becoming an impressive dancer and actress and is being nurtured in a way that the grammar school never would - while stretching her academically.

Aha yes phil obviously nearer the time we will be talking about the ethos/offers each school has. Like I said he is quite academic so Im leaning towards the Grammar.

it sounds like you have got your children where they are best suited this is key. it depends on how good the range of schools are near you are whether you opt for private/grammar.

FWIW I think DD will be an entirely different kettle of fish..well from what Ive seen so far. it is like looking after a tiger cub.

Listen to your children ALL the time and consult them on EVERYTHING, you hear me? .

Seriously though, I think they should have a say to a degree but also it depends on the age/intelligence/type of decision it is etc. and how the child's attitude is about it, for example if it's demanding then no. But where to live, how many DC's to have etc. are decisions only adults should really make. Children can't be as far-seeing and know about consequences if bills and so on aren't paid. But it does make you wonder if, as some other posters have pointed out, the adults are the ones who wanted it and it's just easier to say it's "for the kids".

You have to laugh dont you mybaby my DS had a little strop because I wouldnt let him go on mincraft 5mins before school run...

'for the kids' satisfying parenting IMO - 'well I bought you xyz...' its laxish in a way, is it easier to buy that new console game than take them swimming or for a walk, or god forbid play with them.

I remember being very unhappy that my parents downsized when I was 18 years old. I had to move from a house with a large bedroom, to one with a tiny one. My aprents view was that I wouldn't be there much longer, so they were doing what was best for them. They were right, and i was being selfish.

I can understand why you'd consult with a child over choice of secondary school and allow their preference to be an important factor in your decision as thst impinges directly pn them. but on what car and what house to buy or rent? Really?

A child cannot possibly grasp the implications of thhose decisions or come to a conclusion based on a full appreciation of the facts. How much will the rent/mortgage/payment be each month, can we afford it? What will that mean we can't do as a consequence? What kind of state of repair is the car/house in?, How much will it cost to put right?Will the car/house be big enough if we have that third child we talked about? What VED band is the car in? What is fuel economy like?

To put children in a position of making choices they can't fully understand is dangerous and actually unfair on the children.

DS is 4 and already gets to make lots of choices- only fairly trivial at the minute, where to go for lunch, do we go the the park or the beach after school, does he want to go to daycare or stay home for today.

i think letting children make choices from an early age is very important, and explaining the pros and cons of their choices helps them to understand the results they will get.

ie. DS wants to go to the park, ok we can go to the park but that means we don't have time to visit Nana and Granda after, if we go to the beach we can also visit.

Allowing them to think for themselves is really important and there is a big difference between allowing a child to make a choice, to allowing a child to make a demand.

The boy who chose to go to school further away, made the choice knowing he would have to travel to get there- fine. But wanting his parents to sell their home and move to suit him is a demand- it is the parents' choice to give into that demand and if they give in then they have to deal with the end result.