SIL issue..

[DaenerysTargaryensDragonBaby]

My DB and SIL came to visit us yesterday. We don't see much of them anymore, as they live 300 miles away.

SIL was annoying me, and I feel really upset about it today.

First she commented on my maternity leave plans (currently 31 weeks pg) and was shocked at how little time I am taking off. She was quite bare faced about it; open mouth, 'oh my goodness' type comments.

Then, she remarked on some of the items we have in the nursery. We don't know the gender of the baby, so we have things that are blue, pink, green, white.. all sorts. She kept picking things up and saying 'this will be wasted if it's a boy/girl then' and such. I said, as it is a baby it won't know the difference, and she just laughed at me and said 'oh I forgot you have that whole gender thing going on' (I have done campaign work for let toys be toys).

She was then just irritating me the whole time, probably because I was annoyed anyway... so probably irrationally.

When they left, I was a bit pissed off and spoke to DH about it, and then forgot it. But I have woken up today really upset about the whole situation.

So as not to drip feed.. we have a bit of a strange relationship anyway. We used to be quite close, but a couple of years ago she decided to distance herself from us (and my parents) and we barely, barely see her. In fact, this was the first time since Christmas, and Christmas was the first time since last April that we had seen her. My brother brings their DC's up often. SIL harbours resentment that I am close with my parents (and subsequently, they are closer to my DC than hers) and she seems to have an issue with me generally. I am not sure why, and DB always says nothing is wrong when asked.

AIBU to be so upset today? Should I do anything, or just let it go?

tobias I am thinking you might be right. It's odd that he won't tell me, but there must be a reason.

I agree - people don't just change overnight.

I wonder, if it is my parents. I just wonder why she would hold that against me? It makes little sense.

Which brings me right back to the point

How did this occur? Why did no one ask your SIL? Why did no one reach out and have that conversation?
I would suggest that there is a reason for that.

If everything was as good as you think or believe previously how did this occur without a quick and open conversation?

I would suggest that you might all find it hard to have a conversation with your SIL and DB where you listen.
I would hazard a guess that you might find it hard to see the part you could have played in the relationship breakdown.
It seems as though it has been easier to blame the outsider, SIL, rather than sorting the situation out.

I feels to me that you aren't showing a great deal of empathy toward your SIL and her feelings regarding losing her parents etc and perhaps regarding to being expected to be part of your brother's family.
Many many people would rather have a quiet Christmas than a huge gathering.

Perhaps you SIL feels strongly about the type of gifts her children receive. Maybe your parents could have discussed the gift they were considering before buying it? Perhaps your SIL feels that this was very rude and inappropriate?

Well since your parents see their GC & son quite often then I'm not sure what your mum is getting upset about tbh.

SIL is within her rights to not send her kids away with their GPs, even if they have been before!

In your first post you said your dc we're closer because of geography, if you feel that then chances are DB and SIL do as well. I would not want my DC's to be put in that position and your SIL must have felt very confident in her DH that she could make that decision.

Ronald well, it happened over time. The first time someone cancels or can't make it to something, you don't have a big long conversation. You accept it, it happens all the time!

Then it got more and more.. I wondered what was wrong, I asked, she said nothing, just busy. Then, as time passed, it got strange.

They maybe would prefer a quiet christmas every year. She/they coudl just say that though?

And, parents didn't buy the gift without discussing it. They didn't buy it for their children at all, because when they offered, SIL said no. So, no rudeness or inappropriateness there.

Though personally, I give gifts almost 100% of the time without consulting the parent of the child. I didn't realise this could be considered rude?

diddl because we don't see them as much as we used to. And we didn't see them at Christmas for 2 years in a row.

And of course she is 'within her rights' to not allow them to go on the holiday. But it was odd. And my parents were upset about it. They didn't tell her, or DB, of course. But they were upset. They love those children and wanted to spend time with them.

cobain put the DC's in what situation?

I've seen this with one of my SILs - the small slights she notices and the minor grudges have built up over the years and relations have slowly deteriorated.

Everyone is still civil and luckily there are family members who she still gets on very well with (unlike your SIL).

The 'crimes' my parents have committed over the years in her eyes are ludicrous really, though I do keep in mind that I probably see it more from my parents' PoV. But to her, they are really important things that exemplify how little they think of her and how badly they treat her.

Everything feels like a competition for her and with numerous grandchildren, my parents have to be so careful not to treat any of them differently in any way.

My parents are lovely and pretty bewildered by the whole thing. But SIL has built up this world view now and I can't see anything shaking it tbh. In her case it is all about insecurity and the effects of a very difficult childhood. As well as the fact that I think many of us struggle with in-laws simply because they are just DIFFERENT. They don't have the same routines or rituals on xmas day, they hang stockings in the wrong place, they put the wrong sauces out with meals, etc etc ad infinitum.

It could be that someone has said something.

It could be that it was fun & exciting to be part of a family at first, having none of her own, but now the novelty has worn off!

Going back to OP, I can't decide if she was being rude or just expressing her opinion tbh.

And I would have thought she felt fairly comfortable to be able to say what she did.

Hmm. That is interesting.

I wonder if she sees things as a competition? That might make sense actually. A lot of it is bewildering. I am not alone in this thinking.

My parents have tried really hard to treat them all the same too, but she has caused this to not be the case, which is sad.

If they were holding you up as the shining light of virtue/motherhood/daughter and at the same time making her feel uncomfortable or annoyed. It wouldn't take much for her to see you as part and parcel of the same problem she had with your parents.

diddl well, we have been in each others lives for nearly 9 years, so she is obviously comfortable to speak her mind.

It was rude, there is no maybe about it. I was actually taken aback.

Maybe it is that. The family was exciting at first, or she enjoyed it, and now has had enough.

Seems a shame.

I guess I should forget about her and move past it. See DB and the children whenever we can, and get on like that. Forget about mending bridges.

It's cognitive dissonance (possibly the wrong use of that phrase but hey, sounds good).

I could say something to my SIL, then my father could say exactly the same sentence to her. She would have no problem with me, but my father saying it will be found to have insulted her in some way - there will be a hidden meaning or implication that she will pull out. And that is simply because he said it.

It doesn't matter what they do or say know, there will always be offence taken. This is just the person she is sadly.

If they were holding you up as the shining light of virtue/motherhood/daughter

This could not be further from the truth! Ha!

They tease me. They talk about how awful I was as a teenager (I really was something else). They certainly do not treat me as you have explained!

cognitive dissonance can work both ways

perhaps the OP is sensitised to her SIL and therefore feels anything she says more keenly. Perhaps she is waiting to be offended?

I would guess that your brother and SIL have reasons that they feel are very real for the relationships that currently exist within the family.
Asking them and being prepared for the answers is something that I'm unsure you are prepared for in any way.

You SIL didn't turn down a gift for the children that your parents had bought, she turned down the offer of them taking on holiday. She accepted the bicycles that they bought instead. That sounds fine.

She came to the giant Christmas gathering and came to your house 8 weeks later. Given that you are 300 miles apart that sounds like a fair effort.

Perhaps you could try to start looking at things from a neutral pov. It is clear that you cannot put yourself in your SIL's shoes...but the shift to a neutral pov might help eventually mend the situation.

I think you SIL said her piece about some things that were close to your heart. I think you were offended and have conflated all these other issues together. She disagrees with you. Maybe she utterly dislikes you.
Either openly discuss it or move on.

Finally...I still think YABU

I think it would be a shame to give up since you used to get on.

Maybe meet half way for a day/afternoon out?

If she didn't enjoy Christmas, I wonder if she built up the visit yesterday too much.

Got too anxious about it & over compensated by being rude?

I've always found my ILs difficult to get on with & when we visited the first time after moving away I was actually dreading it.

Built it up into something worse than meeting them for the first time!

Maybe she hates family christmas (and played a good pretending game for the first 5 years). But,the children bloody love it, as does DB. So, she should bite the bullet every other year. I would.

But you aren't her. It's not for you to dictate what is right for her and her family. I started this thread agreeing with you, but as it has gone on you have sounded more and more intense.

As for her refusing your parent's offer of a holiday, for all you know her Dc's might have cone home complaining about the holiday. But again it's not actually any of your business.

Its also interesting that your DB is made to sound like an innocent bystander, when actually he must agree with her to some extent as he is also not seeing you that often.

I actually sympathize with the SIL in this situation. DH's family have made it clear that I am not considered part of the family, I am expected to attend family events and go along with whatever they want, but I am not considered to be part of the family and I am simultaneously not considered to be my own person with my own opinions. I am expected to conform. I did for a while, now I have more or less cut myself off from them because I can't be bothered any more. Things did get worse after children arrived, not right away, but over time as it became clear who the favourites were (hint: not us!). DH and I have had many arguments over this because he could not see it for a long time, but he sees it now and has also cut himself off from them slightly. Not because I asked him to but because he doesn't like the way I've been treated.

If anyone from his family asked us what the problem is we would say nothing! Because, what's the point? They can't see it, we can't even really explain it without it sounding petty (and it really is the accumulation of years of petty things) so we just distance ourselves.

If MIL wanted to take all the grandchildren on holiday we would decline. Bad enough she has favourites, I don't want her playing favourites when my children have nobody there to stand up for them.

This was the first time where she has been openly rude to me. Though this could be because we haven't seen much of her.

Then honestly? I think you should be blunt and confront. From all you have said there is clearly a problem and it's upsetting you and your parents and it's time they stopped fobbing you off.

Either it's something that can be fixed if only you all knew what, or it can't. And then you can stop tiptoeing around her. And your brother needs to be honest with you all too,

passafist my parents don't play favourites. Honestly. And she has always, absolutely, entirely been made to feel like part of the family. There is very little conforming to be done in our family! We couldn't all be more different.

And maybe her and DB are liars, but they have said how much the children loved the previous holidays our parents have taken them on. And the children have asked to go again.

I know her declining the holiday caused an argument between her and DB.

And Ronald she did turn it down, and it was rude and ungrateful. Personally, if I didn't want my children to go for whatever reason, I would say 'thank you, that is so kind, but we won't be able to accept' or something along those lines. Instead, she text my mum saying 'no thanks, but they would like new bikes' (verbatim). My parents then offered to get them bikes as well as the trip, and she said no.

Other, neutral people have commented on her change in behaviour. I am not overly sensitised to it.

I'm not intense in real life, in the least! This is a thread on the internet. I am responding to questions, as they are posed.

Anyway, I will take the advice given and let it go. I will just make more effort to see DB and DN's when she isn't available, see them anyway. Up until now we've been trying to rearrange things so we can see them all, we just won't bother, she is obviously not interested.

DB asked me not to mention the holiday that our parents have taken my DS on, because the DN's were so upset that they couldn't go, so SIL told them the GP's had changed their mind and no one was going.

Breaks my heart, to be honest.

When was the holiday that her kids didn't go on?

Does it stem from that?

She was maybe rude to mention the bikes, but I don't see how she was ungrateful to refuse the holiday.

It really sounds like this is not about you but your parents and you have been caught in the crossfire. It maybe because you are so close to your parents that nobody will tell you what has upset SIL. DB is obviously torn but his loyalty is to his DW.

I totally agree with Ronald, I hope you are able to consider her advice.

Usual MN thing of everyone (ok not everyone) DETERMINED to make it the op's fault in some way.

OP, if I were you, given that you were once good friends and that in light of what she is doing you have nothing to lose, I would force the issue. I would see her face to face and say, "Right, you have to tell me what's going on, I don't mind what it is, but the situation is driving me mad, particularly as you deny anything is wrong. You owe it to me to speak honestly."